[Centzon Totochtin]

RodeoRanch, on 02 June 2010 - 03:08 AM, said:

I didn't get the job. Again. Dammit.But hope springs ever eternal and a position might be open come the start of next year. So that leaves my fall open for traveling. Time to meet more Malaznites and abuse their hospitality!

I believe you owe us a visit here

We have some lovely floors, couches and pubs

[worry]

I dunno. A dozen doesn't seem so high a number for anyone seeking to hook up rather than be monogamous. 12 weekends is less than 3 months time. The abortions aren't too crazy either, except it might be a sign of irresponsibility in terms of birth control...but of course, the dudes are equally responsible for that. At least half of all sexually active young adults (I think by 25) have contracted at least one STD. Of course knowing someone in real life is different from hearing about them on the internet, and that might be the key there, but the quote above isn't particularly damning or even abnormal (not average mind you, but not in the realms of absurdity either). She may certainly have been victimized and acting out, but what's sexual activity, experience, or even aggression, got to do with innocence? If she's not innocent, what is she? Guilty?

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

If you think it is healthy behavior for a 16 year old of either gender to sleep with 12 people in 3 months, then we have differing ideas of what defines healthy. You do realize that if that is a steady rate, she will have slept with almost 150 people by the time she graduates? That number is ridiculous. (for either gender)

Look, I don't know the girl in question. All I'm going on in the description Apt gave me. Even if I'm wrong in that specific case, which is certainly possible, that doesn't invalidate the entire premise that certain types of behavior can indicate abuse. This is accepted as a given by psychologists. It doesn't even only apply to sexual behavior.
Kids internalize their treatment, and then often act out in the same manner. This is why sexually abused kids act out sexually or abuse others, why physically abused kids beat up others or grow up to beat their own kids, why mentally abused kids become bullies, why kids treated kindly tend to be kind themselves.

Obviously, this is not an absolute, 100% rule. Not every kid who gets beat will beat their kids. NOt every kid from a good home will turn out nice. Not every kid who is molested will act out sexually. It's crazy to completely ignore the correlation though.

[worry]

Well, all of that is true more or less. I'm not arguing with the hypothetical, or even this specific girl. Just the description. I don't think 12 is that high a number. I was just suggesting how fast it can rack up. But 12 in a year is just one person per month. It's really not that difficult, or even that weird, to get into the hundreds while still a fairly young adult. Some folks tend towards monogamy, and others don't. If a girl is sexually active with her boyfriend, they might have sex several times a week, hundreds of times per year. A girl hooking up every weekend, with different partners or whatever, will have had sex around 52 times. Neither number is that big a deal, just as raw data. Only further knowledge would tell us if it's healthy or unhealthy behavior, but it isn't inherently one or the other.

[Tsundoku]

teholbeddict, on 02 June 2010 - 05:59 AM, said:

... because girls tend to be a bit more mature than guys. I mean I know when I was fifteen or sixteen most of the boys my age were complete and utter hormone ridden morons.

And teenage girls aren't? The inexplicable "frothing at the loins" popularity of Twilight and Justin Bieber tends to contradict the above statement.

Although I'd tend to put the age range not from 15-16, but more like 15-45.

This post has been edited by Sombra: 02 June 2010 - 09:38 AM

[MTS]

The reason we're all hormone-ridden morons in our late teens is because that's our sexual peak - women don't hit it until late twenties, IIRC. So I guess Sombra's right lol.

[teholbeddict]

Raymond Luxury Yacht, on 02 June 2010 - 07:20 AM, said:

teholbeddict, on 02 June 2010 - 05:59 AM, said:

I'm sorry but this whole opinion that girls who have sex, enjoy having sex, become sexually active at the age of sixteen or have more than one partner while in their teens somehow equals them having been sexually abused or makes them promiscuous has got to go. It's a load of bull. This kind of double standard makes me sick. How many male teenagers are sexually active by that age or have had more than one partner by the time they exit their teens, I'm betting a good number. Never mind betting, I guarantee it. Somehow that's studly and manly but if it's a female then there's got to be something wrong with her. Because we all know ( in the minds of morons) girls don't like sex, we don't have the same sex drives as men and heaven forbid we do then we're automatically in the slut category or there has to be something in our past that forces us to act that way.

Not to mention alot of teen girls or even women prefer to date slightly older males because girls tend to be a bit more mature than guys. I mean I know when I was fifteen or sixteen most of the boys my age were complete and utter hormone ridden morons. This is not to say that a sixteen year old and a nineteen year old are going to have a lot "in common, but it can still work in certain instances. Yes people change as they go through their teens and continue to mature and normally those relationships don't end up lasting, but how many high school romances do. You can still learn and grow from them. I don't think having a fling with a sixteen year old when you're eighteen or nineteen is advisable, but if you want to get into an actual relationship with her that's more than sex, fine.

You can't just pigeon hole every girl or every teenager and apply absolutes to all circumstances. It's not right and it's definitely not fair. Just wanted to add some female perspective here, although some of you men seem to think you are experts on all things pertaining to the opposite sex. That's right there are females on the board, and we do have opinions and do actually know a thing or two about how women work, feel or think. You should consider that before posting some of the things you do.

You need to calm down and read exactly what we're talking about. The idea of certain sexual behaviors indicating abuse was not referring to any sexually active girl, but to INAPPROPRIATE AND DESTRUCTIVE sexual behavior, like this girl:

Quote

Back then I was not very experienced, but that girl. I swear to god, she had to have been the loosest skirt in town. She'd probably been with at least a dozen guys or more by the time I met her. She'd had two abortions. Couple of STDs. And she knew things I'd never even seen in a Porno. To call her innocent or a child is laughable. The girl knew exactly what she wanted and she did what she wanted to do. She was the kind of girl that would fuck you and afterwards you would feel kind of dirt and used.

A dozen partners, two abortions, and two stds is not healthy behavior in a 16 year old girl. Or a boy, for that matter. That's another thing you skipped over, where I said that unhealthy practices possibly indicating abuse applies to BOTH BOYS AND GIRLS. Again, to repeat since it seems you only skimmed before, I am NOT talking about simply being sexually active or having multiple partners. EXTREME AND DESTRUCTIVE SEXUAL behavior is the topic.

I didn't realize that child psychology was your field. If you say that extreme sexual behavior is not ever indicative of previous trauma, well then we better alert the psychologists, because they've got it all wrong. Your "female perspective" somehow trumps the entire field of modern child psychology.

Come on Tehol, you're better than this. You had a knee-jerk reaction to an isolated part of a discussion, and ignored all context, and then argued against points no one was even trying to make. We're not talking about the idea of girls being considered sluts while boys are called studs, you brought that up out of nowhere, and no one here is thinking like that!

No shit most boys and girls have sex in high school, often with more than one person. I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying that if a young teenager of either gender goes beyond normal sexuality to the point of self-damaging behavior, it's often (but admittedly not always, there's another thing you made up to argue against) a sign of abuse. This is fact. Please do not twist what I said. Seriously, the majority of your post is a rant against ideas that no one here is even thinking, let alone saying.
Seriously, you are off the reservation with this one, and frankly I'm offended by the words you're putting in my mouth.

This was no knee jerk reaction it was the result of following and being fed up with the high handed, pompous way you've dealt with this sitaution all day, not to mention disagreeing with your opinion.

Why is it that every time someone disagrees with an opionion and posts their own, the you're better than that card is pulled.

I disagreed with what you had to say, and I gave my own opinion, don't see how that is lowering myself in any way. You want to talk about lowering yourself, how about the fact that you clearly didn't read all of my post (something you accused me of by the way) had a knee jerk reaction (something you also accused me of) and then went off on a rant and called me crazy. Then you accuse me of putting words in your mouth and you've done exactly the same thing to me. That's really mature of you RLY. I never said extreme sexual behaviour was never indicitive of sexual trauma, I said you were speaking in absolutes. Again before you accuse me of not reading though everything you wrote maybe you should go back and read my post.

As for bringing up points that no one was discussing, I clearly saw gothos discussing relationships between sixteen and nineteen year olds, so it was a valid point, apt brought up the fact that boys having multiple partners was seen as being studly, while it girls it was seen as being promiscuous, and other people were talking about the age difference in regards to relationships. So while it may not have been entirely about what you'd been discussing they were points that had been brought up.

I never said I was a child psychologist and last time I checked neither were you. I said nothing about modern psychology or made any challenges to child psychology. You want to talk about twisting words and putting them in someone's mouth you should go back and read that rant you just wrote because you did a damn good job of it. I'm not interested in getting into some huge flame war with you, but before you jump all over me and accuse me of stuff you might want to look to your own actions. I definitely don't appreciate being told I'm off the reservation for expressing my opinion. You're way out of line here and if anyone's lowering themselves it's you. I've got nothing left to say on the whole situation.

[teholbeddict]

Sombra, on 02 June 2010 - 09:37 AM, said:

teholbeddict, on 02 June 2010 - 05:59 AM, said:

... because girls tend to be a bit more mature than guys. I mean I know when I was fifteen or sixteen most of the boys my age were complete and utter hormone ridden morons.

And teenage girls aren't? The inexplicable "frothing at the loins" popularity of Twilight and Justin Bieber tends to contradict the above statement.

Although I'd tend to put the age range not from 15-16, but more like 15-45.

Hahaha! Don't even get me started on Twilight and Bieber fever! Im going to put that down to temporary (in some cases long lasting) insanity!

[Jusentantaka]

worrywort, on 02 June 2010 - 06:50 AM, said:

That reminds me, time to take The Purity Myth out of my wish list and into my shopping cart.

Jessica Valenti is awesome: http://www.youtube.c...h?v=l7VjcLBh7hk

Even better, buy all of her stuff. Loves her soooo much.

[teholbeddict]

Jusentantaka, on 02 June 2010 - 04:31 PM, said:

worrywort, on 02 June 2010 - 06:50 AM, said:

That reminds me, time to take The Purity Myth out of my wish list and into my shopping cart.

Jessica Valenti is awesome: http://www.youtube.c...h?v=l7VjcLBh7hk

Even better, buy all of her stuff. Loves her soooo much.

I'll have to look into The Purity Myth at the very least. Wonder if it's available for my e reader.

[KalamMekhar]

i think a little more respect is due to the women population on the board in regards to how women and womens actions in general are discussed on the board, even without them saying antyhing, its a little offensive to talk about them in general like this.

WTB modgod abyss! go cat!

[Aptorian]

I don't quite see what people are getting so worked up about here. Where in this discussion has the female members of this forum been shown disrespect?

Also, maybe this should be moved into the Discussion forum.

[teholbeddict]

Hmm...well I don't think it's necessarily the last posts specifically but it does seem like a boys club on the board in general at times for sure. I sometimes think people forget there are any women on here at all, and there's probably a reason we don't have more women or very few who actually stay. It's not always the most female friendly place. It happens in multiple threads, and maybe you guys don't even realize you do it. I know there were several instances in the "Was Felisin Pock Marked" thread (think that was the title) earlier this week, that were in rather poor taste and wouldn't necessarily be taken well by the ladies of the board. That's just the first one to come to mind, but it does happen.

[Aptorian]

Boys will be boys.

[Gothos]

[Aptorian]

This is the Bill Cosby of Brain Experts. Also, I luve my nothing box.

[HoosierDaddy]

Why are you people ruining my "I'm hungover" thread????? You're messing with my groove!

[teholbeddict]

Sorry Dearest didn't mean to mess with your daily routine!

Everyone HD is hungover....and will likely be so for the other 212 days left in this year. Please tune in tomorrow for his latest installment in this ongoing chronicle.

This post has been edited by teholbeddict: 02 June 2010 - 06:45 PM

[Tiste Simeon]

Don't know much about that purity myth thing but it doesn't look too good... Could someone explain? (Don't have time to check it out in full right now, don't want to pass judgement without knowing more. )

[worry]

The youtube link I posted was an interview where she sums up the premise. It's only about 4 minutes, if you have the time.