[Lisheo]

Ok, FA warrens: I reckon theyre like the TTT, they can become a warren themselves.
Edur: Theyre technically halfbloods, even tho both halfs are almost immortal, so maybe the longevity gene is just slightly tainted, meaning they arent fully immortal?
Liosan: Yeah, theyre stupid enough to fall for CGs various plans. (Tho perhaps he is Father Light? The guy has vanished after all...)

[Dancer+]

I believe that the Liosan are vulnerable to ruses and usurpation. I think they are an ideal target for the CG considering they have lived apart, thus ignorant, and have had plenty of time to build up their population because of that very fact.

Have the Liosan been confirmed as Immortal?

I thought neither the Liosan or the Andii are immortal but just share lifespans of many thousand years.

[Cougar]

Aptorian;203707 said:

Yes, L'orics familar had been filling in for Osserc.

It was killed by the T'lan Imass hunting the Unbound. TIs don't like false gods so they killed it, never mind the fact that it left Kurald Liosan.. or Thyrlan? What ever place it is they hang out, with out a doorman and guide.

Which reminds me, either the Liosan have uber kevlar armor or their magic is pretty superb for them to have survived a full blast with a cusser.

Right then couple of things here:

Osric is definitely mentioned as being abscent, but doesn't L'oric have a conversation with him?

Second, I thought that the explosives didn't work on the Liosans cos they were immune/very resistant to anything fire based (like Gesler and Stormy) because they are from Kurald Thyrllan.

I appreciate that explosives aren't 'fire based' per se but I thought this was just artistic licence.

[Lisheo]

L'oric finds him tho doesn't he? Except Osserc doesnt want to come back. I dont think Kurald Thyrllan/Liosan grants full immunity to fire tho, considering what happened to Truth...

[Blend]

Lisheo;204011 said:

L'oric finds him tho doesn't he? Except Osserc doesnt want to come back. I dont think Kurald Thyrllan/Liosan grants full immunity to fire tho, considering what happened to Truth...

But Truth was up against a Fire Elemental, not just a measly cusser.

[Lisheo]

Thats true, but wasnt one of the reasons he didnt survive happen to be he was carrying cussers that exploded in his possession? I always saw that as the reason for his death.

[Illuyankas]

A fire elemental plus the three bags of cussers he was holding. They might have made the difference.

[Lisheo]

Exactly. I saw the cussers as the things that killed him.

[Blend]

Regardless... Three bags of cussers and a Fire Elemental pack a shitload more of a punch than just one cusser!

[Dolorous Menhir]

Cougar;203979 said:

Osric is definitely mentioned as being abscent, but doesn't L'oric have a conversation with him?

Osric is absent from Kurald Thyrllan and his duties as God of the Tiste Liosan (i.e. being their leader in the same manner as Rake for the Tiste Andii). He's also in seclusion, so no-one knows where he is. L'oric came upon him in the "memory of Raraku" place by accident, and I think that Osric wouldn't even have let on to his son that he was there if L'oric hadn't needed urgent rescuing from the Deragoth.

Basically, Osric is pretty anti-social, and doesn't much care about other people.

Quote

Second, I thought that the explosives didn't work on the Liosans cos they were immune/very resistant to anything fire based (like Gesler and Stormy) because they are from Kurald Thyrllan.

I appreciate that explosives aren't 'fire based' per se but I thought this was just artistic licence.

That's a good point. I think Truth isn't dead though. Even so, the ability of those Liosan to survive the Moranth munition attack needs some explaining.

[Aptorian]

Mael;203777 said:

Off Topic: Clip notes that the light in KG is "a gift from father light". And where do we get our light from at night during darkness? The moon.

I believe the edur legends in MT mention that "brother light", who might be father light or perhaps Osserc, was on the moon. Brother light being trapped in the gardens or something like that.

I don't think we should connect the moon and sun of wu to KG, KL or KE, though, they're different worlds.

Quote

How does Ruin control the level of light in KG? Udinaas tells him to 'turn the dimmer up, dumbass' and he does.

Thoughts?

This has been discussed but it's a bit hard to theorize with what little we have to go from.

Udinaas secret knowledge and hints during their trip might have something to do with it. It was something about the differences between light and dark aren't as big as the fanatics of the tiste races claim.

Ruin and the other "light/dark" ascendants might not be what they are made out to be. Something about there being light in the ascendants of darkness, Rake and ruins skintone was connected to this I think.

[dolfanuk]

osserc isn't the liosan god is he? i thought he was just the champion like rake for the andii.

and their god could well be the CG i mean he was torn from another realm. one who's god has gone missing????

[Aptorian]

dolfanuk;204158 said:

osserc isn't the liosan god is he? i thought he was just the champion like rake for the andii.

and their god could well be the CG i mean he was torn from another realm. one who's god has gone missing????

It seems that Osserc unlike Rake didn't mind the worship.

Its not easy to say if Osserc was worshipped by the Liosan or just lead them like Rake does, I don't remember much from the Liosan statements in HoC.

But Osserc has been mentioned both as an elder god and connected to the warren of air, Serc. Serc = Osserc.

[Dolorous Menhir]

dolfanuk;204158 said:

osserc isn't the liosan god is he? i thought he was just the champion like rake for the andii.

and their god could well be the CG i mean he was torn from another realm. one who's god has gone missing????

Osserc is the Champion of High House Light. It also seems clear to me that he is the god of the Tiste Liosan race. He has also been grouped with the Elder Gods, in a way that Rake has not.

[Jorram]

In RG but I forgot where, both Osserc and Rake are mentioned along with the EG, but maybe only in terms of ancient power. Contrary to that, there are Udinaas' remarks of the enmity between EG and Draconean ascendants, particularly those of Andii heritage (for whom the EG are dubbed as "inconvenient relatives"), which clearly distinguishes one group from the other.

Anyway, Osserc is worshipped by the Liosan, but in HoC they refer to him as "the son of Father Light", meaning that they hold Father Light in even higher respect.

I liked "Osric" better anyway ;D

[dolfanuk]

really stupid question but are osric and osserc the same guy?

and i agree with the post above i also recall mention that he is the son of father light or some such.

[Lisheo]

Aye, Father Light is their god, but it seems Osserc( who is Osric, and several other spelling variations besides) felt an obligation to take his place when he vanished. Just like L'oric did when Osric managed to get lost.
I reckon Osric is an Elder God because he is one of the two rulers of Serc. Quite a few Dragons and Ascendants seem to have a claim on Darkness.

[dolfanuk]

could father light be the CG? i mean its clear that the Edur have been used by him who the liosan "tolerate"

and its implied that his children the liosan are being influenced by an imposter.

maybe it's no imposter and the CG is really father light???

[Lisheo]

Its one of my theorys, check it out, some of it is in the thread "Grallin, Lord of Deep Waters-The CG?"
I reckon he is, alright.

[Lisheo]

And yes, i know, it doesnt make much sense there lol, but I do suspect the CG is FL, theres a few threads around that have discussed it.