[Dolorous Menhir]

Sure, that's right. We know it happened to Coltaine, and that's how the child warlocks came to exist.

That doesn't rule out Coltaine being on the path to ascension before his eventual death and subsequent reiteration.

[GRIEF & VENEGEANCE]

Have to agree with you there. But for the betrayal at Aren I reckon that Coltaine would have gone onto ascendancy.

This is only because the shock of the Wickan warlocks at his actually being able to break the nose of someone who is almost ascended tells me that they had no idea that he was so far down that path already. Ok, I am clutching at straws slightly, especially since his "death" makes this a moot point.

Also, slight sidetrack: Coltaine and his uncle Bult were two of my favourite characters. Disappointed at their deaths, but it did bring home the fact that this really is a book of the fallen Malazan soldiers.

This kind of brings me back to the central theme which is Fiddler. I have this idea about Braven Tooth being Shield Anvil. I think that perhaps he could be Shield Anvil to Shadowthrone. I know its sounds ludicrous but hear me out.

All of the fallen that Fiddler played the fiddle for were Malazan soldiers. Kulp, Whiskeyjack and Baudin were either from the Old Guard or linked to it. Then there was also the Seventh, all of these deaths were "witnessed" by the three listening to Fiddler. (I mention witnessed as it resonates with Tavore's speech on the way to Letheras). The three that Fiddler calls his old, old friends were of the Old Guard.

I think that sructures were put in place a long time ago by the Emperor Kellanved and Dancer. There are two reasons for this:

- Firstly I believe that during their travels through the Azath houses they realised that in order to achieve their goals they had to "occupy" as many thrones as possible. Hence the need for the imperium where they have occupied the mortal thrones, such that of Itko Kan, Li Heng , the Napan etc. They then go onto occupy the throne of the Imass. Eventually with their ascendancy, the throne of Shadow (or one of them at least). Although Dassem (Traveller) helps to protect another throne of Shadow on Drift Avalii. In order to achieve this though they had to have a military force at their disposal.

- Secondly, I think that this is why Braven Tooth gives the recruits their nicknames. they are kind of reborn into the Malazan army. Almost as if by accepting their new names they leave behind their old life and take on a new one in service of the Imperium (and therefore indirectly Shadowthrone). Also, as mentioned before in this forum, Braven Tooth has a way of sensing something about each recruit. Something that rings true in each one of them.

Sorry about the long winded nature of this one. I realise that this theory has holes in it that one could drive a truck through, but I would appreciate any ideas on it.

[Dolorous Menhir]

GRIEF & VENEGEANCE;194909 said:

Sorry about the long winded nature of this one. I realise that this theory has holes in it that one could drive a truck through, but I would appreciate any ideas on it.

I hate to rain on your parade, but it does have a more than truck-sized hole - the T'lan Imass called Stormy "Shield Anvil," not Braven Tooth.

[GRIEF & VENEGEANCE]

Ah... yes. So much for that theory then, heh Dolorous? I must have got the two confused because I remember it being Braven Tooth who nodded his assent. Don't have my books with me at the moment so can't I can't check.

Next question is if Stormy is Shield Anvil, would that then be to the once-mighty now-flighty Fener?

[Flawed]

I thought Stormy was the Sheild Anvil to the Wolves of Winter. The Throne of War etc.

They cover the Tlan now, they would cover Fener if he went to them even after his usurpation ( is this a word? ).

Thats what i thought anyhow.

Now that wasn't to ambiguous now was it mystery WTF'er.

Ideas?

[Dolorous Menhir]

Probably, Stormy was a Fener cultist when we first met him in DG. Or it could be Treach, Fener's successor. Or any other god, we don't know.

[Gem Windcaster]

I got the impression it has something to do with the Liosan.

[mot]

To get back to Fid for a second. I'm not necessarily convinced that he must be a part of the House of Life, but just because he hasn't been invited isn't any indication either. In RP Trull seems completely surprised when he discovers that he is the Knight of Shadow and Onrack even suggests that being tapped out by the 'King' may have nothing to do with it. As for Fid, the two cards he deals to himself in the famous card game of BH were both from Life, Soldier and Priest, respectively. Bottle receives the Weaver. It is here that Fid apparently recognizes that he will perform his dirge and he suggests that Kalam will pass on and adds his name to the dirge. This in turn becomes similar to the Tanno song, in that all those whom it affects hears it. Again, I'm not saying that Fid must hold a position of Life, but his role in BH and RP, in which he has lost no one, his dirge and his including the Edur, a fair amount of the race on that continent mind you, is interesting. Finally, it is also interesting that when asked who won that game, Fid replies, "Nobody wins. That's Life for you." Suggesting that the House of Life wants no winners?

[Gem Windcaster]

Wooo, that went way over my head. There's something mysterious with Fiddler. Can't really get beyond that with this, so far, it seems to me. :cool: