[Rockyturnbull]

When Felisin Younger becomes Shaik reborn yet again there seems to be a bit of an inconsistency in the time-space continuum, can anyone explain?

In the chapters devoted to her there we witness her gradually becoming debauched. She gets fat, becomes sexualised, changes her attitude towards everything etc. Also the desert rider (forget his name) when he speaks to Ganoes talks about how he knows her vizier masturbates behind the curtain when she takes lovers etc. implying that this is something that has gone on for some time and word has spread.

All of this implies that considerable time has passed here....years? However, this doesn't fit in with the timeline of the rest of the book at this point, where things seem to be proceeding at the same pace as usual.

Am I missing something? Is it just an inconsistency?

Any thoughts gratefully received.

[Rockyturnbull]

Yeah I suppose it's possible, I just got the impression from the style it was a long time, but I'm happy with a couple of months.

As for the vizier....well SE is usually pretty tough on his perverts....something pretty bad heading his way, let's hope it's a crazy Karsa:outta:

[Abyss]

There WAS sorcery involved too. Felisin became aspected to the Whirlwind, sans Dryhja-the-evil-Imass. The Whirlwind however, is not what it was. Without Dryhja, and without Raraku being subverted, the aspect was wide open. So she twisted it, becoming something other than what the two Sha'iks before her were.

Remember that Shaik elder was incumsised and abused by Bidithal, and so denied pleasure. Felisin was extremely bitter and hard done to by the otti mines, etc, so again, a harsh, bitter avatar for a harsh bitter goddess who was subverting Raraku for her own rage.

Fast fwd to TB... no goddess, no Raraku, no revolution to speak of, and Felisin Younger, who had been similarly abused by Bidithal but then healed by Heboric, decides to go a whole other route with her ascension. Woohoo!!!! Sex and drugs for everyone the plague didn't kill!!!!

It was a weird twist for the character, and seemed to come out of nowehere, but of course, the CG is behind at least some of this, and i wonder whether he had planned on Felisin becoming another bitter Shaik, and got something else instead.

And yeah, the vizier was just creepy.

- Abyss, notes that in the history of fantasy lit, no one titled 'vizier' was every a happy, cheerful person.

[Midnight]

With regards to her sexuality she could have been right on the cusp so to speak...she did seem to really fancy Crokus before getting abducted.

The stones in the vizier's mouth was the most disturbing part of the book.

[Rockyturnbull]

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The stones in the vizier's mouth was the most disturbing part of the book.

uuurrrgh I'd forgotten about that, totally vile.

Quote

There WAS sorcery involved too.

Yes, that whole section does have somehting of a dream like quality to it, reminded me a bit of the sort of magic you get witches and the like using in fairy tales. I wondered if this sorcery had something to do with time perhaps moving faster in Felisin's "court" than outside. Just a thought. I think this is going to become a very important and enjoyable story thread.

[Sir Thursday]

The only thing is...when are we going to see more of Felisin Younger? If the storyline is leaving 7Cs then there isn't going to be much opportunity for her cult to play a cameo role, unless she manages to unify the whole of the continent and invade Quon Tali...hehe

Invasion of the zombie-like diseased people! It could be the Malazan equivalent of a bad b-movie.

Vox

[PannionDude]

I don't think Feliesin's followers will ever form into a Tlenascowri-esque horde, they seem to hedonistic to stir themselves up that much. I do buy the notion that the Cult will spread like wildfire, so we could easily encounter its tendrils in the remainder of the story, while its heart remains in Raraku.

I also think that Feliesin will be redeemed one day. Like Paran says I think she will bring Salavation out from under the CG's yoke.

Finally, I think Paran will be killed by acolytes of the Cult, just as the desert rider guy tells him. I don't think those people will be instructed by Feliesin though, more of the whole Worshippers Define the God thing. I get the feeling he'll let it happen, to pay for something he feels guilty about.

[Abyss]

Pet theory, probably based hugely on being mid-reread of HoC...

Felisin Fatter seems to be centralizing the remaining population of 7C. Otherwise, we have basically the Malazan forces evacuating, and the Tanno taking a few others with them.

Rewind to HoC, Karsa spends a few dozen pages going on about his connection to 7C and specifically the Jhag Odhan where the deaar and the antelope play, and the horses eat meat, but also Raraku in general.

And now, with the exception of Fatlisin's people, the continent is basically empty.

And Karsa's planning to lead his Teblor tribes. Presumably to conquer Genabackis, but now i'm wondering whether a few tribes of Teblor, immune to disease, might not be well suited to repopulating 7C... and basically ignoring Fatlisin's people, who can't infect Teblor and are firmly introverted anyways. Or should be.

- Abyss, yes, 'Felisin Fatter'...

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Felisin Fatter (love that,btw) seems to me to be in the process of getting set up for a noble death to redeem herself situation. She's so damaged that it would be hard to accept her ever reversing things, but she has already been established as someone we are supposed to have some sympathy for, so I think she will have to die in order to heroically stop something horrible, therefore redeeming herself and removing herself from the story. That's my prediction.

[Aptorian]

Abyss said:

Pet theory, probably based hugely on being mid-reread of HoC...

Felisin Fatter seems to be centralizing the remaining population of 7C. Otherwise, we have basically the Malazan forces evauating, and the Tanno taking a few others with them.

Rewind to HoC, Karsa spends a few dozen pages going on about his connection to 7C and specifically the Jhag Odhan where the horses run free and eat meat, but also Raraku in general.

And now, with the exception of Fatlisin's people, the continent is basically empty.

And Karsa's planning to lead his Teblro tribes. Presumably to conquer Genabackis, but now i'm wondering whether a few tribes of Teblor, immune to disease, might not be well suited to repopulating 7C... and basically ignoring Fatlisin's people, who can't infect Teblor and are afirly introverted anyways.

- Abyss, yes, 'Felisin Fatter'...

It's been a long time since I read HoC but I remember the Teblor as another possible tool of the CG.

If I recall correctly they are a fallen people, isolated from the world (by Icarium?) to save them from a faith I can't recall. They are inbread, blinded by their own ignorance of their past and the arrogance connected with their lack of knowledge. They are smaller and more barbaric than the TTT and they worship the Unbound, servants of the CG.

It may be that Karsa is destined to free them, but right now I would think it just as likely that the Unbound could lead the Teblor on a rampage through the continent.

[Aptorian]

Abyss said:

Pet theory, probably based hugely on being mid-reread of HoC...

Felisin Fatter seems to be centralizing the remaining population of 7C. Otherwise, we have basically the Malazan forces evauating, and the Tanno taking a few others with them.

Rewind to HoC, Karsa spends a few dozen pages going on about his connection to 7C and specifically the Jhag Odhan where the horses run free and eat meat, but also Raraku in general.

And now, with the exception of Fatlisin's people, the continent is basically empty.

And Karsa's planning to lead his Teblro tribes. Presumably to conquer Genabackis, but now i'm wondering whether a few tribes of Teblor, immune to disease, might not be well suited to repopulating 7C... and basically ignoring Fatlisin's people, who can't infect Teblor and are afirly introverted anyways.

- Abyss, yes, 'Felisin Fatter'...

It's been a long time since I read HoC but I remember the Teblor as another possible tool of the CG.

If I recall correctly they are a fallen people, isolated from the world (by Icarium?) to save them from a faith I can't recall. They are inbread, blinded by their own ignorance of their past and the arrogance connected with their lack of knowledge. They are smaller and more barbaric than the TTT and they worship the Unbound, servants of the CG.

It may be that Karsa is destined to free them, but right now I would think it just as likely that the Unbound could lead the Teblor on a rampage through the continent.

[Abyss]

I wondered whether Ganoes' new 'Salvation' card, which was influenced by the HoChains but supposedly going to break free, was a ref to Felisin Fatter.

- Abyss, wonders if chewing pebbles is an appetite supressant.

[Whelp]

Imho, Felisin Fatter fell for the CG already in HoC, after she was abused by Bidithal - if I interpret the voices in Toblakai's glade talking to her correctly...

[Abyss]

Yes, but in the end she chose not to stick around and serve them. Altho that conversation does, in some respects, set the stage for the Unbound subsequently abducting her.

Altho i also think killing Heboric was part of their intention.

- Abyss, loves his rereadisms.

[Whelp]

Abyss said:

Altho i also think killing Heboric was part of their intention.

Considering that Fener as God of War was a key factor in one of the Chainings, it figures that the CG wanted to cripple the new god of war as much as possible...

[Dolorous Menhir]

Apt said:

It's been a long time since I read HoC but I remember the Teblor as another possible tool of the CG.

If I recall correctly they are a fallen people, isolated from the world (by Icarium?) to save them from a faith I can't recall. They are inbread, blinded by their own ignorance of their past and the arrogance connected with their lack of knowledge. They are smaller and more barbaric than the TTT and they worship the Unbound, servants of the CG.

It may be that Karsa is destined to free them, but right now I would think it just as likely that the Unbound could lead the Teblor on a rampage through the continent.

I think the Teblor were just a route to escape for the Unbound. They needed someone to retrieve their weapons or whatever that deal was so they could go free. Now that Karsa has done that for them I assumed their interest in the Teblor was over.

I think Karsa himself was intended to be the CG's instrument for controlling the Teblor. That'll work out well...

[madala]

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By Abyss. Felisin Younger, who had been similarly abused by Bidithal but then healed by Heboric, decides to go a whole other route with her ascension

It was Scillara that was healed by Heboric. For sure the scene in Karsa's glade was a foreshadowing of sorts though.

With regards to the "resurrection" of the Teblor, I hope its going to relate to them regaining their former status/glory/civilization. It seemed to me that the ancient carving that Karsa & co find early in HoC said that the purpose of the re-structuring of their society was so that they can regain the purity of their blood? The Jhagut seem to have memories of them being as typically "brutally" logical as Karsa. Sort of giant arbiters of Truth

[madala]

[QUOTE] Otherwise there would be no need to feed her sexual appetite as well as her gluttony [/UNQUOTE]

Not necessarily - apparently even eunuchs have ways and means