[Dolmen 2.0]

Can we have a list of the sword, in spoilers of course, because I have a hunch about one or two individuals like for instance Dujeks bodygaurds. Just want to have it in mind as it might prove relevant later in the books .

When did dassems power manifest? and ofcourse how does it manifest? is it similar to icarium?

[tiam]

errr sorry i hant got my book to hand but i dont think any of the bodyguards dujek has are people from the first sword. without spoilers lets just say its a hunch

[Dolmen 2.0]

Ok, I'll take your word for it though that implies the rest didn't survive or something. Thats too bad really...

[tiam]

Illuyankas said:

More like 'a handful of men who gave Dassem space, while HE cut through armies'.

Well, they did more than that, but you know what I mean.

Well yeh they fought off armies so dassem could get going. I often wondered why noone ever thought about

normal man'' hey isnt that dassem ultor the best swordsmen on the planet''

friend ''yeh it is pass me that crossbow''

Something like that. just a quick method to deal with legendaary swordsmen. If brys,the seguleh first or dassamwere just shot at theyd go down

[Dolmen 2.0]

Not likely Tiam, after all whats a crossbow to a guy that could catch lightning?

-yes dassem, greymane and chuck norris are known for catching lightning

seriously you can't be called the best if crossbows stopped you but maybe a cusser...what happens if dassem dies? does he go to hood or become the new god of death?

[Abyss]

Points,,,

- I was under the impression Dassem's daughter took his place at the last Chaining, and subsequently died. Since time is odd in the Azath, someone put her body in Tremolor or the Deadhouse, where she hasn't decomposed. And as we've seen with Toc/Anaster, a souless body is a handy thing to have around for a rainy day.

- the Cult of Dassem, later Dessembrae, seems to have arisen around his abilities as a warrior and general, enhanced by his position as Hood's Champion.

- Nok spoilers:

Spoiler

At the time of NoK, it appears Dassem has already had his break from Hood, but not yet ascended to godhood, tho' he seems to be an ascendant at that point.

As for the sword and his role as First Sword, the point was to draw out opposing forces' champions and then kill them, demoralizing the other side and taking out a major player. Since the 7 Cities Protectors were magically supporting their champions, the Malazan Empire needed its own counter to that power. Once 7C was pacified, the Empire, ruled by Laseen by then, didn't need/want Dassem as a figurehead any more.

The Sword's job was to keep the lesser soldiers off him while he dealt with the champions.

- Abyss, loves his NoKisms, oh yes he does, my precioussss...

[Dolmen 2.0]

I see...

Dassem was the malazans answer to seven cities champions. I'm not to sure how a mortal can take the place of an ascendant but the concept makes sense if thats what killed her. And it was lady envies fault...Does this mean Dassems daughter was a mage of some kind?

[Abyss]

The daughter could have been invested by Hood, as opposed to being a mage or ascendant.

Not sure why you say it's Envy's fault tho'. I gathered from her chat with Krul in MoI that she was equally bummed about the whole thing.

- Abyss, thinks Malazan gods need a good investment adviser.

[tiam]

I think dolmen was saying about the way envy blames herself for the loss of dassem ultor if anyone would like to look it up. She says it just after the talk with krul. personally i just think his daughter paid the price for his absence.

And dolmen just take it for a given that dassem is vulnerable to crossbow bolts. just trust me:)

[Set'alahd Crool]

K'rul said Dassem's daughter was needed for the chaining because Envy didn't show up. I think it's safe to assume that Dassem was there.

@tiam
Vulnerable.....sort of.

[Abyss]

Quote? Anyone, anyone, Vaiski?

- Abyss, just the facts ma'am.

[vaiski]

K'rul continued after a moment. We have lost allies in our foolishness. Dassem Ultor, who was broken by Hood's taking of his daughter at the Time of Chaining - this was a devastating blow. Dassem Ultor, the First Sword reborn ─
'Do you think,' she asked slowly, 'that Hood would have taken her for the Chaining, had I answered the summons?'
Am I, she wondered, to blame for Dassem Ultor's loss?

[Abyss]

Vaiski is the quote "god". Let no one say different.

@tiam/Set': The ambiguity is what I wasn't clear on, but i see your point.

I wonder if every chaining has required a sacrifice of some sort.

- Abyss, notes that if it required a virgin sacrifice, Envy was pretty much off the hook to begin with.

[tiam]

lol envy off the hook.
As to the sacrifice yes it seems likely but i dont think dassems daughter dead. Rallick and vorcan arent dead and theree in the house frozen in time.

[Morgoth]

A but she is dead, just not.. decomposing..

[Dolmen 2.0]

Hey envy could be chaste...Its possible...Nah forget it.

Dassems daughter was there in whose place exactly? Dassems or ENVY's???

[Abyss]

Good question. I assume Envy's. I don't think we know whether Dassem was actually there or not. Just that after, he pretty much split.

- Abyss, like a banana.

[tiam]

I think dassem was there and thats when the splitting occured. Actually maybe when i think about it how about this.

Dassem(for some reason) will not go to the chaining. he flatly refuses his master Hood and Hood is furios. He goes made kidnaps Dassems daughter and puts her at the chaining. Dassem breaks his bond to hood. then either

a)hood puts her in deadhouse as leverage over dassem to stop him coming after him.(hood could get into deadhouse as its the house of death)

or

b)cotillion puts her there to stop hood ever again taking her (or maybe to gain leverage over dassem i dunno what there relationship is after he and kellenved ascended. i just finished NoK and im confused) and tries to reunite them however dassem is ''killed'' before this could happen. Cotillion decides to leave her there for either dassems wife/girlfriend/mother of child or until dassem comes back.

Any thoughts?

[Set'alahd Crool]

Dassem was at the chaining. Recall Mammots book. The one in which Kruppe sought his grandmother's name. Dassembrae too was there. That's the gist at least. If you want the quote you know who to ask.