[Aptorian]

I think that part is about dawn being the first light, that breaks darkness or some such and therefore it's evil.

[Aptorian]

P. 184. Shurq visits Kettle at the Azath. I didn't remember Kettle being that vicious. She's a little horror. And the dying of the Azath is suitably ominous. Great build up.

[Aptorian]

P. 205

This is the section where we see a murder scene connected to Kettle.

Quote

Into that black portal. Something shattered, and, suddenly corporeal, he stumbled onto his knees. The stone was cold enough to tear the skin from his knees and the palms of his hands. He staggered upright, and his shoulder struck something that tottered with the impact. The cold made the air brutal, blinding him, shocking his lungs. Through freezing tears he saw, amidst a faint blue glow, a tall figure. Skin like bleached vellum, limbs too long and angular with too many joints. Black, frosted eyes, an expression of faint surprise on its narrow, arched features. The clothes it wore consisted of a harness of leather straps and nothing more. It was unarmed. A man, but anything but a man. And then Udinaas saw, scattered on the floor around the figure, corpses twisted in death. Dark, greenish skin, tusked. A man, a woman, two children. Their bodies had been broken, the ends of shattered bone jutting out from flesh. The way they lay suggested that the white-skinned man had been their killer. Udinaas was shivering uncontrollably. His hands and feet were numb. ‘Wither? Shadow wraith? Are you with me?’ Silence. His heart began hammering hard in his chest. This did not feel like a dream. It was too real. He felt no dislocation, no whispering assurance of a body lying on its sleeping pallet in an Edur longhouse. He was here, and he was freezing to death. Here. In the depths of ice, this world of secrets where time has ceased. He turned and studied the doorway. And only then noticed the footprints impressed upon the frost-laden flagstones. Leading out. Bared feet, human, a child’s. There was no ice visible beyond the portal. Naught but opaque silver, as if a curtain had fallen across the entrance. Feeling ebbing from his limbs, Udinaas backtracked the footprints. To behind the standing figure. Where he saw, after a numbed moment, that the back of the man’s head had been stove in. Hair and skin still attached to the shattered plates of the skull that hung down on the neck. Something like a fist had reached into the figure’s head, tearing through the grey flesh of the brain. The break looked unaccountably recent. Tiny tracks indicated that the child had stood behind the figure – no, had appeared behind it, for there were no others to be found. Had appeared … to do what? Reach into a dead man’s skull? Yet the figure was as tall as an Edur. The child would have had to climb. His thoughts were slowing. There was a pleasurable languor to his contemplation of this horrid mystery. And he was growing sleepy. Which amused him. A dream that made him sleepy. A dream that will kill me. Would they find a frozen corpse on the sleeping pallet? Would it be taken as an omen? Oh well, follow the prints … into that silver world. What else could he do?

Now as far as I recall. Kettle is said to be half Forkrul Assail and half something else, maybe Azath or something.

How is that related to that dead FA? Did she eat a part of his brain and get his powers?

This post has been edited by Aptorian: 05 May 2020 - 05:21 PM

[Aptorian]

P. 290. Feather Witches second casting of the tiles.

Some of this is clearly foretelling events that will come to pass. But this line: ‘The Hold of the Beast has found Twin Rulers.’ sounds like present tense. Yet we know Midnight Tides takes place years before the earlier books. Another timeline issue.

[Aptorian]

P. 301 okay so the Watcher in the Tile Castings is or was Gothos. In the role of the one who watched the Invasion and betrayal.

[Macros]

Just read that section at lunch as well

Definitely a timeline is not important issue on the beast hold in my mind.

Way too advanced to be a prediction given how sudden Feners vulnerability was

[Keysi]

A thing I love about Erikson's writing is how he plays with language. And how those languages evolve over the span of 300 000 years. I forget the exact specifics but it was during this book I realised how good he is at it and I'm sure it will all come flooding back as I begun my read. I've probably posted about it before. I'll need to check the forums.


Hmmm Osserc numbered amongst the Elder Gods by Gothos..... not sure about that one. Gothos would definitely know better.

This post has been edited by Keysi: 06 May 2020 - 06:40 PM

[Macros]

I always thought the Jheck were reverse divers, 3 into one wolf.

Upon rereading it seems like soletaken are per Trulls musing, but why always 3 in the people pack?

[Aptorian]

I think it's an honour thing.

This post has been edited by Aptorian: 06 May 2020 - 07:19 PM

[Keysi]

Hmmm what's happened to my post?

[Aptorian]

Keysi, on 06 May 2020 - 05:40 PM, said:

Hmmm Osserc numbered amongst the Elder Gods by Gothos..... not sure about that one. Gothos would definitely know better.

I haven't read Fall of Light so I don't know if there's a story about Osserc there but I get the feeling that quite some time passed between The Wars of Light and Dark and the time when The Edur came to this reality.

What ever the case, there are The Azathanai Elder Gods and there are the Elder Gods who are named as such because they were worshipped during the Elder Times. Like Osserc.

[Aptorian]

P. 378

Quote

Who forwarded the Chancellor’s request?’ ‘What? Oh, Turudal Brizad.’ ‘Ah, yes. Such an errant, troubled lad. One sees such sorrow in his eyes, or at least in his demeanour.’

Oh shit, I completely forgot about what The Errant was up to. Such clever little hints.

[Aptorian]

Just finished part 2. Rhulad's ascension is something awful to read. What a horrid little piece of shit.

[Aptorian]

P. 467 Tehol and Bugg visit the Rat Catchers. It's a delightful passage.

I wonder, do we ever learn what the Rat Catchers are? Some of them are human. What are the others? They're hidden by illusions and perhaps not really there, at least not in a humanoid form. A sentient clump of rats? Demons?

[Keysi]

Aptorian, on 06 May 2020 - 07:46 PM, said:

Keysi, on 06 May 2020 - 05:40 PM, said:

Hmmm Osserc numbered amongst the Elder Gods by Gothos..... not sure about that one. Gothos would definitely know better.

I haven't read Fall of Light so I don't know if there's a story about Osserc there but I get the feeling that quite some time passed between The Wars of Light and Dark and the time when The Edur came to this reality.

What ever the case, there are The Azathanai Elder Gods and there are the Elder Gods who are named as such because they were worshipped during the Elder Times. Like Osserc.

How come you are rereading thew book of the fallen rather than the kharkhanas books?

[Aptorian]

I didn't like Forge of Darkness much and as such didn't bother with Fall of Light. I was also poor at the time it came out.

I don't like the way Erikson, as the series has continued, has shone a light on the Elder Ages and dismantled the mystery and magic of the worlds he created in the reader's mind. Instead of the Tiste Races being these Alien, magic attuned children of an ur-god, Mother Dark, who birthed three Ascendants, it turned out that the Tiste peoples were just another human like civilization, no different from humans. How boring and disappointing.

We will be reading the Kharkanas books in 2021 though.

[Aptorian]

P. 619

Iron Bars and the Crimson Guard showed up. I'd forgotten how over powered Iron Bars is. He pulled a man's jaw off with a hand gesture!

[Aptorian]

P. 639

Interesting passage. The reluctant God made to lead by his ignorant companion. How quaint.

Quote

‘Exactly. In any case, I was speaking of leadership in a general sort of way—’ ‘Who, master?’ ‘Why, the Waiting Man, of course. Occasional priest, healer, consorter with demons …’ ‘That’s probably not such a good idea, master,’ Bugg said, rubbing his bristled jaw. ‘I am rather … busy at the moment.’ ‘A leader should be busy. Distracted. Preoccupied. Prepared to delegate.’ ‘Master, I really don’t think this is a good idea. Really.’ ‘Perfectly reluctant, perfect! And look! You’ve been noticed! See those hopeful faces—’ ‘That’s hunger, master.’ ‘For salvation! Word’s gone out, you see. They’re ready for you, Bugg. They’ve been waiting …’ ‘This is very bad, master.’ ‘Your expression is perfect, Bugg. Sickly and wan with dismay, deeply troubled and nervous, yes indeed. I couldn’t have managed better myself.’ ‘Master—’ ‘Go out among your flock, Bugg. Tell them – they’re leaving. Tomorrow night. All of them. A better place, a better life awaits them. Go on, Bugg.’ ‘As long as no-one worships me,’ the manservant replied. ‘I don’t like being worshipped.’ ‘Just stay fallible,’ Tehol said. Bugg cast him a strange look, then he walked into the shanty-town.

[Keysi]

Aptorian, on 07 May 2020 - 04:26 PM, said:

I didn't like Forge of Darkness much and as such didn't bother with Fall of Light. I was also poor at the time it came out.

I don't like the way Erikson, as the series has continued, has shone a light on the Elder Ages and dismantled the mystery and magic of the worlds he created in the reader's mind. Instead of the Tiste Races being these Alien, magic attuned children of an ur-god, Mother Dark, who birthed three Ascendants, it turned out that the Tiste peoples were just another human like civilization, no different from humans. How boring and disappointing.

We will be reading the Kharkanas books in 2021 though.

Yeah I get where you are coming from. I suppose it could be looked at as all that stuff you mentioned was just legends and creation myths that have been passed down over hundreds of milenia. I can never decided if things like this really were just myths that we finally find out the kernel of truth about or were just out and out retcons. One day I'll learn lots about technical English literature and find out.

[Aptorian]

P. 771.

Quite a tale

Quote

Udinaas remembered eating smoked eel from Moss River, one time when the trader ship had docked in Dresh. Delicious, once one got used to the furry skin, which was to be chewed but not swallowed. He had since heard, from another slave, that the eels had been transplanted into Dresh Lake, producing a strain that was both bigger and nastier. It had turned out that those eels captured in Moss River were juveniles, and few ever reached adulthood since there was a razor-jawed species of predatory fish resident in the river. No such fish in Dresh Lake. Adolescent swimmers from Dresh started disappearing before anyone realized the adult eels were responsible. Razor-jawed fish were netted from the river and tossed into the lake, but their behaviour changed, turning them into frenzy feeders. Adult swimmers from Dresh started vanishing. The slave who had been relating all this then laughed and finished with, ‘So they poisoned the whole lake, killed everything. And now no-one can swim in it!’ From this, Udinaas surmised, various lessons could be drawn, should one be inclined to draw lessons from multiple acts of stupidity.