[Whisperzzzzzzz]

Keysi, on 04 March 2020 - 11:39 AM, said:

Aptorian, on 04 March 2020 - 09:41 AM, said:

P. 46

‘I have known little happiness, mast—’ The god hissed. ‘Nor should you expect it! Not in this life, not in the thousand others you are doomed to endure before you attain salvation – assuming you have suffered enough to have earned it!’

Interesting quote from the CG. All souls belong to Hood and there's no afterlife associated with the House of Chains as far as I recall. Is the CG merely lying to coerce a follower or is there perhaps a system of reincarnation in his home dimension?

I've read somewhere on this forum that in an interview SE said that Kaminsod was from our Earth. So maybe Brahman? What about Buddhism? Does that have reincarnation?

Apologies to anyone offended by my ignorance of world religions, it's something I've been meaning to study I swear it!

This brings up a question of mine.

How exactly does the whole "alien realm" thing work in Malazan?

Would Mother Dark cout as an alien God? The Azathani?

There's already numerous warrens and demon dimensions, are the "alien" or what?

Or would it be from other planets in the same dimension? Surely that cuts as "alien"?

Do we have much in the way of cosmology for me to read up on?

I've always wonder that too. All the warrens and Holds are "inside" K'rul. Yet, they also are on a single planet in a solar system. And there are also those "alien realms".

The cosmology makes no sense to me.

[Keysi]

Just finished the parley scene. It annoys me how terribly Kallor is treated, especially by Brood, his so called ally. I think Kallor is justified in what he does. Including to Whiskyjack. There I said it.

[Aptorian]

P. 70. The Malazan arrive to the parley and Silverfox makes an assessment.

Quote

The girl nodded. ‘You can trust him. While the one-armed old man is hiding something – well, no, they both are and it’s the same secret, yet I trust the bearded one anyway. The Moranth – he laughs inside. Always laughs, and no-one knows this. Not a cruel laugh, but one filled with sorrow. And the one with the banner …’ Silverfox frowned. ‘I am uncertain of him. I think I always have been …’

Right from the start it's hinted at who Arthantos is and I never realized it until the reveal towards the end of the book.

[JPK]

Keysi, on 05 March 2020 - 07:21 PM, said:

Just finished the parley scene. It annoys me how terribly Kallor is treated, especially by Brood, his so called ally. I think Kallor is justified in what he does. Including to Whiskyjack. There I said it.

I'm slowly coming to that conclusion myself. That said, I think Whiskeyjack was very much manipulated into that position by the Nightchill portion of Silverfox as well. She knew she needed protectors while she was still developing and Tattersail's memories of Whiskeyjack's character gave her everything she needed to ensure that he would put himself before her. "Uncle Whiskeyjack"... I mean come on. It was very clear to everyone in that Parley that she was no regular child.

[Aptorian]

I'm on p 110

Quote

‘Yes. Quick Ben caught hints – there’s much more than simply an ascendant’s blood to what you’ve become.’ Whiskeyjack hesitated, then said, ‘Silverfox has fashioned for you a Rhivi name. Jen’isand Rul.’ ‘Jen’isand Rul.’ ‘It translates as “the Wanderer within the Sword”. It means, she says, that you have done something no other creature has ever done – mortal or ascendant – and that something has set you apart. You have been marked, Ganoes Paran – yet no-one, not even Silverfox, knows what it portends. Tell me what happened.’

I'd forgotten this part and then it reminded me of our old moderator Folken/Jen'isand Rul. Ah memories.

[Aptorian]

This connection between Paran and tattersail is a bit of a reach. They knew each other for a week and the attraction was fleeting.

[Aptorian]

P. 120

Quote

‘I have thought long and hard on this, Paran. Anomander Rake is Knight of the House of Dark,’ she said, ‘yet where is the House itself ? Before all else there was Dark, the Mother who birthed all. So it must be an ancient place, a Hold, or perhaps something that came before Holds themselves. A focus for the gate into Kurald Galain … undiscovered, hidden, the First Wound, with a soul trapped in its maw, thus sealing it.’ ‘A soul,’ Paran murmured, a chill clambering up his spine, ‘or a legion of souls …’ The breath hissed from Silverfox. ‘Before Houses there were Holds,’ Paran continued with remorseless logic. ‘Both fixed, both stationary. Settled. Before settlement … there was wandering. House from Hold, Hold from … a gate in motion, ceaseless motion …’ He squeezed shut his eyes. ‘A wagon, burdened beneath the countless souls sealing the gate into Dark …’ And I sent two Hounds through that wound, I saw the seal punctured … by the Abyss …

P. 121

Quote

In his mind he returned to that fraught, nightmarish realm within the sword Dragnipur, the legions of chained souls ceaselessly dragging their impossible burden … and at the heart of the wagon, a cold, dark void, from whence came the chains. The wagon carries the gate, the gate into Kurald Galain, the warren of Darkness. The sword gathers souls to seal it … such a wound it must be, to demand so many souls … He grunted at a wave of pain. Silverfox’s small hand reached up to touch his arm.

I don't recall this notion that the gate into Darkness is a wound or that there is a need for souls to seal it. I mean maybe Paran and Silverfox are just talking out of their ass but, let's say it's true, is Mother Dark that soul?

[Traveller]

I noticed that, but I think it is just conjecture on their part; mostly correct, but wrong in the assumption about the seal. He saw it and assumed it was a wound, when in fact it's the actual only way into Kurald Galain - something no one is supposed to know about.

Cause we know that the souls are to keep the wagon moving away from chaos, not seal the gate - only the hounds ever cross that threshold, all the other slain are pulling or heaped up on it.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 09 March 2020 - 05:51 PM

[Aptorian]

P. 131

Quote

A new voice, rasping and cold, now spoke. ‘Blacksword.’ They turned to see Mok facing them. ‘That was centuries ago,’ Lady Envy said. ‘The memory of worthy opponents does not fade among the Seguleh, mistress.’ ‘Rake said the last swordsman he faced wore a mask with seven symbols.’ Mok tilted his head. ‘That mask still awaits him. Blacksword holds the Seventh position. Mistress, we would have him claim it.’

Ah yes. That typo that has led the forum to debate whether Rake is the 7th or 8th for two decades.

[Aptorian]

These segments with Caladan Brood. I don't understand why Erikson made him an Azathanai later on. It makes his lack of knowledge and insight unbelievable in retrospect.

[Cyphon]

Aptorian, on 09 March 2020 - 04:40 PM, said:

This connection between Paran and tattersail is a bit of a reach. They knew each other for a week and the attraction was fleeting.

Later he does reflect that its bonkers, and that he was infatuated whereas Tattersail was more mature therefore not seeing it as all that. I'd suppose that we could speculate that the conglomerate Silverfox manipulated the connection to gain security in the early days.

[Abyss]

Aptorian, on 09 March 2020 - 04:40 PM, said:

This connection between Paran and tattersail is a bit of a reach. They knew each other for a week and the attraction was fleeting.

Clearly the sex was just THAT epic.


...also, Nightchill manipulation.

[Abyss]

Aptorian, on 09 March 2020 - 06:27 PM, said:

These segments with Caladan Brood. I don't understand why Erikson made him an Azathanai later on. It makes his lack of knowledge and insight unbelievable in retrospect.

Disagree. We know whatever happened to the surviving Azathanii between Kharkanas and events in the MBF their memories and even personalities may have drastically shifted.

[Aptorian]

Memories and power? Perhaps. But if Brood is an elder God you'd expect that he would be able to see everything that hides within Silverfox. His discussion with the Mhybe suggests a surprising lack of understanding of magic and the Tlan Imass.

[Aptorian]

P. 148-150

(Excuse the copy paste formatting)

Quote

Four figures leaned on the table above her, whispering and muttering. The muted clatter of wooden cards echoed through to Crone, and she cocked her head. ‘There it is again,’ a gravelly-voiced woman said. ‘You sure you shuffled the damned things, Spin?’ ‘Will you – of course I did, Corporal. Stop asking me. Look, four times now, different laying of the fields every one, and it’s simple. Obelisk dominates – the dolmen of time is the core. It’s active, plain as day – the first time in decades …’ ‘Could still be that untoward skew,’ another voice interjected. ‘You ain’t got Fid’s natural hand, Spin—’ ‘Enough of that, Hedge,’ the corporal snapped. ‘Spindle’s done enough readings to be the real thing, trust me.’ ‘Didn’t you just—’ ‘Shut up.’ ‘Besides,’ Spindle muttered, ‘I told you already, the new card’s got a fixed influence – it’s the glue holding everything together, and once you see that it all makes sense.’ ‘The glue, you said,’ the fourth and final voice – also a woman’s – mused. ‘Linked to a new ascendant, you think?’ ‘Beats me, Blend,’ Spindle sighed. ‘I said a fixed influence, but I didn’t say I knew the aspect of that influence. I don’t know, and not because I’m not good enough. It’s like it hasn’t … woken up yet. A passive presence, for the moment. Nothing more than that. When it does awaken … well, things should heat up nicely, is my guess.’ ‘So,’ the corporal said, ‘what are we looking at here, mage?’ ‘Same as before. Soldier of High House Death’s right-hand to Obelisk. Magi of Shadow’s here – first time for that one, too – a grand deception’s at work, is my guess. The Captain of High House Light holds out some hope, but it’s shaded by Hood’s Herald – though not directly, there’s a distance there, I think. The Assassin of High House Shadow seems to have acquired a new face, I’m getting hints of it … bloody familiar, that face.’ The one named Hedge grunted. ‘Should bring Quick Ben in on this—’ ‘That’s it!’ Spindle hissed. ‘The Assassin’s face – it’s Kalam!’ ‘Bastard!’ Hedge growled. ‘I’d suspected as much – him and Fid paddling off the way they did – you know what this means, don’t you …’ ‘We can guess,’ the corporal said, sounding unhappy. ‘But the other thing’s clear, Spin, isn’t it?’ ‘Aye. Seven Cities is about to rise – may have already. The Whirlwind … Hood must be smiling right now. Smiling something fierce.’ ‘I got some questions for Quick Ben,’ Hedge muttered. ‘Don’t I just.’ ‘You should ask him about the new card, too,’ Spindle said. ‘If he don’t mind crawling, let him take a look.’ ‘Aye …’ A new card of the Deck of Dragons? Crone cocked her head up farther, thinking furiously. New cards were trouble, especially ones with power. The House of Shadow was proof enough of that … Her eyes – one, then, as she further cocked her head, the other – slowly focused, her mind dragged back from its abstracted realm, fixing at last on the underside of the table. To find a pair of human eyes, the paint glittering as if alive, staring back down at her.

This reading of the deck is obviously related to Deadhouse Gates but there's a few cards I can't place.

Who is Obelisk again? Krul? Burn? Dolmen of time is Icarium.

The Soldier of High House Death is the right-hand to Obelisk. I was assuming Fiddler could be the soldier but doesn't fit. If Obelisk is Burn could it be Quick Ben? I feel like it has to be a character in DG. Baudin? Mappo?

Magi is Pust.

"The Captain of High House Light holds out some hope, but it’s shaded by Hood’s Herald – though not directly, there’s a distance there, I think." - This could either be Loric or somebody from the Silanda I assume? Who's Hood's Herald then?

[Cyphon]

Soldier of Death is Baudin.

Herald of Death at this point is Gethol.

[Aptorian]

Cyphon, on 10 March 2020 - 08:32 AM, said:

Soldier of Death is Baudin.

Herald of Death at this point is Gethol.

These are the actual people in the actual house (Baudin hasn't been recruited just yet I think?) however, I got the impression this was a reading about people fulfilling the role of that position in the house. Remember, a card in play is not necessarily representing the actual placeholder in the house but rather the role or mechanism.

[Macros]

Baudin is by the end of MoI anyway afair.

About 150ish pages in. A lot I had forgotten. But Aranthos' real id is practically screaming off the page

[Traveller]

Aptorian, on 10 March 2020 - 09:50 AM, said:

Cyphon, on 10 March 2020 - 08:32 AM, said:

Soldier of Death is Baudin.

Herald of Death at this point is Gethol.

These are the actual people in the actual house (Baudin hasn't been recruited just yet I think?) however, I got the impression this was a reading about people fulfilling the role of that position in the house. Remember, a card in play is not necessarily representing the actual placeholder in the house but rather the role or mechanism.

Just read this from a bit later on. Just further clarification on how exactly people end up with their roles in the various houses.

"Understand, Kallor, that the Crippled God now casts the House of Chains into the world, indeed, abandons it to its fate. Survival depends on those who come to the titles it contains. Some of those the Chained One can influence – though never directly – whilst others, such as that of King of High House Chains, must be freely assumed.’"

So it looks like some roles are chosen, some influenced, and some have to be willingly taken on.

[Macros]

Page 254. After Kerulis meeting in Soaltan.

Harllos joke about staringnif he saw Stonny with a baby, never caught that before dark fortelling for TtH