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Twilight Imperium (III) - Signup Thread

#21 User is offline   Morgoth 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 11:28 AM

View PostTattersail_, on 22 January 2019 - 10:52 AM, said:

How do the Arborec produce infantry? It doesn't say anywhere. It says spacedocks cannot produce them.


Their infantry has production.

Someone said it stacks, so if you have 5 infantry and a spacedocks on a planet with 2 resources you could build 9 units? If you had 7 infantry and a spacedock you could build a War Sun?


No, that's not how it works. The Arborec doesn't need space docks. 2 soldiers can build 2 units, or 4 if you have the upgraded warriors. You still need resources from planets. A single Letani Warrior can build a war sun. Didn't you pay any attention to me last game? I am insulted and hurt!
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#22 User is offline   Khellendros 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 11:36 AM

View PostMorgoth, on 22 January 2019 - 09:12 AM, said:

View PostImperial Historian, on 22 January 2019 - 08:33 AM, said:

I liked the sound of the random placement variant, ie we build the map but no one picks where they start. Gives everyone an incentive to make sure the map construction is 'fair'.


When my group plays we usually build the map first, and then let people chose either starting position or race, and the last person gets to chose both before it goes back. So the first to chose race/position is also the last to chose race/position.

But any system we pick is fine by me.

I think maybe i'd like to try the Barony of Letvenev if they're available when selection comes around to me.


I quite like the sound of that system.

If I was playing, the Barony was what I would have gone for.
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#23 User is offline   Tattersail_ 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 11:39 AM

View PostMorgoth, on 22 January 2019 - 11:28 AM, said:

View PostTattersail_, on 22 January 2019 - 10:52 AM, said:

How do the Arborec produce infantry? It doesn't say anywhere. It says spacedocks cannot produce them.


Their infantry has production.

Someone said it stacks, so if you have 5 infantry and a spacedocks on a planet with 2 resources you could build 9 units? If you had 7 infantry and a spacedock you could build a War Sun?


No, that's not how it works. The Arborec doesn't need space docks. 2 soldiers can build 2 units, or 4 if you have the upgraded warriors. You still need resources from planets. A single Letani Warrior can build a war sun. Didn't you pay any attention to me last game? I am insulted and hurt!



I still didn't understand it to be fair. I just assumed if you did anything wrong then D'rek/IH would pick up on it.
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#24 User is offline   Khellendros 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM

1) How would people like to try the Age of Empire variant where all 10 POs are revealed at the start of the game? I'm totally not suggesting that because I think it will make the game go faster :p

2) Speaking of faster games, shall we go back to 11VPs? I agree that it makes War Suns less likely, but I also think that War Suns are a thing you're supposed to commit to quite early on if you really do want them.


3) I was also thinking of letting you guys create your own map shape - up to a point. The first two rings would still be rings, but after that you can add in any direction you choose. This would rely on you still being sensible and not just creating one long snake :) Or would you prefer to stick with the tried-and-tested layout?

4) Khell's personal variant: No Support for the Throne PNs. Lowers the likelihood of long-term stable (and stale) alliances. Thoughts?
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#25 User is offline   Khellendros 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:25 PM

I should also let you all know that I will be 'randomly' giving you the secret objectives which are least suited to your own strengths at any given moment.
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#26 User is offline   D'rek 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:28 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

1) How would people like to try the Age of Empire variant where all 10 POs are revealed at the start of the game? I'm totally not suggesting that because I think it will make the game go faster :p

2) Speaking of faster games, shall we go back to 11VPs? I agree that it makes War Suns less likely, but I also think that War Suns are a thing you're supposed to commit to quite early on if you really do want them.


Age of Empire and 11VP is fine by me!


View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

3) I was also thinking of letting you guys create your own map shape - up to a point. The first two rings would still be rings, but after that you can add in any direction you choose. This would rely on you still being sensible and not just creating one long snake :p Or would you prefer to stick with the tried-and-tested layout?


Perhaps a rule that (after the first ring) all hexes placed must be next to two (or more) already-placed hexes? That'll prevent snakes.

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

4) Khell's personal variant: No Support for the Throne PNs. Lowers the likelihood of long-term stable (and stale) alliances. Thoughts?


Not sure if I think it'd be a good change or not, but either way I'm willing to give it a try and we can always go back later. Might elongate the game a little bit, mind you.


View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:25 PM, said:

I should also let you all know that I will be 'randomly' giving you the secret objectives which are least suited to your own strengths at any given moment.


Hahahah, fun :)

View Postworrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.
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#27 User is offline   Blend 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:35 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:25 PM, said:

I should also let you all know that I will be 'randomly' giving you the secret objectives which are least suited to your own strengths at any given moment.


LoL
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#28 User is offline   Tattersail_ 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:42 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

1) How would people like to try the Age of Empire variant where all 10 POs are revealed at the start of the game? I'm totally not suggesting that because I think it will make the game go faster :p


This would prevent some of us for preparing for objectives that may never come up but at the same time the unknowing is quite good as it doesn't give people a clear route from start to finish.
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#29 User is offline   Blend 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 02:46 PM

I'd certainly be willing to give the Age of Empires thing a try, definitely agree with 11VP.

I've no preference for how the map is built - yall indulged me last session, so I'll go with however you want to do it!

Taking out the SftT PNs is an interesting idea. It would certainly change alliance dynamics.
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#30 User is offline   Blend 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 03:11 PM

View PostTattersail_, on 22 January 2019 - 09:16 AM, said:

I like Muatt starting with a war sun but Blend likes them too :p


Well, if you get a higher initiative count for choosing your race than I do, I won't have any hard feelings if you decide to use them - there are a lot of races I'd like to try out, but Muaat are the ones I wanna try the most! :)
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#31 User is offline   twelve 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 03:29 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 02:19 PM, said:

1) How would people like to try the Age of Empire variant where all 10 POs are revealed at the start of the game? I'm totally not suggesting that because I think it will make the game go faster :p


I like the mystery of not knowing personally but I'd still play if you go Age of Empire. Will make planning a whole lot easier.

Quote


2) Speaking of faster games, shall we go back to 11VPs? I agree that it makes War Suns less likely, but I also think that War Suns are a thing you're supposed to commit to quite early on if you really do want them.


I'm all for shorter games but I'm more partial to 12 than 11 points personally

Quote

3) I was also thinking of letting you guys create your own map shape - up to a point. The first two rings would still be rings, but after that you can add in any direction you choose. This would rely on you still being sensible and not just creating one long snake :) Or would you prefer to stick with the tried-and-tested layout?


D'reks suggestion would work if you want to try this.

Quote

4) Khell's personal variant: No Support for the Throne PNs. Lowers the likelihood of long-term stable (and stale) alliances. Thoughts?


How about putting a 2 or 3 round hold on being about to use it with your neighbors. Or just disallow the exchange of Support for the Throne. PNs. Make the trade of it be one sided and th e other party has to receive something else. I think the PN has too much trade value to completely ban but there should be some tweaking to the use of the PN to help minimize the lack of conflict among neighbors.
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#32 User is offline   Imperial Historian 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 05:07 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 11:36 AM, said:

View PostMorgoth, on 22 January 2019 - 09:12 AM, said:

View PostImperial Historian, on 22 January 2019 - 08:33 AM, said:

I liked the sound of the random placement variant, ie we build the map but no one picks where they start. Gives everyone an incentive to make sure the map construction is 'fair'.


When my group plays we usually build the map first, and then let people chose either starting position or race, and the last person gets to chose both before it goes back. So the first to chose race/position is also the last to chose race/position.

But any system we pick is fine by me.

I think maybe i'd like to try the Barony of Letvenev if they're available when selection comes around to me.


I quite like the sound of that system.

If I was playing, the Barony was what I would have gone for.


In this system who gets to start as speaker?
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#33 User is offline   Khellendros 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 05:36 PM

Giving it some further thought re build-your-own-layout, while it would be cool in a table game, in a forum game it probably takes too much time even with Dírekís amendment, as you will want to see what the map looks like after each tile is put down so that you know the current shape and viable placements. While I could do that thereís no guarantee the map update will always be speedy. Whereas with the predesignated layout you know which spots have been taken even without an immediate update.
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#34 User is offline   Blend 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 06:30 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

Giving it some further thought re build-your-own-layout, while it would be cool in a table game, in a forum game it probably takes too much time even with Dírekís amendment, as you will want to see what the map looks like after each tile is put down so that you know the current shape and viable placements. While I could do that thereís no guarantee the map update will always be speedy. Whereas with the predesignated layout you know which spots have been taken even without an immediate update.


The thing about the pre-designated layout is that there isn't technically one for a 9 person game as TI4 is built for 3-6 players.

Drek has a lot of ideas about map layout design, though, so I would recommend chatting with her about it.
There is no struggle too vast, no odds too overwhelming, for even should we fail - should we fall - we will know that we have lived. ~ Anomander Rake
My sig comes from a game in which I didn't heed Blend's advice. So maybe this time I should. ~ Khellendros
I'm just going to have to come to terms with the fact that self-vote suiciding will forever be referred to as "pulling a JPK" now, aren't I? ~ JPK
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#35 User is offline   D'rek 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 08:00 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

Giving it some further thought re build-your-own-layout, while it would be cool in a table game, in a forum game it probably takes too much time even with Dírekís amendment, as you will want to see what the map looks like after each tile is put down so that you know the current shape and viable placements. While I could do that thereís no guarantee the map update will always be speedy. Whereas with the predesignated layout you know which spots have been taken even without an immediate update.


Other than knowing which hexes are in the hands of which players, there's no hidden info in building the map so anyone could do the map updates. And with the last game, Blend wasn't doing a full map update after every placement, it was enough to have a labelled grid and posting the images of hexes as they were placed so we could puzzle it together in our heads (and likewise anyone could be the one posting those images). I don't see that it would really be any different in map update labour than setting up the galaxy in game 2 was.

View Postworrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.
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#36 User is offline   Tapper 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 08:45 PM

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

Giving it some further thought re build-your-own-layout, while it would be cool in a table game, in a forum game it probably takes too much time even with Dírekís amendment, as you will want to see what the map looks like after each tile is put down so that you know the current shape and viable placements. While I could do that thereís no guarantee the map update will always be speedy. Whereas with the predesignated layout you know which spots have been taken even without an immediate update.

What about giving players the opportunity to each design a "pizza slice" of space by giving each a roughly equivalent # of production and influence on planets, plus enough empty hexes and anomalies to fill that slice from ring 1 to the home planets?

Once the slices are built, we can then randomize starting order and move to the "select a race/ starting position" draft.

That way, building a sector in such a way it is guaranteed to fuck with its owner (say, only empty hexes around the starting planet) likw it happened to Twelve last game could backfire spectacularly as you may end up with it yourself; building something okay but not great would be a better option.

The result would probably look somewhat like D'rek's initial map, in which each race also had natural dominion over 2-3 systems and would in addition have 2-3 systems it would have to compete for/ negotiate over with neighbours.

Building the map would be fairly straightforward, too, since one would not have to wait a couple of days before the next hex, nor would negotiation across time zones be necessary.
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#37 User is offline   Morgoth 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 09:43 PM

I don't think allowing for long corridors, or arms, would be a good idea. There's a lot of mobility to this game, and being able to make choke points would damage the flow of the game and make the positions more static I think.

I like 12 points as suggested by twelve. I think I'd prefer objectives revealed on a pr round basis as to provide a little more unpredictability, but would be perfectly fine with Khell's option too.
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#38 User is offline   Tattersail_ 

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Posted 22 January 2019 - 09:48 PM

I like th ee pizza slice idea too, not knowing which slice you'll get.
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#39 User is offline   D'rek 

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Posted 23 January 2019 - 01:24 AM

View PostTapper, on 22 January 2019 - 08:45 PM, said:

View PostKhellendros, on 22 January 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

Giving it some further thought re build-your-own-layout, while it would be cool in a table game, in a forum game it probably takes too much time even with D’rek’s amendment, as you will want to see what the map looks like after each tile is put down so that you know the current shape and viable placements. While I could do that there’s no guarantee the map update will always be speedy. Whereas with the predesignated layout you know which spots have been taken even without an immediate update.

What about giving players the opportunity to each design a "pizza slice" of space by giving each a roughly equivalent # of production and influence on planets, plus enough empty hexes and anomalies to fill that slice from ring 1 to the home planets?

Once the slices are built, we can then randomize starting order and move to the "select a race/ starting position" draft.

That way, building a sector in such a way it is guaranteed to fuck with its owner (say, only empty hexes around the starting planet) likw it happened to Twelve last game could backfire spectacularly as you may end up with it yourself; building something okay but not great would be a better option.

The result would probably look somewhat like D'rek's initial map, in which each race also had natural dominion over 2-3 systems and would in addition have 2-3 systems it would have to compete for/ negotiate over with neighbours.

Building the map would be fairly straightforward, too, since one would not have to wait a couple of days before the next hex, nor would negotiation across time zones be necessary.


That could work too. It's hard to do "pizza slices" with 9 players on hexagons, but something like this?

Posted Image

Since you're not necessarily constructing a region for yourself, I guess it's not a big deal that the regions aren't actually slice shaped

Khell might have to edit the submitted slices a bit if for example the anomalies completely block someone off by chance, but that's not a problem.

View Postworrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.
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#40 User is offline   Gnaw 

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Posted 23 January 2019 - 05:51 AM

I would like to play. However there is a possibility that I would have to bow out the first of March, essentially committing racial suicide. Leave it up to all yíall.

*shrug*
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