[Tapper]

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

Although it makes sense to go for D'rek or Morgoth from an action card discard perspective for the public execution, having IH get it would give me one extra option at the strategy card phase as the Speaker token would pass to Morgoth.

In other words, I'm open to bribes

Are you sure it would pass the Speaker token to Morgoth?
The way we have handled passing to the left or right so far is in the order of the Strategy choices as per the OP instead of as physical neighbours (which would be passing the Speaker token from IH to D'rek, not from IH to Morgoth, thereby actually postponing your strategy selection - and mine).

[Khellendros]

Tapper, on 12 September 2018 - 02:40 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

Although it makes sense to go for D'rek or Morgoth from an action card discard perspective for the public execution, having IH get it would give me one extra option at the strategy card phase as the Speaker token would pass to Morgoth.

In other words, I'm open to bribes

Are you sure it would pass the Speaker token to Morgoth?
The way we have handled passing to the left or right so far is in the order of the Strategy choices as per the OP instead of as physical neighbours (which would be passing the Speaker token from IH to D'rek, not from IH to Morgoth, thereby actually postponing your strategy selection - and mine).

No, it's the same thing in this case - Morgoth is 'to the left' of IH both on the map and in the initial strategy order. Put those names in a circle and you will see - remember we're not looking at the names, we are the names


Edit: To simplify it further, 'to the left' is pretty much always board game shorthand for the next person's turn.

This post has been edited by Khellendros: 12 September 2018 - 02:45 PM

[twelve]

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

[Tattersail_]

Tapper, on 12 September 2018 - 02:40 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

Although it makes sense to go for D'rek or Morgoth from an action card discard perspective for the public execution, having IH get it would give me one extra option at the strategy card phase as the Speaker token would pass to Morgoth.

In other words, I'm open to bribes

Are you sure it would pass the Speaker token to Morgoth?
The way we have handled passing to the left or right so far is in the order of the Strategy choices as per the OP instead of as physical neighbours (which would be passing the Speaker token from IH to D'rek, not from IH to Morgoth, thereby actually postponing your strategy selection - and mine).

IH then Morgoth then Gnaw is a clockwise rotation, passing to the left if sat at a table is also a clockwise rotation, that is how Blend posted it earlier.

[Khellendros]

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

Well, twelve, I have wanted to work with you for a long time now, so I will add weight to this threat. Either you get Gnaw on board, or I'll ally with Twelve for some fireworks.

[Tattersail_]

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

I could not include Gnaw in my negotiation could I? Do you like my proposal from a you and me perspective?

Ask Gnaw about his planets.

As to the battle of Thibah, of course I have you to win, but not without losses and you'd have to commit more ships than what you were planning. Moving all ships out first turn was so that you can move in with little effort AND due to you only having two actions.


As for the SftT, it should take away your worries of me attacking you. My proposal was fairly close what you offered in the first place.

[Tattersail_]

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:50 PM, said:

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

Well, twelve, I have wanted to work with you for a long time now, so I will add weight to this threat. Either you get Gnaw on board, or I'll ally with Twelve for some fireworks.

And break our deal?

[Khellendros]

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 02:51 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:50 PM, said:

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

Well, twelve, I have wanted to work with you for a long time now, so I will add weight to this threat. Either you get Gnaw on board, or I'll ally with Twelve for some fireworks.

And break our deal?

You mean the deal where I don't attack you if you don't annoy me? You said you're going to take Imperial, that annoys me. You want the Crown of Emphidia, that annoys me.

[Tattersail_]

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:52 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 02:51 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:50 PM, said:

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 02:44 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 07:39 AM, said:

Firstly if you attack Thibah with my ships and infantry there then it'll be a lot harder for you to take the planet and you may lose ships. I was planning on taking Imperial and getting the expand borders VP in this round and go for another VP later in the round. However if we are going to make a deal that will disrupt my plans significantly. So I will give a proposal back that hopefully suits us both, short and long term.


You give me your support for the Throne, which ensures I'll not be attacking you again this game and nets me a VP
You give me a trade PN equivalent to 4TG's

I give you Gnaw's Ceasefire
My trade PN which nets you +2TG
I give you 1 action card per round for 3 rounds starting this round.

I move all my ships and infantry out of Thibah on my first turn, hopefully after D'rek has moved her dread or if I go before her then into the empty hex with Gnaw's destroyer and i'll pay him the 1 TG for the loss.

I will agree to not cross past the west border of Sakalug extended North without negotiating in advance. You also agree to not move east of traded system without permission. I do not require your ceasefire PN as you can keep that to negotiate future deals. I trust that you'll keep your word as you've been a stickler for adhering to deals.

If you help me gain the Crown Agenda then that'd be a bonus but I don't expect you to. The VP from your SftT is adequate enough as I was only planning 1 VP this round.

The simulator has me winning the space fight 100 percent of the time and the invasion combat 95 percent of the time. Though I didn't need the simulator to tell I had you beat hands down in the space flight nor tell you that my bombardment would have given me a nice advantage in the ground fight. My deal was to allow you to leave with most of your fleet still intact and allow me to use my fleet to hopefully regain everything Gnaw took from me in as quickly a period of time as possible. And though I'm not thrilled with your counter proposal I could make it work with some tweaking but without Gnaw getting on board as well I might as well go for broke and ruin your game as you two have done mine.

As for your loss of points this round that is more due to your poor awareness of the situation that you currently find yourself in. I could just as easily make a deal with Khell for the crown and my SFTT and we double team you and drive you to the brink of elimination. Khell gets your territories and 2 VP and I get my revenge on you. If I was a petty small minded person I should be making this deal. So I suggest you convince Gnaw to play nice or I'm taking my votes and SFTT to someone who is willing to help me and help themselves.

Well, twelve, I have wanted to work with you for a long time now, so I will add weight to this threat. Either you get Gnaw on board, or I'll ally with Twelve for some fireworks.

And break our deal?

You mean the deal where I don't attack you if you don't annoy me? You said you're going to take Imperial, that annoys me. You want the Crown of Emphidia, that annoys me.

We leave each other alone unless provoked. Anyone could take Imperial and the deal with Twelve means I won't be taking it, so the deal should satisfy you. Yes I want the crown but so should everyone, IF Twelve gives me his SftT then it is not as big a deal as I'd have the VP I was looking for. So either of these two things are not in conflict with you and yours.

[twelve]

Tatts, at work so will need to think. I'm also a bit confused as to the whole trade agreement exchange so will need to spend time going over your whole proposal to 1 be sure I understand everything and 2 figure out what I agree with. I know I will want to do some tweaking but I think we can come to some sort of agreement.

[Tattersail_]

twelve, on 12 September 2018 - 03:11 PM, said:

Tatts, at work so will need to think. I'm also a bit confused as to the whole trade agreement exchange so will need to spend time going over your whole proposal to 1 be sure I understand everything and 2 figure out what I agree with. I know I will want to do some tweaking but I think we can come to some sort of agreement.

My trade PN is worth 6tg's, whereas I was asking for 4 off you, that and the 3 actions cards I thought was a stellar offer.

I will even show you one of the action cards before you make a decision.

[D'rek]

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

Although it makes sense to go for D'rek or Morgoth from an action card discard perspective

Nom and Tapper both have full AC hands, too. Nom in particular has that dreaded Experimental Battlestation card.

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

for the public execution, having IH get it would give me one extra option at the strategy card phase as the Speaker token would pass to Morgoth.

In other words, I'm open to bribes

IH has Speaker currently and (iirc) wants TECH. Given his current tech tree he'll probably go for Light-Wave Deflector and Carrier 2 so that (with wormhole generator and slipstream for 3 movement) he can move his entire fleet to virtually anywhere. This also sets him up for several possible stage 2 objectives (3 unit upgrades, controlling homeworld planets, etc).

Morgoth is 2nd pick and wants LEADERSHIP so he can fulfill the 6-CTs objective.


So let's say IH is the target of Public Execution.


IH is now last SC pick, so he definitely won't get Tech. He will probably still research one of the two above technologies with the secondary, but with only 1 of them such extreme mobility will be hampered for at least one round, more like 2.

Morgoth gets first pick. He chooses LEADERSHIP. I play Public Disgrace and he repicks. Now, he said before that in that case he would just take POLITICS and reset things for next round, in which case so be it, everyone downstream will be happier for still having LEADERSHIP and TECH available as picks. I don't think he actually will, though, because since he wasn't executed he already has 7 ACs, the 2 more from POLITICS is wasteful unless he has 2 he really wants to play early, plus he can't make himself Speaker so it's back to IH.

Instead, I think he'll take TECH, TRADE, or CONSTRUCTION, none of which are earth-shattering for the rest of us. And most importantly, it lets POLITICS come downstream again for someone in the middle to pick and break the trend of it always being around IH and Morgoth.


Overall, I think it's worthwhile, it hampers 2 leading players and opens up more options for everyone else.

[Imperial Historian]

Tapper, on 12 September 2018 - 02:35 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 02:28 PM, said:

Quote

Initiative Order: Drek > Twelve > Morgoth > Khellendros > Tattersail > Tapper > IH > Gnaw > Nom

Tapper's turn

Done, all up to IH now.

Will post after work.

[Gnaw]

D, on 12 September 2018 - 03:25 PM, said:

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

Although it makes sense to go for D'rek or Morgoth from an action card discard perspective

Nom and Tapper both have full AC hands, too. Nom in particular has that dreaded Experimental Battlestation card.

Khellendros, on 12 September 2018 - 02:18 PM, said:

for the public execution, having IH get it would give me one extra option at the strategy card phase as the Speaker token would pass to Morgoth.

In other words, I'm open to bribes

Blah, blah, blah, please don’t pick me, blah, blah.

FTFY.

[D'rek]

Gnaw, on 12 September 2018 - 03:33 PM, said:

lol I'm so quirky I'm not even playing to win lol the cake is a lie guys lololol

FTFY

[Tattersail_]

Gnaw, D'rek isn't in the lead and what she says makes sense. You have a powerful voting block so maybe convinced to vote a certain way? A little present for you? I don't know.

[Tattersail_]

If you could gain leadership and me technology on this next turn then that'd be awesome.

[Gnaw]

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 03:40 PM, said:

If you could gain leadership and me technology on this next turn then that'd be awesome.

D’rek has public disgrace. I’d rather see that go away in a way other than used on me.

[Tattersail_]

Gnaw, on 12 September 2018 - 03:53 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 12 September 2018 - 03:40 PM, said:

If you could gain leadership and me technology on this next turn then that'd be awesome.

D'rek has public disgrace. I'd rather see that go away in a way other than used on me.

Why would she use it on you?

[Tattersail_]

and isn't that what negotiation is for ?