[Malankazooie]

US men's national team fails to qualify for the World Cup. Last time we didn't qualify was 1986. Groove thoroughly messed with.

[Tiste Simeon]

Out of Portugal, Argentina and the Netherlands, the one team I'd have liked to see in went out and the two I wanted to drop out got in...

[Morgoth]

The Netherlands have something weird going on these days. Their league is also doing poorly all of the sudden.

Norway was out long ago. Our team, though never particularly good, at least used to qualify for the European and world cup. Still, there seem to be some signs of a positive change, probably mainly as a result of them bringing in the former Icelandic head coach to deal with it.

[Gorefest]

It is the legacy of Total Football finally ending up biting us in the ass. We have a whole generation of players and coaches who grew up on the philosophy of Cruijff and Total Football, which elevates technique over tactics and wants players to be able to do everything regardless of their position on the pitch. Sadly, international football has moved on and these days you need stamina and you need specialists over all-rounders. Our national style of play is naive and outdated but nobody, from players to coaches to pundits, knows any different and still passionately preaches the total football philosophy. It is not a coincidence that the last time we had decent international success was in 2014 when we came 3rd in the world cup, with Van Gaal as coach who is the polar opposite of Cruijff and always had arguments about football philosophy with Cruijff and his many many supporters. We played very 'un-Dutch' with 5 defenders and defensive play and everyone in the Netherlands hated it and rejected it and it made us 3rd.

Add to that a very weak FA without any vision and an absolutely abysmal coach in Danny Blind who only selected Ajax players for the national team even if they hadnt played competitive football in ages, and you have a recipe for total disaster. The only thing I cling to at the moment is that our youth teams are doing pretty good internationally, so hopefully by 2020 we will see a bit of a resurgence. But for now I will dwell on my memories of 1988 and of the Bergkamp years. Never to return. Total Football is dead and buried as a concept in modern-day football. The Van Gaals and the Mourhinos of the football world dictate the style of play now.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 11 October 2017 - 07:52 PM

[Khazduk]

Nigel de Jong's karate assault on Alonso was under Marwijk, right? And even closer to winning the WC in 2010... but that was way past cynical.

[Tattersail_]

The only player of almost world class ability the Netherlands have is Gini Wijnaldum. FFS they still play Sneider

[Khazduk]

I'm a Spurs fan (blame Gazza/Hoddle/FA cup 1991), I'd still take a semi-retired Rafa VDV from the Danish league over Vincent Janssen any day even now.

[Gorefest]

Khazduk, on 12 October 2017 - 11:51 AM, said:

Nigel de Jong's karate assault on Alonso was under Marwijk, right? And even closer to winning the WC in 2010... but that was way past cynical.

Van Marwijk was also ‘un-Dutch’ and everyone in the Netherlands complained about how the team was playing at the time, despite the results. This is the big mental issuein the Netherlands. Winning is not enough, it needs to be with pretty football as well. In good 1974 tradition the overall consensus is that it is better to lose in style than to win ugly. Sadly this has now degraded to the point where we are just losing ugly.

[Morgoth]

In the fantasy league things are chugging along at least. I decided not to trade Kane for Aguero or Morata. Turned out that was a good thing

[Malankazooie]

Bruce Arena stepped down as US men's coach. I didn't think he was the right pick to replace Jürgen Klinsmann to begin with. I sorta though it was a mistake to fire Klinsmann. While he had some unforgivable losses, he actually gathered more talent on to the team then we've seen for some time. He rubbed players and people the wrong way, but that was needed, imo.

Sigh. I wonder who they will hire next.

[Morgoth]

My choices for captain in this fantasy season has been terrible.

[Tapper]

Tattersail_, on 12 October 2017 - 01:11 PM, said:

The only player of almost world class ability the Netherlands have is Gini Wijnaldum. FFS they still play Sneider

Some of it is dumb luck. Pre-injuries, Strootman seemed to be on the fast track to being a great do-it-all midfielder, but he lost a couple of years. Quincy Promes is stuck in Russia where no-one knows him. Depay is doing fairly well in France now (6 goals in 11 matches in 2018) but all we remember is him playing without conviction at ManU.

Mostly though, we have talent that moved too quickly to a contender club and don't make it there, losing valuable development time or being sent out on loan to teams that don't play to their strengths. It is easy to be a cut or two above the level of our national competition, but the jump in quality from there to contender level clubs in Germany, Spain, England or Italy is no longer one step, but two.

Guys like Virgil Van Dijk (Groningen to Celtic to Southampton), Stefan de Vrij (now at Lazio) or Wijnaldum (Newcastle to Liverpool) took the necessary steps to be playing weekly, grow into a competition, getting ready for a top club (regardless of whether they have the quality - especially for Wijnaldum, Liverpool might be the end station).

The issue for the Dutch public, the analists and coaches is that these are players in their mid twenties occupying utility roles at clubs who are not televised on wednesday night. This disqualifies them in the eye of the public, even though they might make another step up in 1-3 years while playing a significant role in the national team for (the qualification for) three major tournaments.

[Tsundoku]

After a 0-0 result in Honduras' former world murder capital (yep, fuck you Hondurans) which should have been 1-0 to us, we have the return leg in a few days here.

Hopefully our habit of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory can be broken.

Then again, if we get knocked out of the WC finals, at least we won't have to endure the shame of playing in Russia.

[Tsundoku]

It gets better - Italy OUT!

Doesn't matter if we make it or not, Italy out is a bonus.

[Gorefest]

First time since 1958. Wow. And against a team who the Netherlands easily beat only last month. Makes that disallowed goal we had against Sweden in the first leg all the more sour.

[Tsundoku]

Gorefest, on 14 November 2017 - 07:58 AM, said:

First time since 1958. Wow. And against a team who the Netherlands easily beat only last month. Makes that disallowed goal we had against Sweden in the first leg all the more sour.

Sorry dude but I've always hated the way Italy plays, and 2006 still rankles.

Feel free to gloat to your heart's content when Australia inevitably collapses. For me, anything better than a good showing will be a bonus. And one hell of a pleasant surprise.

[Gorefest]

Tsundoku, on 14 November 2017 - 08:24 AM, said:

Sorry dude but I've always hated the way Italy plays, and 2006 still rankles.

Oh, no worries, I hate Italy as well. Almost as much as Portugal. Italy cost us the Euro 2000 final in horrible fashion (we missed 2 penalties in regular playing time, then went out on penalties in the end).

[Macros]

 23905363_845313238970541_1310106599583215011_n.jpg (18.61K)
Number of downloads: 0

This popped up on my Facebook and it reminded me of a conversation here a few years ago about players who were true greats.

I, obviously, fired George best into the mix and amph (an American, yes I went there, they do not understand football) said including besty was a joke. This offended me.

Yes I am drinking

And if best is good enough for Pele, fuck you amph!

[Malankazooie]

Looks like Group F is the "group of death". Agree or disagree? England should go through, no problem. Also, looks like Russia got one of them "hosts" favorable draws.

[Gorefest]

Dont think there really is a group of death this time. Not a single pool containing three teams of notable distinction.