[Gintokian]

Abyss, on 08 May 2018 - 06:50 PM, said:

Gintokian, on 08 May 2018 - 05:38 PM, said:

D, on 08 May 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

So, anyone else watch the Ontario leadership debate? I watched it this morning. Does Doug Ford actually have a platform? All this "I don't have a plan, but I'll do the best things" talk... at least Trump had the Wall promise (illogical or not). And Wynne sure made Horwath look good.

Also, the Star is reporting that the PCs paid actors to be Ford supporters.

$75 for 6 hours work? wow that's pretty terrible, is that not less than minimum wage ha. All these candidates are jokes it seems. No idea who to vote for.

I suspect this will come down to the lesser evil / the devil you know / who will likely screw the province up the least.

Well that's the question isn't it, who will screw the province up the least? All their platforms seem to suggest they'll all screw it up, how do we know which one is less?

[LinearPhilosopher]

the beauty of a parliamentary system is that if none of the candidate are great, simply vote for the #2 party and you might have a minority goverment which will stimy the worse the ruling party can do

[Gintokian]

LinearPhilosopher, on 08 May 2018 - 08:35 PM, said:

the beauty of a parliamentary system is that if none of the candidate are great, simply vote for the #2 party and you might have a minority goverment which will stimy the worse the ruling party can do

Ah but how do we know what the #2 party will be when they're all equally shitty?

[LinearPhilosopher]

Gintokian, on 08 May 2018 - 08:42 PM, said:

LinearPhilosopher, on 08 May 2018 - 08:35 PM, said:

the beauty of a parliamentary system is that if none of the candidate are great, simply vote for the #2 party and you might have a minority goverment which will stimy the worse the ruling party can do

Ah but how do we know what the #2 party will be when they're all equally shitty?

odds are decent its ndp

[Mentalist]

Gintokian, on 08 May 2018 - 05:38 PM, said:

D, on 08 May 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

So, anyone else watch the Ontario leadership debate? I watched it this morning. Does Doug Ford actually have a platform? All this "I don't have a plan, but I'll do the best things" talk... at least Trump had the Wall promise (illogical or not). And Wynne sure made Horwath look good.

Also, the Star is reporting that the PCs paid actors to be Ford supporters.

$75 for 6 hours work? wow that's pretty terrible, is that not less than minimum wage ha. All these candidates are jokes it seems. No idea who to vote for.

It's a pretty sad commentary on our economy when (just as in Ukraine), you get people willing to act as protesters for such meagre pay.

[Gintokian]

Mentalist, on 09 May 2018 - 11:15 AM, said:

Gintokian, on 08 May 2018 - 05:38 PM, said:

D, on 08 May 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

So, anyone else watch the Ontario leadership debate? I watched it this morning. Does Doug Ford actually have a platform? All this "I don't have a plan, but I'll do the best things" talk... at least Trump had the Wall promise (illogical or not). And Wynne sure made Horwath look good.

Also, the Star is reporting that the PCs paid actors to be Ford supporters.

$75 for 6 hours work? wow that's pretty terrible, is that not less than minimum wage ha. All these candidates are jokes it seems. No idea who to vote for.

It's a pretty sad commentary on our economy when (just as in Ukraine), you get people willing to act as protesters for such meagre pay.

For sure, it was only 20 people though and the guy who talked to the newspaper turned it down for moral reasons

[LinearPhilosopher]

Mentalist, on 09 May 2018 - 11:15 AM, said:

Gintokian, on 08 May 2018 - 05:38 PM, said:

D, on 08 May 2018 - 05:34 PM, said:

So, anyone else watch the Ontario leadership debate? I watched it this morning. Does Doug Ford actually have a platform? All this "I don't have a plan, but I'll do the best things" talk... at least Trump had the Wall promise (illogical or not). And Wynne sure made Horwath look good.

Also, the Star is reporting that the PCs paid actors to be Ford supporters.

$75 for 6 hours work? wow that's pretty terrible, is that not less than minimum wage ha. All these candidates are jokes it seems. No idea who to vote for.

It's a pretty sad commentary on our economy when (just as in Ukraine), you get people willing to act as protesters for such meagre pay.

That's 12.5 per hour, lower than the 14 min wage...(wich incidentally is the base rate for non-union background actors (14/hr))

[QuickTidal]

VoteCompass is active now for people to help with their platform choices.

https://votecompass....ca/ontario/home

[LinearPhilosopher]

QuickTidal, on 09 May 2018 - 04:51 PM, said:

VoteCompass is active now for people to help with their platform choices.

https://votecompass....ca/ontario/home

going through it now.

Is it bad i have no idea for most of these? There's context missing for some.

heck the one about renaming schools, not an easy question

"how much more should the wealthier pay taxes"

Gee idk... elasticity of taxation is highest at the higher end of income as those individuals can shift income around more easily...

"How much tax should corporations pay?"

Corporations aren't real people so due to flow through issues the only real tax burden happens when the wealth is xferred to individuals.

There are too many people working for government.

Public sector has a lower standard, but then again so do a lot of small companies, not a question of size, moreso management.

"Ontario should require that public corporations have a certain proportion of women on their boards."

There is going to need to be a lot of restrictions and caveats on that before i can even consider that. ( i interviewed at a publically trade comp of 6 people, none of them women, do they now have to higher a woman just because? That's discriminatory in of itself.)

This post has been edited by LinearPhilosopher: 09 May 2018 - 05:12 PM

[Nevyn]

QuickTidal, on 09 May 2018 - 04:51 PM, said:

VoteCompass is active now for people to help with their platform choices.

https://votecompass....ca/ontario/home

Did it, landed where I more or less expected and could not matter less.

If the PC's had picked Mulroney or Elliott I'd be voting them even if my compass landed right on the liberal dot. Because accountability, and because I hate craven, cynical governance.


But the picked Ford, so I'm going to vote Liberal unless I get a strong sense NDP can win in both my riding and provincially, at which time I'll look more closely at the damage I think their platform would do.


So for me, issue #1 is the Ford style of politics, and what acceptance of him says about us. Issue 2 is still accountability for the liberals, but I will need a plausible alternative to consider it.

[QuickTidal]

A small part of me is screaming that this should be the NDP's election to lose solely based off the Ford/Wynne hate. If Layton was still alive, that would happen. With it being Captain Beige-pants Horwath, I doubt it.

[Nevyn]

Layton was the federal leader.

Howard Hampton was Horvath's predecessor.

And the NDP still have headwinds not just from Horvath, but based on resentment (still) of the Rae government.

This post has been edited by Nevyn: 09 May 2018 - 07:08 PM

[Abyss]

My biggest fear is that anti-Wynne feels will throw enough votes to Horvath that Ford can ascend.

[LinearPhilosopher]

Abyss, on 09 May 2018 - 08:19 PM, said:

My biggest fear is that anti-Wynne feels will throw enough votes to Horvath that Ford can ascend.

this is happening regardless

[Abyss]

LinearPhilosopher, on 09 May 2018 - 08:27 PM, said:

Abyss, on 09 May 2018 - 08:19 PM, said:

My biggest fear is that anti-Wynne feels will throw enough votes to Horvath that Ford can ascend.

this is happening regardless

Sadly, most likely.

[Gintokian]

I really don't understand the logic in these 2 parties. If either one of them had decided to pick another candidate (i know it's not that easy) they would easily win a majority.
If the liberals got rid of wynne they'd easily win from how much everyone hates Ford and vice versa. Makes no sense to me.

[Mentalist]

Too many questions with no context. I took a cautious approach, qualifying each answer in my head. Which left me right in the middle on social issues, and sliiightly right of centre on economics. Obviously that doesn't mean I'll be voting PC (even though I expect it to be a pretty close call in my riding, with a decent chance of Libs losing)

I'm terrible at the 5-point scale tests.

Gintokian, on 09 May 2018 - 08:43 PM, said:

I really don't understand the logic in these 2 parties. If either one of them had decided to pick another candidate (i know it's not that easy) they would easily win a majority.
If the liberals got rid of wynne they'd easily win from how much everyone hates Ford and vice versa. Makes no sense to me.

Politicians don't often use human logic. That's why I prefer to vote for party, not the individual.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 09 May 2018 - 08:47 PM

[LinearPhilosopher]

Real talk, if ford gets elected whats our WCS

Gintokian, on 09 May 2018 - 08:43 PM, said:

I really don't understand the logic in these 2 parties. If either one of them had decided to pick another candidate (i know it's not that easy) they would easily win a majority.
If the liberals got rid of wynne they'd easily win from how much everyone hates Ford and vice versa. Makes no sense to me.

Because most politicians aren't machiavellian. Take JT, if he was machiavellian he woulda sided with the BC liberals in regards to the pipeline, rather than alberta (because alberta almost never votes red, wheras BC does)

This post has been edited by LinearPhilosopher: 09 May 2018 - 08:48 PM

[Mentalist]

LinearPhilosopher, on 09 May 2018 - 08:47 PM, said:

Real talk, if ford gets elected whats our WCS

Start a war and then surrender?

[EmperorMagus]

LinearPhilosopher, on 09 May 2018 - 08:47 PM, said:

Real talk, if ford gets elected whats our WCS

Gintokian, on 09 May 2018 - 08:43 PM, said:

I really don't understand the logic in these 2 parties. If either one of them had decided to pick another candidate (i know it's not that easy) they would easily win a majority.
If the liberals got rid of wynne they'd easily win from how much everyone hates Ford and vice versa. Makes no sense to me.

Because most politicians aren't machiavellian. Take JT, if he was machiavellian he woulda sided with the BC liberals in regards to the pipeline, rather than alberta (because alberta almost never votes red, wheras BC does)

JT isn't just pandering to Alberta with this pipeline fiasco.

He had to kill Energy East because if that had gone through, the Liberals would have lost Quebec for good (and that would have been a true disaster for them). But after killing Energy East, he couldn't kill Kinder Morgan as well, not without loosing ground in every prairie province, Atlantic Canada, and probably the more rural/conservative parts of Ontario. The Kinder Morgan decision also gives him some negotiating power with 'the business community' when the time comes to rally support for 2019.

What JT is doing is basically ramming Kinder Morgan down BC's throat because he knows he can loose every BC riding and still have a majority.