[QuickTidal]

 Briar King, on 25 May 2017 - 12:41 AM, said:

Hope your right. That may be a serious blow for you if you share.

Meh, it could happen and still not lead me off the sequel series. Tad has only rarely led me astray....and I think some of the things Pat mentioned in his review are subjective to his views and not mine.

So here's hoping.

[QuickTidal]

Just chiming in to say that I'm rounding 100 pages of THE WITCHWOOD CROWN so far and I haven't the foggiest clue what Pat's issue with the story was. I'm both enthralled by the new characters and plot progressions, and excited to not only see our old favourites back, but that they have aged and their personalities have aged with them in subtle and wonderful ways.

Not only do I have zero issues, this is shaping up to be a GREAT kickoff to the new series.

Also I have a sad, since I forgot (spoilers for TGAT)

Spoiler

That Maegwin died, and Eolair was left without his beloved...

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 26 June 2017 - 07:25 PM

[End of Disc One]

Pat's had a number of reviews that were real head scratchers to me. But I haven't read any Williams Tad so I can't comment on this one.

[QuickTidal]

 End of Disc One, on 26 June 2017 - 07:36 PM, said:

Pat's had a number of reviews that were real head scratchers to me. But I haven't read any Williams Tad so I can't comment on this one.

I read some of his review and it almost seems like he was in a certain mood, and expecting a certain type of book...while this is altogether not the type of book he was expecting. How he calls it "the slog of slogs" is baffling to me. Everything is interesting so far.

Perhaps it's because the last two books in this series (TO GREEN ANGEL TOWER, and the bridging novella THE HEART OF WHAT WAS LOST) are almost completely war/battles for their entire length? I dunno. There is a lot of table setting in this one, but that's because we are 30+ years on and the table needs reset after 30+ years of relative peace.

But yeah, I don't get any of the complaints. I'm loving this!

[worry]

Are you sure it'll be hard? I've literally never seen anyone mention Tad Williams except on this board, let alone spoilers for his books.

[QuickTidal]

BK, It's a fairly big hardcover, smallish type too. It's about 700 pages, not including the glossary.

 worry, on 28 June 2017 - 12:53 AM, said:

Are you sure it'll be hard? I've literally never seen anyone mention Tad Williams except on this board, let alone spoilers for his books.

Yeah, but you run in lame circles worry, so your frame of reference ain't exactly great.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 28 June 2017 - 01:41 AM

[worry]

Haha true, true.

[QuickTidal]

So, I nearly missed my subway stop this morning because I was so intently reading. That's like my hallmark of a great book.

also (THE WITCHWOOD CROWN spoilers)

Spoiler

Got repeatedly teary-eyed this morning: when Simon reunited with Binabik on the bridge outside Elvritshalla, when Miri called Isgrimnur "uncle" while he lay on his deathbed, when Tiamak reunited with his old friend as well, and when Isgrimnur finally succumbed to old age in his bed while everyone was sleeping, finally joining his beloved Gutrun and Isorn in the afterlife. Fucks sake. I dunno if it's just that Isgrimnur was already a great character in MS&T, or if it's because I so recently read the novella where he is front and centre only months after the Storm King's War, taking on the remaining Norns at the Nakkiga Gate and being a badass...but his death hit me hard.

Also, Josua, Vorzheva and their twins have been missing for 20 years?! Holy sheeeeit! Can't wait till they find them, and we find out what they've been up to.

I like where they've started the 17 year old orphaned grandson of Simon & Miri, Morgan. He's exactly what he should be at his age, rebellious and caring about nothing by wine and women...his lack of reaction or reverence to Isgrimnur's death just shows how far he has to go. There's a lot of room for growth, and I can't wait to see it happen.

Also, new character Pasevalle the Lord Chancellor is a really cool character to follow.

Oh, and the Norn Queen has sent her elite troops to find the bones of the BROTHER (Hakatri) of Storm King Ineluki?! Whaaaaaat? Craziness!

Am enjoying the HECK out of this read.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 28 June 2017 - 12:50 PM

[QuickTidal]

Sidebar: Williams is doing an AMA on Reddit at 2:30PM today.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 28 June 2017 - 04:34 PM

[QuickTidal]

Page 300 mid-book thoughts on THE WITCHWOOD CROWN.

Spoiler

I’m quite enjoying all the plot lines, and I think the one that is most telling is Nezeru’s plot line. I love the idea of a Norn/Mortal hybrid child having grown up as a Norn as a result of the dwindling numbers after the Storm Kings War. Being a Queen’s Talon and suffering a mortal crisis of faith with Norn leadership and ideals as an adult, is damned excellent as a POV amongst the White Foxes.

Tanahaya also feels like she’s going to be VERY important…and I love the little snippets we’ve gotten of her recuperating in the Hayholt, and can’t wait to discover what message she was intending to deliver to Simon & Miriamele when she was shot in the back, and who sent her (I assume Jiriki and Aditu even though we’ve only seen the one Sithi so far). I’m tempted to believe she is going to end up as, amongst other things, a love interest of Prince Morgan…I don’t know why I get that vibe. It just feels like Sithi/Mortal hybrids feels like where the series might be going.

Jarnulf’s parentage has not been revealed yet, but I feel like if he’s anyone’s kid, he’s Sludig’s. We’ve seen Sludig already and his wife, and there is no mention of their kids…but one must assume they have them? Anyways, he’s badass.

Snenneq is basically the torch-passed from Binabik for the “troll helper” role. Binabik is still around to advise Simon and Miri (and Eolair and Tiamak) but I think Tad wanted a youthful troll to advise Morgan. Snenneq completely won me over with his introductory scene in the Rimmersman bar and the Arm Wrestle. Great fun stuff!

There has been no underground sequence as of yet, but I assume it will come as this IS a Tad Williams book.

Anyways, I’m having an absolute blast with this, and enjoying the shit out of it. MS&T fans are in for a treat when they read this one! It feels less like a direct sequel trying to copy what came before like you might see in a Brooks Shannara book, and more like a generation later, long sequel twigging new problems and resurfacing old foes with new angles. The insight into the Norns especially feels earned.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 05 July 2017 - 02:25 PM

[QuickTidal]

 Briar King, on 06 July 2017 - 12:32 AM, said:

Does he already have the others written with set dates yet or writing and waiting, I can't remember?

Yeah, so I think he's ALMOST done the second book EMPIRE OF GRASS (he mentioned it on FB), and it's expected tentatively for early May of next year, and then the third book THE NAVIGATOR'S CHILDREN I would expect the year after? And in there somewhere is another novella called THE SHADOW OF THINGS TO COME (will feature the fall of Asu’a 500 years ago, told from the perspective of a Nabbanai envoy).

[QuickTidal]

 Briar King, on 06 July 2017 - 04:32 PM, said:

Damn 2020 will take a long time unless I buck up and get HC. Fuck that novella at HC $ though def waiting for that PB.

I've got 2 massive oak 5 shelf bookcases full of my mothers old tech stuff. Been dead 9 yrs so I should just clear out.

Yeah, since I've gone ebook digital on all but my fave authors (which is around 7-8 authors), I was able to justify the cost for the novella in HC, but it's a pricey book otherwise for sure.

WITCHWOOD is massive though, so well worth it. Plus brand new maps!

[acesn8s]

I no longer have my MS&T (no idea who I gave them to). Gonna have to repurchase them prior to starting the new series. That will have to come after Bakker.

[QuickTidal]

Nearing the last 100 pages of WITCHWOOD, and it continues to be really enthralling. The table setting in this book for the whole trilogy is IMMENSE. You can feel him setting upon LOT of plot points to cover and unfold throughout the series.

And I think one I guessed at early on:

Spoiler

Morgan and Tanahaya becoming an eventual mortal and sithi relationship. As of right now Morgan, Porto, Count Eclair and a bunch of Erkynlander knights are on their way to bring the ill Sithi woman back to her people and hopefully find Jiriki and Aditu at Jao é-Tinukai'i. And I can't imagine any other reason for Morgan to accompany them than to not only teach him about the world...but possibly pull a Beren & Luthien style story...elf and mortal. A union of the House of Year Dancing and the line of John Prester. Against the Norns.

may be coming true.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 14 July 2017 - 12:28 PM

[T77]

I'm about 30% into the audiobook and it's great so far.

[Andorion]

QT, for someone who was concerned with the slow pace and general lack of character development of the principal protagonist in To Green Angel Tower, would you recommend this book?

[QuickTidal]

 Andorion, on 14 July 2017 - 05:20 PM, said:

QT, for someone who was concerned with the slow pace and general lack of character development of the principal protagonist in To Green Angel Tower, would you recommend this book?

I think that Williams has learned to be an event better writer over the course of his other books since he finished MS&T...and his slower pace table setting has improved (much more seems to happen even in the slower paced sections). He's not nearly as verbose (even though the book is 700 pages) in any given passage as he was before. There is much less navel-gazing/woolgathering.

The thing I'd comment on this book is that the pervading theme here is the inexorable creep of bad things coming to Osten Ard as a kingdom is juxtaposed with being on the ground with those bad things (you literally get LOTS of POV amongst the Norns themselves). It's much more interesting than the MS&T "heroes side only". I mean you had Pryrates and Elias and such....but the Norns were largely seen from the hero side only. Adding in a Norn POV from THE HEART OF WHAT WAS LOST and into this book as well has added a new level to the story which I feel makes for an even more compelling narrative.

And I also think that the lack of development with Simon (I can't say that Miriamele had any such lack in MS&T..but that's just me) is not present here. Of the new main protagonists...you get right into the head of two on different sides of the coin to a HEAVY degree. There are more grays at play in this one. And Simon actually has a personality as an older 50's aged man in this one that is pretty even.

All of that said, I think this might actually be a BETTER book than anything in MS&T simply because it's trying out so many different things that Williams didn't try in MS&T. The least of which is the ground-level Norn POV. While MS&T was pretty damned solidly groundbreaking, it followed a lot of familiar tropes for Tolkien-ish fantasy novels...I don't think LAST KING OF OSTEN ARD so far does that. I am 100 pages from the end and I can't REALLY tell you what I think is going to happen to everyone by the end of this volume. Nothing feels predictable. The first few chapters, most of which involve brand new characters, are a testament to trying new things.

So yeah, so far I think I'd recommend it pretty highly.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 14 July 2017 - 05:37 PM

[Andorion]

 QuickTidal, on 14 July 2017 - 05:36 PM, said:

 Andorion, on 14 July 2017 - 05:20 PM, said:

QT, for someone who was concerned with the slow pace and general lack of character development of the principal protagonist in To Green Angel Tower, would you recommend this book?

I think that Williams has learned to be an event better writer over the course of his other books since he finished MS&T...and his slower pace table setting has improved (much more seems to happen even in the slower paced sections). He's not nearly as verbose (even though the book is 700 pages) in any given passage as he was before. There is much less navel-gazing/woolgathering.

The thing I'd comment on this book is that the pervading theme here is the inexorable creep of bad things coming to Osten Ard as a kingdom is juxtaposed with being on the ground with those bad things (you literally get LOTS of POV amongst the Norns themselves). It's much more interesting than the MS&T "heroes side only". I mean you had Pryrates and Elias and such....but the Norns were largely seen from the hero side only. Adding in a Norn POV from THE HEART OF WHAT WAS LOST and into this book as well has added a new level to the story which I feel makes for an even more compelling narrative.

And I also think that the lack of development with Simon (I can't say that Miriamele had any such lack in MS&T..but that's just me) is not present here. Of the new main protagonists...you get right into the head of two on different sides of the coin to a HEAVY degree. There are more grays at play in this one. And Simon actually has a personality as an older 50's aged man in this one that is pretty even.

All of that said, I think this might actually be a BETTER book than anything in MS&T simply because it's trying out so many different things that Williams didn't try in MS&T. The least of which is the ground-level Norn POV. While MS&T was pretty damned solidly groundbreaking, it followed a lot of familiar tropes for Tolkien-ish fantasy novels...I don't think LAST KING OF OSTEN ARD so far does that. I am 100 pages from the end and I can't REALLY tell you what I think is going to happen to everyone by the end of this volume. Nothing feels predictable. The first few chapters, most of which involve brand new characters, are a testament to trying new things.

So yeah, so far I think I'd recommend it pretty highly.

Got it.

I may pick this one up eventually then.

[T77]

 Briar King, on 15 July 2017 - 12:01 AM, said:

You should also look into Shadowmarch series.

Agreed it was very good.

[wullagaru]

okay I guess i'm going to have to re-read these now. Its been years, so this should be fun, as I don't remember too much about them

Also I would give Otherland another shot. It is slow in parts, but has some really great stuff.