[D'rek]

Egwene, on 19 September 2014 - 06:11 PM, said:

From NoK - Temper's recollections of Y'Ghatan:

"As they advanced, Temper kept a look ahead for Surgen - Surgen Ress, the man who claimed to be the last of the Holy City's patroned and anointed champions. Never mind there were only seven Holy Cities and that all seven champions had fallen to Dassem's sword." NoK, Chapter 4, UK HB p.153

Quite good evidence that all seven Holy Cities fell to Dassem with Y'Ghatan following.

Oh yeah, I'd forgotten that Y'Ghatan isn't even one of the Holy Cities and didn't even have a Holy Protector. Even more evidence Quick Ben's Falah'dan couldn't have been there! I think there's a couple other bits sprinkled around about how Y'Ghatan had been the last major stronghold left after the actual Seven Holy Cities had fallen.


What I've never really fully pieced together is whether all the references to Falah'd/Falah'dan/Holy Protectors are all from this "rebellion and reconquest era" that probably can't be more than the 20 or so years before Laseen became Empress, or if there were different Falah'd in 7C before, then. There's a lot of possibilities - could even be that in the original Malazan conquest of 7C there were Falah'd but they all surrendered and were left to rule as before under the Malazan structure, but then they (or their successors) rebelled and it was only after the reconquest that the Malazans abolished the Falah'd system, for example.

[Hetan]

I’ve put Aren City and it's rebellion as the key point in time for the formation of the Bridgeburners :-

Quick Ben was working for one of the Seven Holy Protectors during a rebellion that originated in Aren -along with all his souls. – This event is underway – the crossing of Raraku.
Kalam Mehkar was employed in Aren as a bodyguard/assassin to a Holy Falah at the same time. He refers to himself : ‘And what have I seen of the world, sir? Scant little. Bodyguard to a Holy Falah in Aren—’ – this event has just happened as Kalam has just been recruited into the Claw as they set out across Raraku. He is also noted as being
‘. Our guide was a local, a man recently recruited into our own Claw . . .’

Fiddler is wearing the helmet of the Holy Falah – courtesy of Dassem’s sword stroke. This event has just happened as they set out across Raraku.

The 70 or so troops with Commander Whiskeyjack (as he is referred to) had seen no more than 3 years worth of running battles – and we know they look young, from GotM etc.

They cross Raraku and become the Bridgeburners and take G’Danisban

So the key point of contention here is what city did they start from ? All we can say from the above is that it took place after/concurrently with the Aren rebellion – the event where they all met up. Now it’s a long way from Aren to Raraku when you look at a map – a long long way,

At this point there can be no doubt that Kellanved and Dancer were around and it was relatively early in their career – time enough for the Bridgeburners to become the elite troops and the Emperor’s favourite.


All this occurs separately from the Aren massacre which I include to make the distinction that there was a High Fist in charge at that time and not a Holy Protector.

Quote

The T’lan Imass at Aren must be a different rebellion as there was a High Fist in charge at the time, who was murdered along with the Malazan Garrison.
This was the event that shortly afterwards, saw the T’lan Imass arrive in Aren. Fiddler discusses this with Apsalar.
Apsalar recalls that Dancer was there – sent by the Emperor to take a look. Dassem was also there.
The conclusion is that Surly ordered the Imass in – and usurped the Emperor’s command over the Imass.

Edit : for clarification over timing and event.

This post has been edited by Hetan (Also Actually Possibly Mal): 20 September 2014 - 08:20 AM

[Egwene]

It's worth noting that Quick Ben and his extended family were living in Aren when he was ten (Bonehunters, Chapter 15). Considering the size of the family, I think it is reasonable to assume they were from the area and that QB was born there. Makes you wonder just how early in it's conception he was involved with the rebellion...