Malazan Empire: The Blade of Bone - Malazan Empire

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The Blade of Bone Spoilers for Assail

#41 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 17 October 2014 - 09:38 PM

Come on dude, coming straight from a great battle involving a sword and a gate of darkness doesn't fit Spinnock (if it wasn't so explicitly themed around dark and not light I might almost agree with you), not to mention all the direct comparisons to Rake - Fisher humming fucking 'Anomandaris', seriously? - it's Rake, it's fucking Rake, ICE made a huge mistake in bringing him back and now the best series death is weakened considerably. I bet Fisher never even met Spinnock.

(incidentally I'm pretty sure that SE confirmed Orfantal died in TTH, but you should take that with an enormous mound of salt)
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#42 User is offline   Malaclypse 

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Posted 18 October 2014 - 12:21 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 17 October 2014 - 09:38 PM, said:

Come on dude, coming straight from a great battle involving a sword and a gate of darkness doesn't fit Spinnock (if it wasn't so explicitly themed around dark and not light I might almost agree with you), not to mention all the direct comparisons to Rake - Fisher humming fucking 'Anomandaris', seriously? - it's Rake, it's fucking Rake, ICE made a huge mistake in bringing him back and now the best series death is weakened considerably. I bet Fisher never even met Spinnock.

(incidentally I'm pretty sure that SE confirmed Orfantal died in TTH, but you should take that with an enormous mound of salt)


Oh man, I hope this isn't true but I fear that it is. Oh my, the haplessness of this man - OK I'm not going to say any more.

ETA: I haven't finished Assail and now I fear to.

This post has been edited by Malaclypse: 18 October 2014 - 12:22 PM


#43 User is offline   Malaclypse 

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Posted 18 October 2014 - 12:47 PM

You know, if this is true, I'm going to take issue with this, the fucking cavalier attitude that the authors seem to have taken with internal consistency. I was actively involved with trying to help them avoid massive gaffes like this and Imma lose my shit if what Illy says is true. I really fucking will.

I've always tried to forgive this with Steve because he slays me instantly when I see him - I want to look after him, I cannot hope to grasp the complexities that whirl around in his glorious brain and for the most part I don't even try. He seems vulnerable to me and I have this instinctual need to protect him - who knew a 5'9" average-looking dude like me could summon a Conan perspective but I shit you not, I feel like Conan when I'm with Steve - he says he would execute me in armed contest, him with has rapier and me with my broadsword but I'm not convinced - this thing has to pierce me right? I get it but it has to pierce me in order to be effective so I said to his face 'What if I rush you, knock your blunt blade aside, and chop you to bits? and so he explained to me the move which he would employ in such a situation and it is pretty cool - so he would whip his swordarm back and angle it over his shoulder and take me as I'm coming in but to be perfectly honest, that's a complicated maneuver when a bloodthirsty motherfucker is charging you with some eye twoards defense - I should be able to deflect the killing stroke and tackle him physically and then use my superior strength and weight to finish the matter. This sits between us - he knows that I think I could take him and he asserts that he would be able to defend himself against me. And I love him as purely as I love anybody, he's probably the person I love most in the world, because his brain is more precious than mine.

That's living, imo.

This post has been edited by Malaclypse: 18 October 2014 - 02:19 PM


#44 User is offline   blackzoid 

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Posted 19 October 2014 - 08:43 AM

View PostIlluyankas, on 17 October 2014 - 09:38 PM, said:

Come on dude, coming straight from a great battle involving a sword and a gate of darkness doesn't fit Spinnock (if it wasn't so explicitly themed around dark and not light I might almost agree with you), not to mention all the direct comparisons to Rake - Fisher humming fucking 'Anomandaris', seriously? - it's Rake, it's fucking Rake, ICE made a huge mistake in bringing him back and now the best series death is weakened considerably. I bet Fisher never even met Spinnock.

(incidentally I'm pretty sure that SE confirmed Orfantal died in TTH, but you should take that with an enormous mound of salt)


Nope, its Spinnock IMO. Its far,FAR to on-nose to be Rake, and there are those blatant references to Kaf Tanar and the burial mound of Seedomin outside Coral. No it wasnt a gate of darkness that we could see in TCG, but hey, ICE had K'Rul become a woman for no reason whatsover, remember? The way Fisher kept teasing that it was Rake throughout the boook was Fisher/ICE playing the red herring card. So I'm not going to worry about ICE ruining bringing back Rake, cos he didnt.

This post has been edited by blackzoid: 19 October 2014 - 08:46 AM

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#45 User is offline   polishgenius 

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Posted 20 October 2014 - 06:05 PM

I think it's meant to be Spinnock but ICE maybe went a little too far on the 'hey-guys-it-might-be-Rake' hints, especially with the gate (though was it said the gate is of darkness?). But at the end of the day the one really specific hint is that he used to play the game thingy with Seerdomin, and that's not Rake.
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#46 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 20 October 2014 - 09:50 PM

Agreed, even tho as discussed else post, the game thing could go either way.
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#47 User is offline   Hetan 

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Posted 30 October 2014 - 09:46 AM

View PostIlluyankas, on 17 October 2014 - 09:38 PM, said:

Come on dude, coming straight from a great battle involving a sword and a gate of darkness doesn't fit Spinnock (if it wasn't so explicitly themed around dark and not light I might almost agree with you), not to mention all the direct comparisons to Rake - Fisher humming fucking 'Anomandaris', seriously? - it's Rake, it's fucking Rake, ICE made a huge mistake in bringing him back and now the best series death is weakened considerably. I bet Fisher never even met Spinnock.(incidentally I'm pretty sure that SE confirmed Orfantal died in TTH, but you should take that with an enormous mound of salt)



View Postpolishgenius, on 20 October 2014 - 06:05 PM, said:

I think it's meant to be Spinnock but ICE maybe went a little too far on the 'hey-guys-it-might-be-Rake' hints, especially with the gate (though was it said the gate is of darkness?). But at the end of the day the one really specific hint is that he used to play the game thingy with Seerdomin, and that's not Rake.


Illy, my copy just says a gate and doesn't refer to darkness. Likewise, regarding the sword - Spinnock's Hust sword had just broken at the Liosan gate, so I guess it might have been on his mind, mid-battle. IIRC that's where we last see him? But yeah, the kef tanar was play too far :unworthy: Son of Darkness is an honorific so that's not a deal breaker imho.
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#48 User is offline   Spoilsport Stonny 

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Posted 30 October 2014 - 03:55 PM

Spin left his sword on the ground after his battle with Kallor in TtH. He said he didn't want it anymore. Not sure what sword he had when joining the battle at Lightfall, but I'm positive the "gate" Jethiss is referring to is that one at the First Shore.
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#49 User is offline   nacht 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 06:29 AM

Why the FA would fashion a sword for anybody is beyond me?
And how a sword would be effective when made of bone is stupefying too
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#50 User is online   Aptorian 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 09:58 AM

How would Gruntle's tiger claw swords from MOI be sharp enough to cut metal?

The answer is magic.

Also, the FA are not human and don't think like a human. You're not supposed to understand their motivation. Why would they kill everyone that walks or talks? Because it's justice. Why would they make a sword out of a mans arm? Because it is justice. Why did the FA cross the road? To get to the other side Because it's justice.
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#51 User is offline   nacht 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 04:48 PM

View PostApt, on 31 October 2014 - 09:58 AM, said:

How would Gruntle's tiger claw swords from MOI be sharp enough to cut metal?

The answer is magic.

Also, the FA are not human and don't think like a human. You're not supposed to understand their motivation. Why would they kill everyone that walks or talks? Because it's justice. Why would they make a sword out of a mans arm? Because it is justice. Why did the FA cross the road? To get to the other side Because it's justice.


I guess the nature of that magic would be that the bone sword will scream loudly "LOSE..." and that would be end of the duel.
MD, goddess of the race that made Hust Swords is somehow not powerful enough to provide a sword to her chosen son of Darkness.
Even Dragnipur was made out of metals (of all types).
The son of Darkness would ask something of a race that is their ancient enemy and that is ok with both the races.

This whole bone of blade seems like an artificial add on to the end of a great series (I shudder to think that ICE is planning some future Blade of Bone adventures)
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#52 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 08:04 PM

All perfectly weird conclusions. What matters that MD is of the race of people who made Hust swords? I'm of the species that invented the space shuttle, doesn't make me liable to build one any time soon. TA and FA are ancient enemies? Perhaps, but is Jethiss supposed to remain a racist after all that's gone down, even as official TA emissary to the new Founding? Seems like reconciliation is exactly what the Son of Darkness should be after at this point.

I mean, it's deliberately left up to your imagination what the sword is meant for, but one thing we can probably conclude is that it's supposed to be an antithesis to Dragnipur. Jethiss is there for a new Founding. Perhaps this sword is consecrated with the power of that event. It's made of his arm. Perhaps the level of sacrifice that went into making it gives it that much more power. You give something to get something.
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#53 User is offline   nacht 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 09:57 PM

View Postworry, on 31 October 2014 - 08:04 PM, said:

All perfectly weird conclusions. What matters that MD is of the race of people who made Hust swords? I'm of the species that invented the space shuttle, doesn't make me liable to build one any time soon. TA and FA are ancient enemies? Perhaps, but is Jethiss supposed to remain a racist after all that's gone down, even as official TA emissary to the new Founding? Seems like reconciliation is exactly what the Son of Darkness should be after at this point.

I mean, it's deliberately left up to your imagination what the sword is meant for, but one thing we can probably conclude is that it's supposed to be an antithesis to Dragnipur. Jethiss is there for a new Founding. Perhaps this sword is consecrated with the power of that event. It's made of his arm. Perhaps the level of sacrifice that went into making it gives it that much more power. You give something to get something.


If you are the first sword of America, I am sure the American government would be glad to equip you with the most lethal technology :-)

I concede the point that a sacrifice would seal the deal, but this was not a sacrifice to the group, more like payment for a service. Neither were all the races involved in the sacrifice.
If the FA were now again to be chosen as arbiters for a new peace, that makes sense as a climax, but having them make a sword for Jethiss is not that convincing. (especially why a sword and why at that huge cost).
It feels like a "repulsive thing" to ask somebody to sacrifice their arm to create a sword.

It is just an opinion, but I feel the Jethiss storyline is a stretch and burden on the story.
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#54 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 31 October 2014 - 10:21 PM

I am, in many ways, the First Sword of America. Nevertheless, I get your perspective, I just think it's more about piquing the imagination/speculation than tacking some random grotesquerie on for the sake of it.
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#55 User is offline   Spoilsport Stonny 

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Posted 01 November 2014 - 12:05 AM

So far the Kharkanas trilogy is showing us a less-than noble side of the Tiste from what we've seen of Anomander's Tiste Andii in MBoTF. Something tells me the Tiste bear the burden of sacrifice in the current peace. As much as we've seen the FA version of justice as malevolent or cruel, the one's we meet in Assail seem to be more open to negotiation and resolution, and not so much expurgation.
Theorizing that one could poop within his own lifetime, Doctor Poopet led an elite group of scientists into the desert to develop a top secret project, known as QUANTUM POOP. Pressured to prove his theories or lose funding, Doctor Poopet, prematurely stepped into the Poop Accelerator and vanished. He awoke to find himself in the past, suffering from partial amnesia and facing a mirror image that was not his own. Fortunately, contact with his own bowels was made through brainwave transmissions, with Al the Poop Observer, who appeared in the form of a hologram that only Doctor Poopet could see and hear. Trapped in the past, Doctor Poopet finds himself pooping from life to life, pooping things right, that once went wrong and hoping each time, that his next poop will be the poop home.
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#56 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 01 November 2014 - 01:10 AM

I like that idea of the Tiste bearing the burden.

Kharkanas trilogy speculation
Spoiler

They came with white hands and left with red hands.
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#57 User is offline   Spoilsport Stonny 

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Posted 01 November 2014 - 04:41 PM

That kind of makes sense, and
Spoiler

Theorizing that one could poop within his own lifetime, Doctor Poopet led an elite group of scientists into the desert to develop a top secret project, known as QUANTUM POOP. Pressured to prove his theories or lose funding, Doctor Poopet, prematurely stepped into the Poop Accelerator and vanished. He awoke to find himself in the past, suffering from partial amnesia and facing a mirror image that was not his own. Fortunately, contact with his own bowels was made through brainwave transmissions, with Al the Poop Observer, who appeared in the form of a hologram that only Doctor Poopet could see and hear. Trapped in the past, Doctor Poopet finds himself pooping from life to life, pooping things right, that once went wrong and hoping each time, that his next poop will be the poop home.
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#58 User is offline   nacht 

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 09:05 PM

I really like the above theories
Spoiler

This post has been edited by nacht: 13 November 2014 - 09:05 PM

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#59 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 09:26 AM

Is Jethis Rake or Spinnock? I don't care. What I do care about is that in this final 'concluding' book ICE still thought it was necessary to thrown in a character and be as vague about it as possible even till the end when he seemingly has his memories back. Why? What is the point. I remember with Orb Sceptr Throne there were times when he was even vague with who the POV of a chapter was coming from until you were halfway through it. For the love of god why. Knowing who is speaking except in the rarest of circumstances is necessary.

After blood and Bone I said Malazan was just becoming an unending fiction engine. Assail has not changed my opinion
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#60 User is offline   Gorefest 

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Posted 03 December 2014 - 09:48 AM

View PostSpoilsport Stonny, on 01 November 2014 - 04:41 PM, said:

That kind of makes sense, and
Spoiler



Indeed. Also,
Spoiler

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