[Gorefest]

cerveza_fiesta, on 09 October 2014 - 11:44 PM, said:

TBH I didn't expect a magical ebola detector machine at every security gate, but they *were* making it out to seem like the likelihood of anyone getting through to a N. American airport would be vanishingly small...then we hear about this random guy who just went to visit his family in Liberia in the middle of the worst ebola epidemic ever and the best anybody does is take the dude's temperature before he comes home? I'd expect at least they'd hand him a fucking pamphlet saying "if you get these symptoms STAY HOME AND CALL 911 IMMEDIATELY".

It is very difficult to screen everyone in a practical manner, simple as that. The incubation time for the disease is 2 to 21 days, which gives you a massive potential time interval to travel around before symptoms become noticeable. And that's disregarding those people who deliberately hide symptoms with inflammation suppressants like aspirin or somesuch, to avoid getting held at the airport, missing their flight and being goaded into a quarantine area for hour or days on end. Screening will most likely be focussed on inbound flights from affected areas, which means that anyone flying with a detour will not meet the same restrictions upon arrival.

[cerveza_fiesta]

Gorefest, on 10 October 2014 - 03:33 PM, said:

cerveza_fiesta, on 09 October 2014 - 11:44 PM, said:

TBH I didn't expect a magical ebola detector machine at every security gate, but they *were* making it out to seem like the likelihood of anyone getting through to a N. American airport would be vanishingly small...then we hear about this random guy who just went to visit his family in Liberia in the middle of the worst ebola epidemic ever and the best anybody does is take the dude's temperature before he comes home? I'd expect at least they'd hand him a fucking pamphlet saying "if you get these symptoms STAY HOME AND CALL 911 IMMEDIATELY".

It is very difficult to screen everyone in a practical manner, simple as that. The incubation time for the disease is 2 to 21 days, which gives you a massive potential time interval to travel around before symptoms become noticeable. And that's disregarding those people who deliberately hide symptoms with inflammation suppressants like aspirin or somesuch, to avoid getting held at the airport, missing their flight and being goaded into a quarantine area for hour or days on end. Screening will most likely be focussed on inbound flights from affected areas, which means that anyone flying with a detour will not meet the same restrictions upon arrival.

Don't worry -- I get it completely.

I was more commenting on the difference between what officials and media here were *reporting* and what was the reality. You gotta admit, it's a bit disingenuous to tell people that we're safe and that screening is an effective measure when the screening doesn't even have that good a chance of catching a sick person.


Iit was interesting to see that the British health officials had an ebola drill where they planted actors around the country that were supposed to show up unannounced at hospitals and test the system's readiness. THAT is an effective measure as far as I'm concerned. Get people (especially front line healthcare workers) practised and educated and make sure officials know where the weak points in the defense are.

[Gnaw]

cerveza_fiesta, on 12 October 2014 - 11:58 AM, said:

I was more commenting on the difference between what officials and media here were *reporting* and what was the reality. You gotta admit, it's a bit disingenuous to tell people that we're safe and that screening is an effective measure when the screening doesn't even have that good a chance of catching a sick person terrorist.

It's worked for 13 years so far. The telling people that screening is effective that is. Bruce Schneier

[Nicodimas]

Clearly now Spain and Texas have had issues with someone else getting sick from this Virus. The person in Texas was wearing FULL gear is what has been stated..

There is something that they need to identify quickly and be honest about it. Just go full offensive..i'm still in the camp that thinks of this gets into a major city..its going to be bad.

Lets be honest:

"If the medical people with hazmat suits are getting it, then what fing chance do me and my family have?"


Someone isn't be truthful.

( the magic number is 30-90 cases in a major us-European- city imo)

[LinearPhilosopher]

nico i think you might be overly paranoid about this. I hope you aren't loosing sleep over this.

Nicodimas, on 12 October 2014 - 09:53 PM, said:

"If the medical people with hazmat suits are getting it, then what fing chance do me and my family have?"

Its also been a shockingly documented fact that hospital workers aren't always the most dutiful when it comes to washing their hands. Just keep a bottle of purex in your pocket/bag. It won't hurt you.

This post has been edited by BalrogLord: 13 October 2014 - 02:40 AM

[Gorefest]

Nicodimas, on 12 October 2014 - 09:53 PM, said:

"If the medical people with hazmat suits are getting it, then what fing chance do me and my family have?"

Well, don't know about the Texan nurse, but at least in the Spanish case it was already clarified that she contaminated herself while removing her gloves in an inappropriate way. Obviously safety gear isn't going to do anything if you then commence to smear the glove contents onto your exposed face.

[Gothos]

Nicodimas, on 12 October 2014 - 09:53 PM, said:

Clearly now Spain and Texas have had issues with someone else getting sick from this Virus. The person in Texas was wearing FULL gear is what has been stated..

There is something that they need to identify quickly and be honest about it. Just go full offensive..i'm still in the camp that thinks of this gets into a major city..its going to be bad.

Lets be honest:

"If the medical people with hazmat suits are getting it, then what fing chance do me and my family have?"


Someone isn't be truthful.

( the magic number is 30-90 cases in a major us-European- city imo)

I find this very appropriate for this thread:

Please stop making this sensational. You've a million more likely ways to die tomorrow. I think it's a fairly good assumption that this very deadly virus
(that is pretty bad at spreading itself and not killing hosts too quickly) will be/is being contained a bit better in a developed country than in a place
where the locals storm a containment centre to "free" the patients. Chill, please.

[Gnaw]

Gothos, on 13 October 2014 - 11:09 AM, said:

I find this very appropriate for this thread:

Hey! Where'd you get my picture?

[Nicodimas]

Ebola is Partially Airborne..

Quote

We believe there is scientific and epidemiologic evidence that Ebola virus has the potential to be transmitted via infectious aerosol particles both near and at a distance from infected patients, which means that healthcare workers should be wearing respirators, not facemasks.

VIA CIDRAP

http://www.cidrap.um...rotection-ebola

At least someone is being honest.

This is the information I have wanted actually-->

Quote

Experimental work has shown that Marburg and Ebola viruses can be isolated from sera and tissue culture medium at room temperature for up to 46 days, but at room temperature no virus was recovered from glass, metal, or plastic surfaces.23 Aerosolized (1-3 mcm) Marburg, Ebola, and Reston viruses, at 50% to 55% relative humidity and 72°F, had biological decay rates of 3.04%, 3.06%. and 1.55% per minute, respectively. These rates indicate that 99% loss in aerosol infectivity would occur in 93, 104, and 162 minutes, respectively.

I'm not saying this is the Andromeda Strain at all, just that we need to prepare and be ready for something this lethal and keep our healthcare workers from getting sick. Also, not let this get established in a US/western/big city. This getting out in India for instance would be rough as again it would get all over the world.

This post has been edited by Nicodimas: 13 October 2014 - 07:02 PM

[Nicodimas]

Not to derail the thread Gothos..

Those things and the death rates are lifestyle choices people made it is a very different argument. You could argue a healthy person who never engaged in those activities wouldn't have died that way.

Quote

Please stop making this sensational. You've a million more likely ways to die tomorrow

A million different ways to die tomorrow..Ok. Isn't that a type of fallacy. I think it is Misnomer to blow off something that is this -lethal-. The whole point of this thread is to track how they approach this deadly Virus..This is a news thread about Ebola...Read that subject line^.

[Cause]

The death rate of this epidemic in deepest darkest Africa where people are immuno compromised from malnutrition and aids and god know what else, where their understanding and response to this disease is abysmal and where government infrastructure is abysmal is still only 50%.

America would swat this disease like the hammer of god. Calm Down

[Nicodimas]

@ Cause

Don't you think it's terrible that those conditions exist in the World. Disappointing. This is the time we should build bases abroad as we can study the Ebola threat and US could build Peacekeeper bases there too with Nato Support of course.

Also for Cause...this is why Ebola is Dangerous:

http://www.bbc.com/n...africa-26835233

This post has been edited by Nicodimas: 13 October 2014 - 11:59 PM

[Gothos]

Nicodimas, on 13 October 2014 - 06:55 PM, said:

I'm not saying this is the Andromeda Strain at all, just that we need to prepare and be ready for something this lethal and keep our healthcare workers from getting sick. Also, not let this get established in a US/western/big city. This getting out in India for instance would be rough as again it would get all over the world.

Yeah, here's the thing: how do you want to get ready? What do you possibly have in mind for when a multi-billion healthcare system with some of the best trained specialists... fails? Pack up on a trailer and drive to Wyoming in a tinfoil hat and dig a hole in the ground?

I'm not saying it's not a dangerous disease. What I'm saying is that people (you in particular in this case) should not freak out this much about it. As much as I dislike government structures, I'm pretty certain everything that can be done is being done. It won't be Ebola that wipes us out, it will be the flu if anything.

[D'iversify]

Whilst this graph is a bit outdated (source: http://www.economist...newe|13-10-2014|), I think it's still worth bearing in mind even as Ebola infection and death rates continue to escalate:

[Gorefest]

Nicodimas, on 13 October 2014 - 11:54 PM, said:

@ Cause

Don't you think it's terrible that those conditions exist in the World. Disappointing. This is the time we should build bases abroad as we can study the Ebola threat and US could build Peacekeeper bases there too with Nato Support of course.

Wait, did you just say US and Peacekeeper in the same sentence? I bet people in Africa can't wait to get US military bases in their backyard on the pretense of a health threat.

[D'iversify]

The New York Times had a good, non-sensationalist article on Ebola yesterday: http://www.nytimes.c...&pgtype=article

[Gnaw]

Gorefest, on 14 October 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

Nicodimas, on 13 October 2014 - 11:54 PM, said:

@ Cause

Don't you think it's terrible that those conditions exist in the World. Disappointing. This is the time we should build bases abroad as we can study the Ebola threat and US could build Peacekeeper bases there too with Nato Support of course.

Wait, did you just say US and Peacekeeper in the same sentence? I bet people in Africa can't wait to get US military bases in their backyard on the pretense of a health threat.

Nico is one of those people who think that it is possible to shoot people until they like you.

[EmperorMagus]

Gnaw, on 14 October 2014 - 11:00 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 14 October 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

Nicodimas, on 13 October 2014 - 11:54 PM, said:

@ Cause

Don't you think it's terrible that those conditions exist in the World. Disappointing. This is the time we should build bases abroad as we can study the Ebola threat and US could build Peacekeeper bases there too with Nato Support of course.

Wait, did you just say US and Peacekeeper in the same sentence? I bet people in Africa can't wait to get US military bases in their backyard on the pretense of a health threat.

Nico is one of those people who think that it is possible to shoot people until they like you.

and I like him for it, because he shot me.

[Nicodimas]

The CDC is on top of this...! The CDC is demanding that all -132- passengers report for Ebola Screening.

Though slightly distressing that the 2nd Nurse Flew from Dallas to Cleveland// Cleveland to Dallas , was with temperature..
She knew she had been exposed to Ebola too, felt feverish and had a 99.5 temperature is what is being reported.

Frontier flight 1143

We also know from that previous article Ebola can at a maximum in theory sit on an object for 1-3 hours.

I think people here are ruling out sheer human stupidity, or common sense.

More information from Nurses Union of the 70 people that overlooked Duncan:

* Glove openings were not taped shut on protective suits, exposing wrists and hands to exposure

* Protective clothing did not cover necks, exposing skin between the collar and the bottom of the face shield

* To cover their necks, nurses were told to use tape that does not block the virus

* Some supervisors told nurses that face masks were not required at all when caring for Duncan


Like I said the more we learn the better, glad the CDC is sending a team to take care of all further Ebola victims.

This post has been edited by Nicodimas: 15 October 2014 - 06:40 PM

[LinearPhilosopher]

EmperorMagus, on 14 October 2014 - 11:32 PM, said:

Gnaw, on 14 October 2014 - 11:00 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 14 October 2014 - 01:00 PM, said:

Nicodimas, on 13 October 2014 - 11:54 PM, said:

@ Cause

Don't you think it's terrible that those conditions exist in the World. Disappointing. This is the time we should build bases abroad as we can study the Ebola threat and US could build Peacekeeper bases there too with Nato Support of course.

Wait, did you just say US and Peacekeeper in the same sentence? I bet people in Africa can't wait to get US military bases in their backyard on the pretense of a health threat.

Nico is one of those people who think that it is possible to shoot people until they like you.

and I like him for it, because he shot me.

Which works better? his Ar-15 or his magnum?