[champ]

 Cause, on 08 July 2014 - 04:03 PM, said:

 champ, on 08 July 2014 - 03:20 PM, said:

Started a reread of Blood Song last night...

Spoiler

Iltris or however you spell his name, Lyrnas protector - I certainly didn't remember that he was the bare knuckle instructor for the order - really wish I had done a reread before Tower Lord for these little things

Spoiler

I think your confusing two separate people. Iltris is fourth order, he is sent by Tendris to deliver Sister sherin in chains to stop the plague. Vaelin beats on him. The sixth order martial arts instructor is I'm sure supposed to be someone else. Iltris then tried to crossbow Vaelin outside his sisters house and so was sent to the blackhold by Tendris and that's how he ends up with the queen.


That said another very minor gripe I have is the editing of the books is sometimes quite terrible. The orders are often switched around haphazardly. The fifth order is for healing and yet its members are often listed as belonging to other orders and vice versa. In blood song after the Aspect massacre I recall its quite noticeable. The order houses team Vaelin went to and which aspects died etc etc are all jumbled repeatedly.

Definitely getting confused, Intris and Iltris after looking again!

[Andorion]

I was wondering what everybody thinks of the use of European history overtones in the series. I am about 75% through Blood Song and its getting pretty blatant.

Spoiler

The United Realm is clearly a pastiche of Britain. Cumbrae is Wales. Janus is Edward the First (Longshanks). Alpira seems to be a take on France, as the excuse Janus gave for the invasion is reminisent of the legalese quoted by Edward the Third when the Hundred Years War started. The references to the Ice Raiders remind me of Vikings, And the "bluesstones, silk and Spices" line reminds of the way Europe began to try for direct trade routes to the far East from the fifteenth century to secure the spice trade.

[Cause]

 Andorion, on 09 July 2014 - 04:08 AM, said:

I was wondering what everybody thinks of the use of European history overtones in the series. I am about 75% through Blood Song and its getting pretty blatant.

Spoiler

The United Realm is clearly a pastiche of Britain. Cumbrae is Wales. Janus is Edward the First (Longshanks). Alpira seems to be a take on France, as the excuse Janus gave for the invasion is reminisent of the legalese quoted by Edward the Third when the Hundred Years War started. The references to the Ice Raiders remind me of Vikings, And the "bluesstones, silk and Spices" line reminds of the way Europe began to try for direct trade routes to the far East from the fifteenth century to secure the spice trade.

Spoiler

There are many parallels but nothing too obvious or anything I have a problem with. The Cumbraelins are English long-bowmen (not sure why you say Wales specifically). The world-father religion is Christianity, the reader is a swipe at the pope and the catholic church. Also interested to hear the Longshank connections.

Book 2

Spoiler

The Volarians are a caricatured Roman empire. The Siege of Altor made me think of the Siege of Tyre.

.

Often connections are in the eye of the reader. I have heard Obdigore say the Realm has Muslim influences but I can't see any

[QuickTidal]

 Cause, on 09 July 2014 - 12:29 PM, said:

Book 2

Spoiler

The Volarians are a caricatured Roman empire. The Siege of Altor made me think of the Siege of Tyre.

.

Spoiler

I would agree, but would go a little further to say they are more like the Late Eastern Roman Empire / Byzantium. And Alpira seems like the older Western Roman empire with the flourishing East wishing to get rid of the crumbling/splintered West. It's not a perfect analog, but it works on some levels.

[Andorion]

 Cause, on 09 July 2014 - 12:29 PM, said:

 Andorion, on 09 July 2014 - 04:08 AM, said:

I was wondering what everybody thinks of the use of European history overtones in the series. I am about 75% through Blood Song and its getting pretty blatant.

Spoiler

The United Realm is clearly a pastiche of Britain. Cumbrae is Wales. Janus is Edward the First (Longshanks). Alpira seems to be a take on France, as the excuse Janus gave for the invasion is reminisent of the legalese quoted by Edward the Third when the Hundred Years War started. The references to the Ice Raiders remind me of Vikings, And the "bluesstones, silk and Spices" line reminds of the way Europe began to try for direct trade routes to the far East from the fifteenth century to secure the spice trade.

Spoiler

There are many parallels but nothing too obvious or anything I have a problem with. The Cumbraelins are English long-bowmen (not sure why you say Wales specifically). The world-father religion is Christianity, the reader is a swipe at the pope and the catholic church. Also interested to hear the Longshank connections.

Book 2

Spoiler

The Volarians are a caricatured Roman empire. The Siege of Altor made me think of the Siege of Tyre.

.

Often connections are in the eye of the reader. I have heard Obdigore say the Realm has Muslim influences but I can't see any

Spoiler

1. Janus is Edward Longshanks because Edward was the first king to try to unify Britain. He conquered Wales and began the wars with Scotland. Edward was called Longshanks because of his enormously long legs.
2. As for Wales, the long-bow probably was a more Welsh weapon than an English one, though this is disputed. I am equating the Cumbraelins with the Welsh, because of firstly their geographical location to the West of the United Realm, and secondly because they are the fiercely independent and rebellious faction brought to their knees by Janus, which is a close parallel to Wales under Edward..
3. Not sure about the Muslim connections. I didn't see any. The Orders do remind me of the differnet orders of the medieval church.
4. Not commenting in the second book as I have yet to read it

This post has been edited by Andorion: 09 July 2014 - 05:17 PM

[QuickTidal]

 Andorion, on 09 July 2014 - 05:16 PM, said:

Spoiler

1. Janus is Edward Longshanks because Edward was the first king to try to unify Britain. He conquered Wales and began the wars with Scotland. Edward was called Longshanks because of his enormously long legs.

Wasn't it Alfred The Great who first unified Britain? and he did so by quelling warring states of disparate poeple, as opposed to Longshanks who just needed Wales and Scotland under his sway...he already had the rest of Britain.

2. As for Wales, the long-bow probably was a more Welsh weapon than an English one, though this is disputed. I am equating the Cumbraelins with the Welsh, because of firstly their geographical location to the West of the United Realm, and secondly because they are the fiercely independent and rebellious faction brought to their knees by Janus, which is a close parallel to Wales under Edward..

I can see the Cumbraelins as Welsh...considering the Renfaelin's are essentially Scottish.

3. Not sure about the Muslim connections. I didn't see any. The Orders do remind me of the differnet orders of the medieval church.

There aren't any muslim connections. I have no idea where Obi got that impression from as there aren't any religions in the books that mimic Islam.

4. Not commenting in the second book as I have yet to read it

Get on it!

Answered in red.

[Andorion]

 QuickTidal, on 09 July 2014 - 05:25 PM, said:

 Andorion, on 09 July 2014 - 05:16 PM, said:

Spoiler

1. Janus is Edward Longshanks because Edward was the first king to try to unify Britain. He conquered Wales and began the wars with Scotland. Edward was called Longshanks because of his enormously long legs.

Wasn't it Alfred The Great who first unified Britain? and he did so by quelling warring states of disparate poeple, as opposed to Longshanks who just needed Wales and Scotland under his sway...he already had the rest of Britain.

2. As for Wales, the long-bow probably was a more Welsh weapon than an English one, though this is disputed. I am equating the Cumbraelins with the Welsh, because of firstly their geographical location to the West of the United Realm, and secondly because they are the fiercely independent and rebellious faction brought to their knees by Janus, which is a close parallel to Wales under Edward..

I can see the Cumbraelins as Welsh...considering the Renfaelin's are essentially Scottish.

3. Not sure about the Muslim connections. I didn't see any. The Orders do remind me of the differnet orders of the medieval church.

There aren't any muslim connections. I have no idea where Obi got that impression from as there aren't any religions in the books that mimic Islam.

4. Not commenting in the second book as I have yet to read it

Get on it!

Answered in red.

Regarding Alfred, let me think....I am a bit hazy on pre-Norman Britain, but if memory serves he united Wessex with Northumbria, Essex, Mercia etc. after getting rid of the Danes and breaking the Danelaw. What I do not remember is him having had anything to do with Scotland or Wales. So you can say he basically united England, but Britain is England+Scotland+Wales.

Edward was probably the first to take a stab at that though neither he nor his successors pulled it off. Scotland was not formally united till the18th Century.

I am not spoilering this as it has nothing to do directly with the books in the thread.

[Dragnipurake]

The book was awesome till it spectacularly imploded (IMO) in the last part (IV?). With all the Erikson'esque build up to the hero, I was looking forward to a 'super general' as someone mentioned above and couldn't be more disappointed at how the 'rescue' turned out. Enjoyed the Lyrna, 'bound' Frentis and Reva POVs. The plot twists were relatively predictable but it didn't matter, the book was great till the last quarter.

[Abyss]

Halfway thru bk3.... That fight in the

Spoiler

temple against the Arisai....

.Holy fuck.

[Hocknose]

what a massive let down the 3rd book was. First one was genuinely brilliant, second was pretty good...but the 3rd just seemed so rushed. Was very dissapointed to be honest.

[Abyss]

Almost done w bk3.... i'm just not seeing what was 'rushed'.

I think it's a nice change when an author can pack a sweeping epic into three volumes instead of a multi-mega-volume marathon.

...about 10% left, maybe i'll change my mind.

[Hocknose]

its been a couple of months since I finished it so can't remember all the details. But you know that feeling you get when you finish a book and just feel dissapointed...

Don't get me wrong the book isn't bad...maybe I just went into it with too high expectations...