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World Cup 2014! Best Sporting Tournament in the World!

#1 User is offline   Tiste Simeon 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 08:23 PM

Can't believe no-one started this thread yet! General discussion, predictions, banter and bemoaning how bad your favourite country is doing/whooping at how great they are doing!

As I write this Brazil are 1-0 down to Croatia in the first game but I'm not ruling them out by a long shot. Also I drew Brazil in the sweepstake so I stand to win money if they do win.

Let's face it, England aren't going to win it.

Germany might get far, as might Argentina, Spain & Uruguay.

Dark Horses? I'm going with Chile. Dunno why just that South American teams have traditionally done very well in South American tournaments.

Other things to discuss: The corruption that is rife in FIFA and the way the Brazilian government has essentially screwed it's own country over and the protests that have plagued this tournament for years now. Seems that big sporting events come with their own custom made scandal these days...
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#2 User is offline   Coco with marshmallows 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 08:52 PM

running a cheeky predictor through a guy at my work:

Have Brazil winning 2-1 vs Croatia, so it's possible at the moment (1-1)

Blatter is an arse.

that is all for now.
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#3 User is offline   Tiste Simeon 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 09:13 PM

View PostI Am Brian Blessed Not Brent Weeks, on 12 June 2014 - 08:52 PM, said:

Blatter is an arse.

That could sum up a whole bunch of things that are making the news right now.
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#4 User is offline   Coco with marshmallows 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 09:37 PM

2-1

Now just hold the score there lads.

my dark horse of choice is Ivory coast. Reckon them and Colombia coming out of group C.
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#5 User is offline   Binder of Demons 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 10:26 PM

That Brazil team is a disgrace to the memory of the Brazil teams i remember from my childhood (1982, 1986). I hope the ref got a nice signed Brazil jersey for his troubles, cos that was a seriously weak display.

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#6 User is offline   Khellendros 

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 10:49 PM

As a half-Croat, I'm both proud of the display and very disappointed they didn't get anything out of the game. Croatia's goalkeeper and centre backs definitely the weak links. But with Modric, Rakitic, Olic (when he's not trying something stupid), and Mandzukic back for the next game, they could definitely finish runners-up in the group. Have to hope that third goal doesn't come back to haunt them on the goal difference.


Now to support my other four teams, Bosnia, England, Greece, and Costa Rica (the last two I unfortunately drew in the sweepstake, sigh). I also have a soft spot for Belgium.
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Posted 13 June 2014 - 12:40 AM

Not a supporter of of any teams but its funny how first game of fifa and you can already see problems. Brazil shouldn't have gotten that penalty and Croatia should have gotten that second goal. Too bad we don't have thing like cameras to decide on a call.... But nothing will ever change there I suppose.
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#8 User is offline   Binder of Demons 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 01:40 AM

The Irish panel saw it pretty much as I did, and that wasn't favourable to Brazil.
The Brazilian penalty was a joke, and was a borderline booking for diving.
The Croatian goal should have stood as the Brazilian goalkeeper is a pansy, and Olic won that header cleanly.
Neymar should have been sent off for the swinging arm which hit Modric (as the replay clearly shows him look for the player, swing the arm, and never even attempt to go for the ball). If it had been the other way around the Croatian would have been off immediately.
There was anotherexample of double standards too in the 2nd half, when a Brazilian player (and I think it was Neymar) practically rugby tackled a Croatian to try and stop a counter attack. He did slow the Croatian down, but the ref allowed play to continue, and nothing came of it in the end. Now, in any other game in the world, that player would have been yellow carded for deliberately attempting to stop the opponent. No question. Every time. Except of course, this time.

I was really hoping this Brazilian team would play great football, and light up the tournament. But frankly, their cynical attitude, and often dirty play, makes me weep for the memories of those beautiful sides of yore. Considering the shenanigans going on in Brazil, and the general crap with FIFA, it would be awesome if there were 2 more group games of laughable refereeing performances in Brazil's favour, and then have them crash out in the 2nd round on penalties after a 0-0 draw

I'd nearly wish for England to win to make Sepp Blatter's head explode.

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#9 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 02:10 AM

View PostBinder of Demons, on 12 June 2014 - 10:26 PM, said:

That Brazil team is a disgrace to the memory of the Brazil teams i remember from my childhood (1982, 1986). I hope the ref got a nice signed Brazil jersey for his troubles, cos that was a seriously weak display.

This Brazilian team is basically built exactly like every successful Brazilian team in actual history (not the misremembered "joga bonito" that never existed). They put a few extremely talented forwards up, have workman-like midfielders, a set of very good fullbacks and an at least competent center back duo.

Dunga got shit on for saying this is what they needed to do and Scolari gets the benefit of the doubt for doing this (but using different language). The reaction to this is kind of surreal to me.

The only Brazilian team that really diverged from this model was the 3 Rs team that won in 2002. Even the '98 team that lost to France had a very workman-like quality underneath the Ronaldo/Rivaldo glitz and glamour.
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#10 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 02:11 AM

I think it should have been 2-2, btw. The penalty was kinda legit - the hand on the shoulder - but the disallowed goal call was terrible and Oscar's goal (although beautiful to watch) was preceded immediately by a foul right in front of the referee.

Baaaad officiating throughout the game, even if the penalty call was kinda okay.
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#11 User is offline   Binder of Demons 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 03:03 AM

I'd have to disagree with you on the penalty Amphib. I can't accept that as a foul in any way in a contact sport. Fred backed into the Croatian defender, and Lovren was foolish enough to then put his hand on Fred's shoulder. But in no way did he use enough force to have a player collapse to the floor that way.

There are other kinds of borderline decisions in the box i can sometimes tolerate, but when one player instigates contact, and then falls down when there is any pushback, I draw the line. The inconsistency in the calls was the worst thing about it though.


And I'd again have to disagree with your description of the type of midfielders that Brazil had in the 1982 and 1986 world cups. The goalkeeper position has always been a liability for Brazil, and the centre back weren't always that great. But the midfield in '82 could hardly be called workmanlike. I'll grant you that Cerezo was no great shakes, but his role was that of the "defensive" midfielder in as much as they palyed that way. But the remaining 4 midfielders of EDER, FALCAO, SOCRATES, and ZICO were special (Zico could also be considered a deep lying striker but was mostly an attacking midfielder).

The 1986 midfield was just at the end of that great generation, and while not filled with the same verve as 1982, they did at least attempt to play an expansive game, and hadn't given in to the cynicism of the modern game yet.

The fact that I can't remember the 1990 team says all there is to know about that team, which probably explains why the change in attitude came in 1994, and the embracing of the very defensive midfield anchored by Dunga. I actually don't begrudge them that one at all, and 1998 was an interesting mix with a pragmatic side as well as some incredible skill (namely the original Ronaldo).

I guess I just find so many of this Brazilian team to be particularly unlikeable, and I suppose that is what saddens me. I used to look forward to seeing Brazil play for the flair, and the joy in their game. Now I see a bunch of clowns like Marcello and David Luiz who have plenty of skill, but like to act the hard men and put in terrible tackles on people, and then collapse screaming when any firm challenge goes in on them. Neymar is supremely talented, but acts like a pampered prima donna when things don't go his way, and also tries to get away with some cowardly late challenges. All i see from them is ego, not joy.

I would love to see a real dark horse team come through and win this tournament and upset the usual suspects, but I doubt it will happen.

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#12 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 03:10 AM

Oscar is a sheer joy to watch. He scored today - although he shouldn't have in a just world - but his work everywhere, defending well without being reckless, setting up others and hanging out on the right flank to cover up Dani Alves and Hulk's bad play was glorious to watch.

I was born in 1985, so I don't know anything about the '82, '86 and '90 teams, but I re-watched for years tape of the '94 team (watched it live, but I was missing a ton on the first watch as a kid) and really remember well the '98, '02 and '06 teams.

I'm also reading articles by people who are re-watching the old Pele and Garrincha games and they are saying that the squads were much more defensive minded than their legacy has led people to view them as.

But the '82 - '90 teams are a bit of a blank spot. So that's where you could come in I suppose.

Edit: This is kind of cool and definitely falls into line with what you're saying and what I'm saying as well.

http://en.wikipedia....E2.80.931994.29

This post has been edited by amphibian: 13 June 2014 - 03:13 AM

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#13 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 05:52 AM

It's not the first time the host of a World Cup gets blatantly unfair ref decisions in their favour - case in point: Worst Korea and Japan (also notable in my little country as the place and time when one of our pop "stars" turned our national anthem into a heartwarming christmas carol). I'm not watching this anyway, not bothered one bit, it shouldn't have been there in the first place. The real sports event of the year starts on the 30th of August!
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#14 User is offline   HoosierDaddy 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 06:11 AM

View Postamphibian, on 13 June 2014 - 02:11 AM, said:

I think it should have been 2-2, btw. The penalty was kinda legit - the hand on the shoulder - but the disallowed goal call was terrible and Oscar's goal (although beautiful to watch) was preceded immediately by a foul right in front of the referee.

Baaaad officiating throughout the game, even if the penalty call was kinda okay.


No it wasn't. That's a horrible penalty call. That happens in every single set-piece play, and besides that the Brazillian dove and got the call. Terrible penalty. There'll much more egregious fouls in the box not called in every game.

Frankly, Brazil didn't impress with any of its goals. Neymar's first goal was the most impressive simply due to it's targeting, but if he actually got ahold of that ball it was going into the stands.
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#15 User is offline   Kanubis 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:35 AM

In fairness I think the Croat goal was disallowed due to the linesman raising his flag. So I'll let the ref off that one but the penalty call was shit.

Can't see Croatia struggling to get out of the group anyway.

Anyway, Spain v Netherlands tonight, should be good Posted Image
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#16 User is offline   Macros 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 07:46 AM

Missed the second half, but from the first half Oscar was immense in his tracking back and einning the back and muscling through players with the ball, considering how light and young he is. Neymar is no Ronaldo that's for sure, regardless of his strike rate.
as others have said, this Brazil side feels lacking
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#17 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:15 AM

The penalty call was legit because of the shoulder pull. Yes, Fred fell over way too easily, however, he was hampered from a goal scoring opportunity clearly.

It's part of the rules of the game. Referee has to call that and it is different from set piece plays because Fred made contact with the ball in the right way.

What's not in the game is sheer immunity for goalies going up for fifty fifty balls. The "impedance" rule is to prevent people from screening the goalie to the ball, not to give them a halo of "do not touch" that calls back goals.
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#18 User is offline   amphibian 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:20 AM

The original Ronaldo was perhaps the greatest athlete the sport has ever seen. He was the fastest with the ball that I have ever seen and gifted with physical coordination beyond that of everyone I've watched since. He had both f feet and good aerial control in combination with a great eye towards the right runs at the right times. The knee injuries made him slow and lose his magic, yet he still had an incredible career.

He was the LeBron or the Usain Bolt of his day and to push Neymar into that discussion at this point in his young career is unfair.
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#19 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:30 AM

View Postamphibian, on 13 June 2014 - 08:15 AM, said:

The penalty call was legit because of the shoulder pull. Yes, Fred fell over way too easily, however, he was hampered from a goal scoring opportunity clearly.

It's part of the rules of the game. Referee has to call that and it is different from set piece plays because Fred made contact with the ball in the right way.

What's not in the game is sheer immunity for goalies going up for fifty fifty balls. The "impedance" rule is to prevent people from screening the goalie to the ball, not to give them a halo of "do not touch" that calls back goals.


Diving, regardless of being in the box or not, is the worst scum of this sport and should be hunted with great prejudice. Fred is filthy scum for doing that and you know it. Playing the rules instead of by the rules takes all the magic away from football. It's well overdue for it to receive out-of-play clock and referee control from the sidelines, with replay-based challenge (as in volleyball in more and more places). When a player decides to, instead of taking a shot at the goal, dip his foot and drop to try to cheat his way to a penalty, sport is dead.
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#20 User is offline   HoosierDaddy 

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Posted 13 June 2014 - 08:40 AM

It was a dive. Every set play has far worse and they don't call it because if they did it'd be a penalty every set play. It wasn't a clear goal scoring opportunity, thus no card, and it shouldn't have been a penalty as well.

Shitty refereeing. Sorry Amp. That's the truth. Ref's terrible decisions shouldn't decide outcomes, and ye olde Japanese ref just disqualified himself from every future World Cup with that call.
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