[Yago]

So, I just finished Gardens of the Moon... And I don't really get why people find it confusing and "annoying"?

Erikson doesn't spend much time explaining everything, but even then, reading the book, I had no real difficulty of keeping track of things. The way Paran (the main character of this book I think, or the one closest to it) thinks and acts is pretty straightforward, and as he learns more about what's going, so do we. In Darujhistan (sp?), it's a bit different, but even there it becomes clearer after a few chapters. (Guessed who the Eel was pretty quickly!)
The strange names were actually more "annoying" to me than the plot. I mean, seriously :/
The only thing I didn't really get while reading was the way the magic works (still don't get it tbh), but I guess that's how it's supposed to be. Didn't mind, it was fun anyway. Oh, and the poems or whatever at the start of very chapter, didn't get that.
I was warned going in this book that there wouldn't be much information to begin with, and that it required patience though. Maybe that helped.



Enjoyed the book very much btw, good plot, liked most of the characters. Sorry was probably my favrourite. Actually, I think I liked Sorry more than Apsalar Was kind off disappointed she was possessed the whole time, was hoping she joined the Shadow on her own will ^^ Although this makes far more sense of course. Also really liked Cotillion/ Rope and Shadowthrone. Loved that first conversation. Whiskeyjack and the Brdegburners were good too. And Rallick. Oh, and Rake of course, badass. Almost everyone actually. Except maybe Turban Orr, and Tayshrenn. Oh, and Hairlock as a puppet. He was ok when he was still alive.
renn.

Anyways, I'd better go to bed, it's 3 am over here. Will start the next book tomorrow.

This post has been edited by Yago: 14 September 2013 - 01:04 AM

[amphibian]

That's a complicated question and I'm not sure I or anyone can deliver a truly complete answer.

Some of it is that some readers genuinely aren't ready to deal with what the book is in terms of complexity, plotting and description right off the bat in their read. There's not too many books or SF series out there that try to do so much so fast and oftentimes, people get used to the slow development a la the "farm boy discovers innate specialness and saves world". There might be too many balls being juggled at once for people new to this sort of book to step in easily, especially with the betrayal at Pale happening so early in the book.

A bit more of it is likely due to the author's voice. The writing style can grate on some or be difficult to warm up to, especially when Kruppe is involved.

The rest might be ascribed to people not being used to truly paying attention to the details in what they're reading - essentially doing homework for the book or whatever the process may be for them.

I also speculate that the reader's own preferences for what a story should be about or told ("I want more books like Wheel of Time/Harry Potter/Sword of Truth/Frog and Toad") strongly influence their short statements of their opinions.

[birthSqueeze]

Steven Erikson has a very interesting and original writing style so my guess is that people aren't used to that type of style so put down the book when he challenges them by throwing all of these in-world references which they have no point of reference to for understanding. I admit that the first 100 pages were a real struggle for me but after that it wasn't too bad.

[nacht]

I think the problem is that Steve drops you in the middle of some gruesome action and does not actually lighten up until you get to Darujishtan (and that lasts only for a short time).
Added to that most people emotionally identify themselves with the Bridgeburners and it is hard to take the abuse. Contrast this with LOTR where you are dropped pleasantly in the shire.

Thinking purely in terms of marketing, I have to consider this as a mistake. The opening impression/emotion matters a lot and Steve just refused to pander.

If I was SE, I would start with with a certain character named

Spoiler

Masan

being chased by the hounds and then being rescued by Paran, or maybe the other way around. :-) Here's to you Xena, my warrior princess.

This post has been edited by nacht: 14 September 2013 - 06:37 AM

[worry]

I think some minds focus on stuff like the maps and the Dramatis Personae to their own detriment (in terms of enjoying the story). I mean most books have a similar number of characters and take place over multiple locations, but you don't get maps (or references to places not on the map you get) or huge introductory lists of characters (that you might obsessively turn back to), who you might assume are all vitally important (otherwise why would they be listed?). Lots of people don't need to go back and forth to those references, they don't have those obsessive qualities. Others do, but they enjoy the process (this group might enjoy GotM the most? Not sure). And another group have this obsessive quality, but don't really enjoy it; it bothers them not to have everything down to a science, to have missing puzzle pieces. That's in addition to, and perhaps overlaps with, matters of personal taste.

[Kanese S's]

Welcome. Sorry's my favorite in GotM, too.

Also, she did kinda join willingly, just she was sort of a passenger in her own body most of the time. Keep on reading for more awesome.

As to why people say the book is confusing... a lot of people are less comfortable with not knowing how everything works, I suspect.

[RACHEL]

It seems to me that you were unaware that Aapsalar / Sorry was possessed the whole time. If that is the case then it proves that this book (and series) is confusing. It is easier to grasp the broader strokes but I find out things all the time that I missed or didn't catch. You liked the first conversation between Rope and Shadowthrone but you didn't even catch that they were talking about possessing Sorry. Also the adjunct explains to Paran that the hounds slaughtered all those people to cover up something ( the possession of Sorry ). If you were aware she was possessed I am sorry for misunderstanding your post, but if you weren't aware then you missed a big storypoint even though all the while you said you had no problem understanding the book. I am not trying to be a jerk, just pointing out that these books have so much going on. No person is able to read these books and grasp everything right away, and, for everything you do understand right away, there are one or two things you didn't even notice. I am glad you liked the first book. You are in for some awesome future reading with this series.

[Yago]

RACHEL, on 14 September 2013 - 04:07 PM, said:

It seems to me that you were unaware that Aapsalar / Sorry was possessed the whole time. If that is the case then it proves that this book (and series) is confusing. It is easier to grasp the broader strokes but I find out things all the time that I missed or didn't catch. You liked the first conversation between Rope and Shadowthrone but you didn't even catch that they were talking about possessing Sorry. Also the adjunct explains to Paran that the hounds slaughtered all those people to cover up something ( the possession of Sorry ). If you were aware she was possessed I am sorry for misunderstanding your post, but if you weren't aware then you missed a big storypoint even though all the while you said you had no problem understanding the book. I am not trying to be a jerk, just pointing out that these books have so much going on. No person is able to read these books and grasp everything right away, and, for everything you do understand right away, there are one or two things you didn't even notice. I am glad you liked the first book. You are in for some awesome future reading with this series.

I knew she was being used, I just thought she knew she was being used. I understood all the rest about her being possessed. But you're right, there were things I didn't grasp right away (there probably still are things I just forgot right now that I don't get). But I didn't find it confusing, I was just curious how it would play out. I like surprises.
Anyway, thanks, looking forward to it. Heard the second was similar to this one, with lots of new characters and stuff. Will be interesting.

[Elzhi]

When I first read GotM, I loved it.

Some parts are slow. Some things you read and wonder "wtf is he talking about" or "who the heck is that"? and you realize no explanation is coming, at least not in any further chapters.

Doesn't jive with some readers who prefer things to be laid out plain and to the point.

Compared to, say, Joe Abercrombie's books... MBotF is much more complex. Harder to wrap your head around it all. But way more enjoyable once you do.

[James Hutton]

Yago, on 14 September 2013 - 01:00 AM, said:

The strange names were actually more "annoying" to me than the plot. I mean, seriously :/

You should try R. Scott Bakker's books

[birthSqueeze]

I have very fond memories of obsessively flipping back and fourth between the text and the list of characters, trying to figure out who is allied with whom and why, etc. Yeah, I had to read this one pretty slow because there is so much information to comprehend at once. Even then I still forgot important things and had to return, hunting for specific dialogue. I loved it but it's definitely not for a casual reader.

[obvakhi]

It was not as confusing as I thought it would be, I followed along fine. I only checked the character index like 1-2 times. Memories of Ice was more confusing to me.
-

This post has been edited by obvakhi: 16 September 2013 - 09:19 AM

[You are a sheep]

Wow the fact that you need to ask that question is laughable. Its one of the worst written books out there.He wrote it to be confusing on pourpose, it's obliviously not hard to understand what's going on in the moment but most people (who arnt just tools like you) like a little more in depth characters and plots. Your either and idiot or a sheep or both.

[Gorefest]

Welcome to the forum!

[Coltaine -]

Searching a three year old thread in a forum just to insult someone is really a good way to spend your time.

[Andorion]

- Coltaine -, on 26 August 2016 - 01:18 PM, said:

Searching a three year old thread in a forum just to insult someone is really a good way to spend your time.

You underestimate the sharp edge of motivation pent up insults can develop

[Vengeance]

Andorion, on 26 August 2016 - 02:04 PM, said:

- Coltaine -, on 26 August 2016 - 01:18 PM, said:

Searching a three year old thread in a forum just to insult someone is really a good way to spend your time.

You underestimate the sharp edge of motivation pent up insults can develop

Also you assume that someone on something awful has anything better to do.

[worry]

I find that anyone who refers to people as "sheep" or better yet "sheeple" is always worth listening to. They're such iconoclasts! It's like having freakin Jared Leto AS THE JOKER in our very midst.

[Gorefest]

A pretty decent attempt but falling tragically short of the Heath Ledger impersonation? Seems like a fair cop. This Mal guy trolls much better.

[Lady Bliss]

Gorefest, on 26 August 2016 - 09:39 PM, said:

A pretty decent attempt but falling tragically short of the Heath Ledger impersonation? Seems like a fair cop. This Mal guy trolls much better.

I assumed that the You Are A Sheep account was created by Mal.