[Zadakeem]

MODGOD NOTICE OF THREAD SPLIT from elseforum. Rolling thread so no spoilers or block spoilers that are past wherever the OP is at.


Thoughts on Chapters 1 & 2

I am very immpressed. The writing is crisp and wonderful. The "confusion" that is fretted about in many reviews in my opinion is over-exagerated. I think as long as you take what is front of you and dont try to overthink what is going on a person will be fine in keeping track of what is going on.

I am surprised how ok I was with the idea of the marionette...in any other book I would most likely scoff at this idea...but here it simply fits! The only part I found confusing was the explanation of the two cards. The Knight and the Joker. THe symbolism was explained...I think. I just dont think I get it. If there are answers later on just tell me to RAFO.

Also, I think I figured out the magic system. As far as the mages go at least. They open up different "warrens" or doors into different types of magic. Depending on skill and strength that can take a certain amount of power out of these doors, and shape that power into what they need done. Am I correct?

This post has been edited by Abyss: 23 May 2013 - 07:06 PM

[D'rek]

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

Thoughts on Chapters 1 & 2

I am very immpressed. The writing is crisp and wonderful. The "confusion" that is fretted about in many reviews in my opinion is over-exagerated. I think as long as you take what is front of you and dont try to overthink what is going on a person will be fine in keeping track of what is going on.

I am surprised how ok I was with the idea of the marionette...in any other book I would most likely scoff at this idea...but here it simply fits!

Yaaaay!

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

The only part I found confusing was the explanation of the two cards. The Knight and the Joker. THe symbolism was explained...I think. I just dont think I get it. If there are answers later on just tell me to RAFO.

The prophetic Deck of Dragons is usually pretty open to multiple interpretations. And sometimes they are very RAFO, or RFMBAFO!

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

Also, I think I figured out the magic system. As far as the mages go at least. They open up different "warrens" or doors into different types of magic. Depending on skill and strength that can take a certain amount of power out of these doors, and shape that power into what they need done. Am I correct?

Yup.

So far...

[Defiance]

You're doing great so far. I love hearing from new readers and I'm looking forward to seeing what you think as you progress through this book (and hopefully the entire series!).

[Zadakeem]

Im having fun talking to all of you about my thoughts and questions. I think I will post up a small review on every two chapters. It will give me reason to read fast, and keep me excited to move on.

This community is fantastic, it is a level rival to the community over at 17thshard.

Anyways, ill post up more very soon.

[Tehol the Only]

Defiance, on 23 May 2013 - 07:54 PM, said:

You're doing great so far. I love hearing from new readers and I'm looking forward to seeing what you think as you progress through this book (and hopefully the entire series!).

Yesss yessss we all do!
There's something incredibly enjoyable in hearing the comments of someone new to the series... maybe it's because it brings back happy memories from our first read.. aaaaaah nostalgia.


Eheh anyway glad to hear you're positively impressed!! The "take what's in front of you and don't overthink" philosophy is an excellent way to face the first few books.

[Devaney]

If you manage to stop every few chapters to discuss it I'll be quite impressed. I have to force myself to set the books down. Right now the ninth book (DoD) is screaming for me to get home and read it. Only three chapters left and I really did not want to stop. These books are all incredible. Enjoy!

[Kanese S's]

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

Also, I think I figured out the magic system. As far as the mages go at least. They open up different "warrens" or doors into different types of magic. Depending on skill and strength that can take a certain amount of power out of these doors, and shape that power into what they need done. Am I correct?

Pretty on track, yeah. Good way to think of the warrens, especially since it's one that I think will still make sense as you learn more about them.

[Kanubis]

It sounds like you have a very appropriate attitude for getting the most of out these books.

I hope you get as much out of them I did!

[Zadakeem]

Devaney, on 23 May 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

If you manage to stop every few chapters to discuss it I'll be quite impressed. I have to force myself to set the books down. Right now the ninth book (DoD) is screaming for me to get home and read it. Only three chapters left and I really did not want to stop. These books are all incredible. Enjoy!

haha, I have an awesome privelage to read at work. The only downfall is I have to stop about every 3 minutes or so for varying lengths of time. So, since I have to be forced to stop, I figure I can take some extra time to write down my thoughts. haha, but we shall see.

Kanese S, on 24 May 2013 - 09:28 AM, said:

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

Also, I think I figured out the magic system. As far as the mages go at least. They open up different "warrens" or doors into different types of magic. Depending on skill and strength that can take a certain amount of power out of these doors, and shape that power into what they need done. Am I correct?

Pretty on track, yeah. Good way to think of the warrens, especially since it's one that I think will still make sense as you learn more about them.

I got the thought process of the warrens (dont take this the wrong way) from the Wheel of TIme. In there they have two types of power that can be drawn from an shaped. This is not similar, because apparently there are way more than two types of power, and some warrens can actually be walked into! But I must view things in a way that makes sense. I am glad to know I am on the right course.

The only thing that continues to baffle me is those light blinded cards! I cant make sense of what their meaning is...at all. I feel like sombody is trying to play magic cards with me while the writing is chinese. Is this how im supposed to feel? haha. But its not enough to frustrate anything else. Everything else makes perfect sense. Or...as much sense as the writer intends.

[Tehol the Only]

The interpretation of the various reading of the deck of dragons is veeeeery difficult. Most of those pack in layers and layers of meaning and require an extensive knowledge of the series to be fully (when even possible) comprehended.

TL,DR : Yup, the cards are meant to be confusing as hell.


Edit: that said, it's often possible to catch tidbits of what they mean, even for a new reader:D

This post has been edited by Tehol the Only: 24 May 2013 - 11:48 AM

[Abyss]

Devaney, on 23 May 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

If you manage to stop every few chapters to discuss it I'll be quite impressed. I have to force myself to set the books down. Right now the ninth book (DoD) is screaming for me to get home and read it. Only three chapters left and I really did not want to stop. These books are all incredible. Enjoy!

Devaney I can't even grasp how you are functioning at anything else at this moment.

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

...The only thing that continues to baffle me is those light blinded cards! I cant make sense of what their meaning is...at all. I feel like sombody is trying to play magic cards with me while the writing is chinese. Is this how im supposed to feel? haha. But its not enough to frustrate anything else. Everything else makes perfect sense. Or...as much sense as the writer intends.

Tehol the Only, on 24 May 2013 - 11:47 AM, said:

The interpretation of the various reading of the deck of dragons is veeeeery difficult. Most of those pack in layers and layers of meaning and require an extensive knowledge of the series to be fully (when even possible) comprehended.
...

About the Deck, think about it like that story about the blind men and the elephant... everyone sees it slightly different depending on how they look, and if they aren't careful it can squish them.

Youi'll learn more as you read and I don't want to spoil, but it can be confusing... go with your 'don't need to understand everything' attitude and you're set.

[Zadakeem]

Chapter 3 & 4-

First a note- the spaces between my chapter posts is going to lengthen slightly. In an attempt to make my posts and this thread more worth all of our time, I have begun taking notes, writing theories, and writing small synopsis of each section, so I will have a greater, and more pertinent presentation when I post here.

Chapter 3- Card playing...more on that later. The one flaw I am noticing and it may jus tbe me...is connection to the characters. I find myself more connected and concerned with the story and the overarching situations, instead of the single characters themselves. Because usually at a death of a character I feel a sense of loss. Here when Paran dies at the hands of Sorry, Ammanas, and Cotillion, It was more like "O, he dead." Instead of "crap, he died...I liked him" does that make sense?

It was good to see Ammanas and Cotillion again, seeing bits and pieces of what is going on with them and House Shadow. When my thoughts that they were behind the massacra in the ealier parts of book were confirmed I just had to smile at how blatantly evil these guys are.

QUESTIONS: Ok, so are the Warrens sentient? or just their Rulers? Tiste Edur is on the ShadowThrone. But does every Warren have one? SO a warren is both a power...and a person? DO they draw on that persons power? (If any of these are RAFO...just tell me. )

Chapter 4- This chapter in my mind really just has the desighn to make the reader feel that everything is going bad....for everybody. It is even said about 3 times that "everything is falling apart" (not an exact quote) but the chapter does convey that feeling!

The card sections in this chapter made a lot more sense. For the simple reason that I have seen some of the characters and have had them state their own motivations. So, that was fun. I feel like the fog is lifting on that end.

The hounds perspective in this I felt was...uneeded. I prefer being as in the dark as the charaters are about things.FInding things out when they find them out. Showing the hound and his plans and opinions just didnt do it for me at all. But it is what it is.

Paran kills something! The sword must be really special..... cause all that magic flying around did not do a thing. And was Hairlock trying to suck out the Hounds soul? Into himself? I assume this would taint Hairlock a little more than he is already? AGAIN....RAFO...if need be.

[Abyss]

Zadakeem, on 24 May 2013 - 04:09 PM, said:

Chapter 3 & 4-

First a note- the spaces between my chapter posts is going to lengthen slightly. In an attempt to make my posts and this thread more worth all of our time, I have begun taking notes, writing theories, and writing small synopsis of each section, so I will have a greater, and more pertinent presentation when I post here.

Your thread, your fun, your call.

Quote

Chapter 3- ...The one flaw I am noticing and it may jus tbe me...is connection to the characters. I find myself more connected and concerned with the story and the overarching situations, instead of the single characters themselves. Because usually at a death of a character I feel a sense of loss. Here when Paran dies at the hands of Sorry, Ammanas, and Cotillion, It was more like "O, he dead." Instead of "crap, he died...I liked him" does that make sense?

All i'll say to that is give it time. The characters are 'new' to you at this point and the events you're reading are part of getting to know them. Even if they happen to die.

Quote

QUESTIONS: Ok, so are the Warrens sentient? or just their Rulers? Tiste Edur is on the ShadowThrone. But does every Warren have one? SO a warren is both a power...and a person? DO they draw on that persons power? (If any of these are RAFO...just tell me. )

RAFO. Put it this way, the nature of the warrens is part of the story.

Quote

...Paran kills something! The sword must be really special..... cause all that magic flying around did not do a thing. And was Hairlock trying to suck out the Hounds soul? Into himself? I assume this would taint Hairlock a little more than he is already? AGAIN....RAFO...if need be.

My take on that scene was that Tattersail was worried Hairlock would gain too much power... not so much 'taint' as propel someone already a bit nuts and power-mad right over the top. It's particularly interesting because Hairlock is supposed to be Tattersail's ally, but she panics when it looks like he's going to do something effective (for himself).

[Defiance]

Erikson doesn't really bother with exposition in the traditional sense. As a result, when compared to say A Song of Ice and Fire, The Wheel of Time, or The Lord of the Rings, we don't get to know the characters before they are thrust into the middle of things. When I re-read Gardens of the Moon, I find that the characters are brimming with personality, but on my first time through I missed a lot of this. So much is happening so quickly and there is such a large cast of characters from the start that it can be difficult to connect with any one person. For now, it's okay if interest in the plot is what makes you interested in the characters - I'd say that's pretty normal for a first time reader, and it's something that will change as you get further into things.

I think the PoV from the Hound of Shadow is important. We already know from the first chapter that these Hounds are supernaturally powerful, but there's no indication of their intelligence. Are they just mindless beasts that follow their master's every whim? By letting us into Gear's head, we find that these creatures possess an intelligence of their own, as otherworldly as it might be.

[Zadakeem]

Defiance, on 24 May 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

I think the PoV from the Hound of Shadow is important. We already know from the first chapter that these Hounds are supernaturally powerful, but there's no indication of their intelligence. Are they just mindless beasts that follow their master's every whim? By letting us into Gear's head, we find that these creatures possess an intelligence of their own, as otherworldly as it might be.

I think your point is quite valid. I did not think of it that way. It defidently makes the threat a little more menacing knowing that these things are sentient and not mindless drones being sent on some evil guys errands. So good point.

One of the big things I hear from this series is how important a second time though is haha. Apparently its even better the second time around. Which I find really rare for a maxi-series such as this.

[Abyss]

Zadakeem, on 24 May 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

...One of the big things I hear from this series is how important a second time though is haha. Apparently its even better the second time around. Which I find really rare for a maxi-series such as this.

There are literally (pun intended) hordes of things that don't mean anything until a re-read. Nothing major that detracts from the first read, but it add a whole other level to the reader's enjoyment and 'value for dollar'.
Just by harmless example, some of the little excerpts and poems in the chapter headers refer to people, places and events that you don't even read about until later books.

[Kanese S's]

Zadakeem, on 24 May 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

Devaney, on 23 May 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

If you manage to stop every few chapters to discuss it I'll be quite impressed. I have to force myself to set the books down. Right now the ninth book (DoD) is screaming for me to get home and read it. Only three chapters left and I really did not want to stop. These books are all incredible. Enjoy!

haha, I have an awesome privelage to read at work. The only downfall is I have to stop about every 3 minutes or so for varying lengths of time. So, since I have to be forced to stop, I figure I can take some extra time to write down my thoughts. haha, but we shall see.

Kanese S, on 24 May 2013 - 09:28 AM, said:

Zadakeem, on 23 May 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

Also, I think I figured out the magic system. As far as the mages go at least. They open up different "warrens" or doors into different types of magic. Depending on skill and strength that can take a certain amount of power out of these doors, and shape that power into what they need done. Am I correct?

Pretty on track, yeah. Good way to think of the warrens, especially since it's one that I think will still make sense as you learn more about them.

I got the thought process of the warrens (dont take this the wrong way) from the Wheel of TIme. In there they have two types of power that can be drawn from an shaped. This is not similar, because apparently there are way more than two types of power, and some warrens can actually be walked into! But I must view things in a way that makes sense. I am glad to know I am on the right course.

The only thing that continues to baffle me is those light blinded cards! I cant make sense of what their meaning is...at all. I feel like sombody is trying to play magic cards with me while the writing is chinese. Is this how im supposed to feel? haha. But its not enough to frustrate anything else. Everything else makes perfect sense. Or...as much sense as the writer intends.

They're like Tarot Cards.

Except, you know, the pantheon and all things spiritual are much more "yeah, this definitely exists" in the world of Malazan, for its denizens. They're used to basically get a bit of a glimpse of what's going on with the pantheon and such. Sorta.

[Kanese S's]

The hounds are interesting, if also a bit imposing.

I also didn't know which characters I was supposed to bond with the first time I read GotM. I was very confused about who I was supposed to be rooting for.

[Zadakeem]

Kanese S, on 25 May 2013 - 08:57 AM, said:

The hounds are interesting, if also a bit imposing.

I also didn't know which characters I was supposed to bond with the first time I read GotM. I was very confused about who I was supposed to be rooting for.

Right now, Im really just enjoying the story. As far as rooting for people, I really have not picked a side, I do not know enough yet. All I know is WhiskeyJack is a good guy. I like him. and Tattersail. She is good too. I think...

[Zadakeem]

Chapters 5 & 6

Ch. 5- I dont know why, but I like Crokus, he is a fun Character! Even though he only had like, two lines where he actually spoke, his perspective has a somewhat Alladin feel fo it, and while he was running from the three killers it was just fun to watch him do his thing! Overall, this and the next chapter made me really enjoy Darujhistan. It is a fun city to be in, not in actuality...it is probably a terrible city to be in. Civil War and all that...assasins...theives...wizards...corrupt politicions...but it is a heck of a lot of fun to read about!!!!

ch. 6- Baruk and Crone, they are such a fun pair. I honestly hope I see them together often, there is just this air of comedy with them, it just brings a small smile to my face as they interact. Alomander Rake. Please tell me he is a regular. I want to see him just unleash all he has at somebody. Just to see what happens. haha. Crone is a fun character, I 98% put a book down if an animal can speak...or if puppets can speak for that matter. This book does it extremely well. I like how Crone kindoff off-sets the Houd from the earlier chapters. I assume animals play a big part in this series?

Ok, questions are few with this chapter- The term "Ascendant" has been used a number of times, and I still have no idea what they are. Will I figure this out later? Or can I have it explained to me a little more now.