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We came across the Nascent in HoC, and it is briefly mentioned in MT, while Rhulad and Hannan Mosag are discussing sailing across worlds to conquer peoples and make an empire.
What happens during period of time in between the end of MT and the beginning of Hoc? What have the Edur done? And why/how have Trull's brothers turned against him so, and Shorned him in the Nascent.
Is it becouse of Rhulad's aleigance to the Crippled God? Has it's poison infected Fear and Binadas? To the extent that Trull's logical and intelligent reasoning has become treason?
Trull's Shorning
#2 Guest_Rheanar Delh\'Suhn_*
Posted 04 November 2005 - 10:04 AM
i think that from MT that it is obvious that Trull is unhappy with the way the edur are heading, he knows that they are being manipulated, and would have left with Fear if he didnt feel a responsibility to Rhulad.
HOC mentions something about Trull claiming one of the enemies of the Edur were "pure kin" and that they shudnt kill them. Who or what they are, perhaps the Bluerose, who were tiste andii, at least in part, another enclave of tiste edur, i dont know.
HOC mentions something about Trull claiming one of the enemies of the Edur were "pure kin" and that they shudnt kill them. Who or what they are, perhaps the Bluerose, who were tiste andii, at least in part, another enclave of tiste edur, i dont know.
#3
Hume 
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Posted 04 November 2005 - 12:02 PM
When they Mean brothers in that passage I think they mean not in a blood related way more of metaphorical sense. Remember Fear actually bugged of with Silchas and co' on the ship at the end of MT so he could not have been a part of Trulls shorning.
The Pure Kin I think Were the Nascent, There really isnt that much we can tell because that im prety sure is the most your told.
The Pure Kin I think Were the Nascent, There really isnt that much we can tell because that im prety sure is the most your told.
#6
kettle
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Posted 04 November 2005 - 12:45 PM
I certainly think the Pure Kin are other Edur, maybe Trull refers to them as pure because they would not join Rhulad, therefore they were not tainted by the poison of the Crippled God. This would explain why Rhulad and his Edur would want to kill other Edur, because they refused to join with him...
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Posted 04 November 2005 - 02:31 PM
I agree with you Kettle. It's logical, given that the Edur are searching the tattered fragments of Emurlahn in trying to draw their power together again.
#8
Tiste Simeon
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Posted 04 November 2005 - 04:28 PM
I remember discussing this somewhere a while back... What I still don't think is resolved, is who is the one who shorns him? Is it Rhulad or Hannan Mosag? And as for Pure Kin, I thought it was Andii personally, but what Kettle says makes sense.
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#9 Guest_Rheanar Delh\'Suhn_*
Posted 04 November 2005 - 06:46 PM
i figure it was rhulad, given the way he spoke, like he was the one giving all the orders and such, and that the others with him were too scared to say anything.
now i wonder, was binadas one of them?
now i wonder, was binadas one of them?
#10 Guest_Sytkan_*
Posted 04 November 2005 - 08:42 PM
it seemed too coherant for rhulad, tbh, i mean he was bad enough after he lost udinaas, but hes died more since then and tus become even crazier... my guess is that the speaker was hannan mosag or binadas
#11 Guest_Rheanar Delh\'Suhn_*
Posted 04 November 2005 - 10:23 PM
just read the prologue, the way things are said do remind me of someone in power. trull has aparently said that the shorner (couldnt think of a better name!) has betrayed his people, serves a hidden master etc, and then the shorner says that the enemy is in flight, from nothing an empire was forged etc.
thus, serves a hidden master being the key phrase, leaves us with hannan mosag or rhulad himself. my money is on rhulad
thus, serves a hidden master being the key phrase, leaves us with hannan mosag or rhulad himself. my money is on rhulad
#12
Tiste Simeon
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Posted 04 November 2005 - 11:47 PM
Quote
thus, serves a hidden master being the key phrase, leaves us with hannan mosag or rhulad himself. my money is on rhulad
See it could be either - I'm fairly sure Hannan Mosag still has plans to get rid of Rhulad... I can't really remember, but I do recall something at the end of MT where something is mentioned about HMs loyalty to Rhulad...
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#13 Guest_Rheanar Delh\'Suhn_*
Posted 05 November 2005 - 12:02 AM
yeah, i do remember at the end of MT HM seemed to want to usurp rhulads power, at least i think what he did to the king and queen wasnt sanctioned my rhulad.
#14
Tes'thesula
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Posted 05 November 2005 - 01:13 PM
After MT, i don't think HM is in much of a position to do anything...a) his body is twisted beyond belief
he did not obey his emperor's orders to kill him...thats the important one...is rhulad going to trust HM after that betrayel
plus after udinass left i get the feeling that Rhulad descended into cold madness...not a ranting lunitic, just a inhuman, incredibly cruel, with bouts of ravings kinda guy.
he did not obey his emperor's orders to kill him...thats the important one...is rhulad going to trust HM after that betrayelplus after udinass left i get the feeling that Rhulad descended into cold madness...not a ranting lunitic, just a inhuman, incredibly cruel, with bouts of ravings kinda guy.
#15
Tiste Simeon
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Posted 05 November 2005 - 04:51 PM
I personally do believe it was Rhulad, I'm just not discounting the possibility that it was HM... He does seem to have some tricks up his sleeve...
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#16 Guest_Tempest_*
Posted 09 November 2005 - 07:04 PM
out of interest when does this take place cos in the prologue at the end of my copy of HoC its 1133 but in MT its 1159 any ideas
#18
Tiste Simeon
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Posted 09 November 2005 - 11:29 PM
AFAIK the prologue of HOC is about 6 months after the end of MT. I think Erikson admitted some mistakes in the timeline thing. I think that when he brings out the encyclopedia (if he does... ) it will have the definite timeline in...
) it will have the definite timeline in...
A Haunting Poem
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#19
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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:49 AM
Tempest said:
out of interest when does this take place cos in the prologue at the end of my copy of HoC its 1133 but in MT its 1159 any ideas
Interesting... my TPB has a date of 1139, and my subsequently bought MMPB has 1159.. so there's quite a few dates out there
SE has said it was a mistake in Q&A thread #3 ... the date should be 1159
"There had been no sunset in the realm the Tiste Edur called The Nascent for five months".
Rhulad flooded a world in MT, a fragment of Emurlahn.....before the taking of Letheras, one assumes it's the same place.
#20
Hume
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Posted 10 November 2005 - 12:39 PM
Rheanar Delh said:
just
thus, serves a hidden master being the key phrase, leaves us with hannan mosag or rhulad himself. my money is on rhulad
thus, serves a hidden master being the key phrase, leaves us with hannan mosag or rhulad himself. my money is on rhulad
I think maybe the Hidden master is the crippled god myself. Rhulad aint all the hidden methinks. Considering the events in the Noble house back in the Tiste edur place.
