[Serc]

Tulas Shorn, on 30 April 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

checking in to see the result of the weekends discussion, and I see that Serc is staying on his track. I dislike how he seems so positive of his choices. I also don't like his fishing for reactions.i'm not sure where the idea that kaschan has a dr of 0 came from. guess I have some re-reading to do tomorrow!

Serc only thinks Kaschan has 0 DR by 50/50 chance. Perhaps the always-kind-with-words Kaschan can shed some light onto this fact for us himself.


Thinks we can get him to tell us the truth?

[Mockra]

I really dislike the way Serc is playing - he's being so smug that I'm almost willing to bet that he's got a lynch-proof or something. But he's clearly trying to scare us into looking elsewhere, and I certainly don't buy his newest argument that he's trying to draw attention away from the priest, since nothing about anyone else being the priest was even mentioned before.


Vote Serc


And if he turns up a zombie, I'm willing to bet Fener is one too.

[Kalse]

Ok, my thoughts so far as they are:

- serc is dominating thread discussion, and it might be worth looking at the times he pops up to do so, as he could be trying to divert attention from someone else. My first thought was Ampelas, but then I realised he voted for him...

- so maybe it's from either Korbas or Fener, both of whom were getting some attention prior to serc's latest bout of blowing up?

- right now I have no idea who to vote for, I just can't get all the alts straight as yet. I' somewhat against a low poster hunt, for obvious reasons

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 2. The clock has been frozen with 35 Hours and 59 Minutes remaining.

30 Players still alive: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Anthras, Atrahal, D'riss, Eloth, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Kalse, Karosis, Kaschan, Korbas, Korvalain, Liosan, Meanas, Mockra, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Serc, Shelthata Lore, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Thyrllan, Tulas Shorn

16 votes to lynch, 15 votes to go to night.

4 Votes for Ampelas ( Emurlahn, Rashan, Serc, Thyrllan )
1 Vote for Fener ( Olar Ethil )
1 Vote for Kalse ( Shelthata Lore )
1 Vote for Korbas ( Anomandaris )
2 Votes for Serc ( Liosan, Mockra )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Anthras, Atrahal, D'riss, Eloth, Fener, Galain, Kalse, Karosis, Kaschan, Korbas, Korvalain, Meanas, Omtose, Osseric, Ruse, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

[Mockra]

Serc, on 30 April 2012 - 11:17 AM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 30 April 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

checking in to see the result of the weekends discussion, and I see that Serc is staying on his track. I dislike how he seems so positive of his choices. I also don't like his fishing for reactions.i'm not sure where the idea that kaschan has a dr of 0 came from. guess I have some re-reading to do tomorrow!

Serc only thinks Kaschan has 0 DR by 50/50 chance. Perhaps the always-kind-with-words Kaschan can shed some light onto this fact for us himself.


Thinks we can get him to tell us the truth?

Do you want to try and elucidate for us why you believe this about Kaschan - and moreover, what good you think it does to reveal such a thing?

[Mockra]

Kalse, on 30 April 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:

Ok, my thoughts so far as they are:

- serc is dominating thread discussion, and it might be worth looking at the times he pops up to do so, as he could be trying to divert attention from someone else. My first thought was Ampelas, but then I realised he voted for him...

- so maybe it's from either Korbas or Fener, both of whom were getting some attention prior to serc's latest bout of blowing up?

- right now I have no idea who to vote for, I just can't get all the alts straight as yet. I' somewhat against a low poster hunt, for obvious reasons

I don't think Serc's trying to distract from those two, they've long since been put to the wayside and yet Serc carries on. No, I think he's just playing for himself - and possibly his other zombie alts if he's of the undead persuasion

[Omtose]

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 10:51 AM, said:

Serc, on 30 April 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

Quote

snip

I know that I DONT know 100 percent that Liosan and Omtose are the paired killers from the BurnBridgers.

I know that I DONT know 99 percent that Liosan and Omtose are the paired killers from the BurnBridgers.

I know that I DONT know what percent I should stop at.

How have you arrived at linking them together?

That would be because we both disagreed, for different reasons, with the strategy he was trying to push forward. Essentially, because we don't like him.

[Fener]

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 10:47 AM, said:

Serc, on 30 April 2012 - 10:37 AM, said:

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

Fener, on 28 April 2012 - 01:04 AM, said:

*Lightbulb goes off above my head*

I know it now!

I think Serc is the priest. He said "Repent your sins" and he was accused of being independent. Sins (and the thing that preaches against them (religion)) have to do with priests (priests are not sinful etc etc) and the priest is independent, as was stated in the OP.

What were your motivations behind this post Fener? Are you saying we should lynch Serc? Protect him? Point him out for target practice?

Lynch good Serc!?

Appalled good Serc is!

Nothing but stick his neck out on the chopping block, hoping to help the glorious Mafia 87 group by trying to ascertain hidden affiliations of certain nefarious individuals he has!

Note no misdeed nor any intentions of malintent has noble Serc displayed, produced, organized, hydrogenized, theorized, nor discombobulated for the good patrons of magnanimous thread!

Stick with noble Serc. He shall not guide you into the shadows of doubt, but deliver thee to a sunny, grassy plain where even the very plants become your best of friends.

I want to know Fener's motivations behind the post, i'm not saying we should lynch you but rather what are his thoughts behind the post.

If you read the last few pages its quite obvious why I said that.

[Tellan]

Geez, I leave you guys alone for a night or so and....not too much happens - phew

There's plenty of players who have said extremely little (yeah yeah, including me). I don't necessarily disagree with going for the lowest posters, but I wouldn't go for THE lowest poster. I think the zombie people would put more effort into that. Yeah, I know it's not based on post deductions but gut instead, but I still think it's a reasonable assumption.

Anyone else noticed Meanas' annoying habit of just going through posts that have already been covered by others?

[Meanas]

Been away most of the weekend and wanted to do a proper catch up. No point reading through and disagreeing with someone or finding something I want answered and not asking the question. I do apologise before doing the catch up.

[Meanas]

Fener, on 30 April 2012 - 11:32 AM, said:

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 10:47 AM, said:

SNIP

If you read the last few pages its quite obvious why I said that.

No actually Fener it isn't, please elaborate for me..

[Tellan]

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Been away most of the weekend and wanted to do a proper catch up. No point reading through and disagreeing with someone or finding something I want answered and not asking the question. I do apologise before doing the catch up.

Yeah, but it's not like that. Pretty much everything you mention has already been covered by someone in some fashion, if you read through properly. You just come across as a post-padder to me.

[Thyrllan]

Tellan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

Geez, I leave you guys alone for a night or so and....not too much happens - phew

There's plenty of players who have said extremely little (yeah yeah, including me). I don't necessarily disagree with going for the lowest posters, but I wouldn't go for THE lowest poster. I think the zombie people would put more effort into that. Yeah, I know it's not based on post deductions but gut instead, but I still think it's a reasonable assumption.

Anyone else noticed Meanas' annoying habit of just going through posts that have already been covered by others?

I disagree. I reckon one alt might be intentionally be left 'hibernating' - we actually don't lynch low posters all that often, we just talk about it a lot. It could be regarded as another route to keeping an alt safe. Of course, if Ampelas starts suddenly posting now, I'll regard that as suspicious too

[Kaschan]

Interesting. Serc is claiming that he was the person attacked by killers at night, AND that he claims knows my DR. And he has been claiming that he is the Independent Priest all game long.

Does anyone honestly think the Priest, who is listed as 'fighting against zombies' would have this knowledge? I certainly don't. I don't think the zombies would either. Or any of the Independents. Which puts Serc on a team. Leader? Killer? DR Manipulator? I don't know, but the way he has been spamming the thread and throwing up complete and utter bullshit all game long makes me want to vote for him. So I will.

Vote Serc

[Mockra]

Kaschan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

Interesting. Serc is claiming that he was the person attacked by killers at night, AND that he claims knows my DR. And he has been claiming that he is the Independent Priest all game long.

Does anyone honestly think the Priest, who is listed as 'fighting against zombies' would have this knowledge? I certainly don't. I don't think the zombies would either. Or any of the Independents. Which puts Serc on a team. Leader? Killer? DR Manipulator? I don't know, but the way he has been spamming the thread and throwing up complete and utter bullshit all game long makes me want to vote for him. So I will.

Vote Serc

Exactly. I asked what his motivation was behind speculating on your DR, and am yet to recieve any answer. It's not like he came up with any conclusions on what he thought it meant, he just put it out there for us to gawk at.

[Tellan]

Thyrllan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:47 AM, said:

Tellan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

Geez, I leave you guys alone for a night or so and....not too much happens - phew

There's plenty of players who have said extremely little (yeah yeah, including me). I don't necessarily disagree with going for the lowest posters, but I wouldn't go for THE lowest poster. I think the zombie people would put more effort into that. Yeah, I know it's not based on post deductions but gut instead, but I still think it's a reasonable assumption.

Anyone else noticed Meanas' annoying habit of just going through posts that have already been covered by others?

I disagree. I reckon one alt might be intentionally be left 'hibernating' - we actually don't lynch low posters all that often, we just talk about it a lot. It could be regarded as another route to keeping an alt safe. Of course, if Ampelas starts suddenly posting now, I'll regard that as suspicious too

Well, whatever. That's just as much using your own intuition as I am to reach my conclusions, rather than anything else. The only thing your theory has going for you over mine is that you at least can focus on one person - Ampelas - whereas I'm not sure which of the lowest posters I find most likely to be a zombie.

[Meanas]

Tellan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Been away most of the weekend and wanted to do a proper catch up. No point reading through and disagreeing with someone or finding something I want answered and not asking the question. I do apologise before doing the catch up.

Yeah, but it's not like that. Pretty much everything you mention has already been covered by someone in some fashion, if you read through properly. You just come across as a post-padder to me.

Maybe your thinking of someone else because if you look right back I was the one who started the train on Sorrit, and actually found Galain's antics weird. people must have thought similarly to me otherwise they wouldn't have voted. Not only that but I also had a few arguments day one. In fact other than these last few posts I cannot for the life of me remember something you have said that is brand new. Now the only reason for this is because there are so many alts in play I am forgetful of half of them and there is so many posts to catch up on and read through

[Tellan]

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

Tellan, on 30 April 2012 - 11:44 AM, said:

Meanas, on 30 April 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Been away most of the weekend and wanted to do a proper catch up. No point reading through and disagreeing with someone or finding something I want answered and not asking the question. I do apologise before doing the catch up.

Yeah, but it's not like that. Pretty much everything you mention has already been covered by someone in some fashion, if you read through properly. You just come across as a post-padder to me.

Maybe your thinking of someone else because if you look right back I was the one who started the train on Sorrit, and actually found Galain's antics weird. people must have thought similarly to me otherwise they wouldn't have voted. Not only that but I also had a few arguments day one. In fact other than these last few posts I cannot for the life of me remember something you have said that is brand new. Now the only reason for this is because there are so many alts in play I am forgetful of half of them and there is so many posts to catch up on and read through

Ah, so other people found you suspicious too? Thanks for confirming that. It's true I haven't said much, but at least I haven't been making out like I have been saying loads, as you have. You're just jamming up an already cluttered thread.

[Anomandaris]

OK, back and caught up. Serc seems to be dominating the thread with the promise of information, but as far as I can tell he has committed to absolutely nothing he has said being true. In all cases, it's "I'm guessing" or "It's possible that". Until he actually commits to one of his pronouncements actually being true, I'm inclined to ignore most of what he says. I think we should be particularly suspicious of his deductions about people's roles based on their responses to his fishing. This game has 30 players in, and yet he jumped on the first person who responded to what he said. When you fish for info, you've got to wait a while to let everyone see the lure before you reel it in. Otherwise you're far more likely to have just picked up a random player who is annoyed at your behaviour.

I understand and agree with a lot of the cries for a low post lynch. They're definitely a default fallback option. I was interested to read Liosan's post in which he suggested that actually the Zombies were not the best targets to go after. I have to say I strongly disagree with this. The more zombies there are, the more powerful they are. And the longer the game goes on, the more zombies there will be unless we take action now. If we can cut down the number of zombies to a more manageable level, we are also diminishing their recruitment pool (since they need to be able to match up with the DR of the other players).

Here is the post I was talking about:

Liosan, on 30 April 2012 - 08:59 AM, said:

Finally, a last thought to stack up all that I've had over the night. So VC's, people keep saying that zombies are scum kill them all. Looking back at the VCs, I get the impression that such sentiments are misleading (maybe not from human players).

Human factions have to be the last one standing to win. Therefore the most expedient path to victory is to target every human they can and hope to eliminate their rivals before the zombies consume them.

Zombies, on the other hand, benefit from the waiting game, especially if we are dealing with zombie bosses. Think about it. We lynch a zombie, so what? That's less chance they'll recruit/kill someone over night, but that doesn't mean they won't or their partner won't. It's like shooting zombies without a head shot. They'll keep coming, albeit slower. According to the VCs, zombies just need to get enough nights to probe every player still alive and either convert or kill them. The only reason I can think of to attack zombies is to hope that by lowering a zombie boss's vote count, it ups the chance that they will actually run into a DR-1 situation and lose one of their minions.

As for the independents, if we really want to eliminate someone other than human faction people, we need to get the voodoo priest. If he sticks around long enough, he wins. Another theory for DR = 0 is that a maim by the voodoo priest diminishes someone's DR. So Kasch could also be a BP who just lost his only night protection. The other independents are helpful (e.g. the priest) or annoying (e.g. the Lone Avenger who will just be hunting leaders with no other motivations).

So my conclusion is that we have it a little backwards. I mean, perhaps I've missed the point, and we are going for weakening the zombies enough so as to no longer have that threat when the human faction blood bath begins. But really, the longer we wait, the better odds there are for the zombies and the voodoo priest. Counterintuitive to the scum/town mindset, but this isn't a M&P game.

Remove Vote


Vote Serc

While it is true that the shortest path to victory for the Humans may be to eliminate the other Human factions, it is not something that anyone is going to be able to convince others to do on thread. On the other hand, all human factions have an interest in seeing the zombies destroyed. Since the zombies have a pretty large voting block, it would seem like the best course of action is to eliminate the zombies first, and then get down the business of eliminating each other afterwards.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 2. The clock has been frozen with 35 Hours and 59 Minutes remaining.

30 Players still alive: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Anthras, Atrahal, D'riss, Eloth, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Kalse, Karosis, Kaschan, Korbas, Korvalain, Liosan, Meanas, Mockra, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Serc, Shelthata Lore, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Thyrllan, Tulas Shorn

16 votes to lynch, 15 votes to go to night.

4 Votes for Ampelas ( Emurlahn, Rashan, Serc, Thyrllan )
1 Vote for Fener ( Olar Ethil )
1 Vote for Kalse ( Shelthata Lore )
1 Vote for Korbas ( Anomandaris )
3 Votes for Serc ( Liosan, Mockra, Kaschan )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Anthras, Atrahal, D'riss, Eloth, Fener, Galain, Kalse, Karosis, Korbas, Korvalain, Meanas, Omtose, Osseric, Ruse, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn