[Toc Anaster]

*Spoilers. I found myself really liking Beak as RG came along. He obviously revealed himself to be of high mage calibre, but how powerful was he in relation to other high mages (ie QB, Ceda, etc.)? I'm only 3/4 of the way through "Toll The Hounds" so I don't know if he comes back or what, doubtful since he was turned to ash and all, but I wonder if he could take out the other big boys with him if he fully unveiled his "candles" again?
'

This post has been edited by Toc Anaster: 07 March 2012 - 03:44 AM

[worry]

Please be mindful of thread title spoilers too, please, as they show up to anyone browsing even if they aren't entering the thread. For example "Important Beak question" woulda given less away. Yours isn't the worst ever by any means or anything, just a tiny bit on the wrong side of giving stuff away IMO.

To answer, though, I have a feeling that Beak could have hung with the (human) big boys power wise, but not strategy or speed wise given his natural demeanor. He seemingly had pure, unadulterated access to the Warrens, but I'd imagine he would be hesitant to use that kind of power in any head to head fight, whereas in the context of RG he was protecting people. But given a similar situation, he could give any of the folks you mentioned a run for their money, maybe even Tayschrenn too.

[Toc Anaster]

Thanks and sorry. New here. I think I fixed er.

 worrywort, on 07 March 2012 - 03:10 AM, said:

Please be mindful of thread title spoilers too, please, as they show up to anyone browsing even if they aren't entering the thread. For example "Important Beak question" woulda given less away. Yours isn't the worst ever by any means or anything, just a tiny bit on the wrong side of giving stuff away IMO.

To answer, though, I have a feeling that Beak could have hung with the (human) big boys power wise, but not strategy or speed wise given his natural demeanor. He seemingly had pure, unadulterated access to the Warrens, but I'd imagine he would be hesitant to use that kind of power in any head to head fight, whereas in the context of RG he was protecting people. But given a similar situation, he could give any of the folks you mentioned a run for their money, maybe even Tayschrenn too.

[Toc Anaster]

So if his melding of "candles" and the full unveiling of his power revealed itself as white/cleansing is that just the result of Beak's nature and warrens or is that always the result of mixing multiple warrens? Or was it revealed as such only as an anathema to chaos? I can think of people like QB using a couple in unison but I can't think of any precedent for the unveiling of that many warrens simultaneously in any of the books so far.

[worry]

I imagine it's unprecedented not just within the scope of the series, but in the scope of the world. Even Hood seemed to think it was special, and certainly that Beak was special, and Hood's been around a long long time. As far as whether you can attribute this particular manifestation to Beak or to the mixing of Warrens themselves, I'd personally go with uhhh...a mix of both? Beak's particular candle take on Warrens may have left his personal touch on the results, but you're right, since nobody else does it, it's hard to say. QB did use a bunch of his Warrens on Bauchelain, but not all at once (half and half, I think?).

[the broken]

It seems as though you can access a lot of power if you are willing to die doing it. I would guess that Beak is more powerful, but that Tayschrenn or QB would still win the fight because they are experienced combat mages who would warren somewhere else if his attack were too powerful and then come back to finish him off.

[tiam]

A couple of points

Beak is an idiot savant with warrens, natural talent that can access any warren including elder Warrens. Bottle even claims hes unsure if Beaks sacrifice was worth it, to have 800 marines instaed of a raw natural talent like Beak in the world. However in terms of power you hae to consider him strong but not as strong as others. His final unveiling was definitely a mix of warrens given the healing of the Malazans aswell as protecting the marines. However we see that Beak went beyond mortal means with his warrens and had done so for a while. He probably went further than QB did at the end of BH vs Icarium. Beaks POV shows that he had drawn on his warrens to long and would have probably died before his big finale had he had no need to go out that way.. Its seems likely it was his mastery of all warrens rather than his power (which was substantial) that was what made him so potent.

This post has been edited by Friendly Neighbourhood Spider-tiam: 08 March 2012 - 07:51 PM

[fafner]

long time since i read that book but it hurts beak the use of those warrens or was it only the burning up?

[Sinisdar Toste]

 fafner, on 08 March 2012 - 08:45 PM, said:

long time since i read that book but it hurts beak the use of those warrens or was it only the burning up?

Well beak was pained by his use of power becos he knows what happens when he lights all his candles, and he's afraid of what he can do then. But when he was burning himself up he was glad to do it because he was protecting his friends.

Edit: he's kind of like sinns polar opposite, cuz she knows what she can do and finds it thrilling

This post has been edited by Sinisdar Toste: 08 March 2012 - 10:10 PM

[fafner]

ah like i said was a long time ago. but i was thinking it was like Spindle he can use his magic but with a side effect

[Zenstrive]

Through Beak, it was revealed that in order to summon Father Light, you need to open all warrens and combine them.
He is The Captain Planet of this world.

Or so I imagine.

[HoosierDaddy]

 Zenstrive, on 15 March 2012 - 07:11 AM, said:

Through Beak, it was revealed that in order to summon Father Light, you need to open all warrens and combine them.
He is The Captain Planet of this world.

Or so I imagine.

Nah, Thyrllan, Liosan, etc. Light is its own thing. Father Light isn't an amalgamation of the other warrens gods. He's his own thing.

[Zenstrive]

Well, I am not talking about combination of other warrens gods, just combination of warren powers. Kurald Thyrllan is indeed its own thing, but has anyone seen Father Light? I guess we so far only see Osserc/Osric, the alleged Son of Father Light (who might be brothers to Andarist, Anomander Rake, Silchas Ruin, and Scanbadari).

[HoosierDaddy]

 Zenstrive, on 15 March 2012 - 08:19 AM, said:

Well, I am not talking about combination of other warrens gods, just combination of warren powers. Kurald Thyrllan is indeed its own thing, but has anyone seen Father Light? I guess we so far only see Osserc/Osric, the alleged Son of Father Light (who might be brothers to Andarist, Anomander Rake, Silchas Ruin, and Scanbadari).

Combining all the warrens doesn't make Thryllan or Liosan either. It's a reflection of Beak's "different colored candles" that we get the prismatic rainbow into regular white light effect.

Nobody has seen Father Light for a long, long time. But, nobody has seen Mother Dark in a long, long time either.

[Zenstrive]

btw, I was joking

[HoosierDaddy]

 Zenstrive, on 16 March 2012 - 08:33 AM, said:

btw, I was joking

Fair enough!

Emoticons are good for context!

[Abey1245]

Beak said at one point on Lether that if too many candles were lit that he could not put them out, and that it was "too late". I think he had a natural but untrained (and thus uncontrolled) use of the warrens, unlike QB who is able to limit which ones he uses & for how long. The white is I think simply the result of Beaks's own innate purity, as confirmed by Hood when the gate was glowing pure white for his arrival. As a high mage I don't think he would have been useful as a weapon, as he was the type to only use his powers to protect people, with the exception of his family when he was pushed to far with the suicide of his brother. It's like he has no "off" button.

[Watcherinthewater]

One can only speculate because you don't really see him using his warrens exstensively prior to RG but it seems like he was being more active than ever during that invasion. You see that he constantly surprises others with his depth of knowledge and mastery but at a certain point he just couldn't stop and his demise was inevitable. My quote fu is quite lacking at the moment since its been a couple of months since I last read RG. I am however pretty sure that he mentions in his internal commentary that he is using himself up but thats okay because his friends are worth dying for even before negates that massive magical attack. Where as say Bottle for example is able to constantly use his abilites and while severly weakening himself he can stop at anytime. Beak didnt really give that impression it was more like once he opened that floodgate his power and his life where going to run out. So really it was either die that day and save the lives of all the marines who he thinks of as his friends and family or he gets kept alive as a mediocre squad mage for another suicidal surge of power to be used up by tavore at later date. Personally am glad he went out the way he did.