[HoosierDaddy]

To be fair, Trump cannot abide any bad opinions of himself. It doesn't necessarily reflect guilt (but I think that's the case), but rather the fragile ego of a narcissist with a plethora of personality issues.

[QuickTidal]

HoosierDaddy, on 31 October 2017 - 03:37 PM, said:

To be fair, Trump cannot abide any bad opinions of himself. It doesn't necessarily reflect guilt (but I think that's the case), but rather the fragile ego of a narcissist with a plethora of personality issues.

This is true.

At any rate, insiders seem to indicate that the Manafort And Gates indictments didn't rile him (I think he was advised to EXPECT them)...but he apparently lost his shit when he learned of Papa's turning/confession...moreover that Mueller was able to keep the Papa sitch under "zero leak" wraps since he was arrested in July, and made his plea on Oct 5th...no one knew that was coming down the pipe. How that happens is impressive and shows how Mueller knows how to play this game WAY more than anyone in the administration.

It feels like we are watching history unfold. Are we? Is this what people felt like during Watergate?

[Mentalist]

The fact that we watched Trump get elected was where the whole "history is happening now" thing started.

[QuickTidal]

Oh, and apparently Papadopolous is being described as a "proactive cooperator"...which the lawyers say is lingo that sometimes means he "wore a wire"

Whoa.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 31 October 2017 - 04:32 PM

[Gorefest]

I'm not holding my breath. Nothing major will come out of this unless he loses broad support of the Republican majority in Congress. And if they haven't bailed by now with all the crap Trump has been pulling, I don't see them dropping him at this stage. So the most one can hope for is that he won't be in the running for reelection in 2020.

[QuickTidal]

Gorefest, on 31 October 2017 - 04:50 PM, said:

I'm not holding my breath. Nothing major will come out of this unless he loses broad support of the Republican majority in Congress. And if they haven't bailed by now with all the crap Trump has been pulling, I don't see them dropping him at this stage. So the most one can hope for is that he won't be in the running for reelection in 2020.

That's a relatively nihilistic POV, but I understand why you feel that way, for sure.

[Vengeance]

Gorefest, on 31 October 2017 - 04:50 PM, said:

I'm not holding my breath. Nothing major will come out of this unless he loses broad support of the Republican majority in Congress. And if they haven't bailed by now with all the crap Trump has been pulling, I don't see them dropping him at this stage. So the most one can hope for is that he won't be in the running for reelection in 2020.

Now that isn't strickly true. You can hope that Democrats are able to capitalize off of this and show up to the midterm polls next year and seize both chambers of congress. Then they could sanction him and start impeachment proceedings against him. The key to removing the administration would be to first remove Pence then to remove Trump.

[worry]

While I think this investigation is a vital process, and indictments deserve to be handed down as far up the chain as possible, I don't think Dems have a chance in the midterms if this is their focus. If they can integrate this into a platform of actual progressive interests, as like a cherry on top, that's another story. Tom Perez targeting the Bernie & Keith Ellison backers in the DNC doesn't bode well though.

That said, a lot could change in a year.

[worry]

On another note, TNC went off on the supposed "adult in the room" Gen. John Kelly's racist (yes, racist) assertion that the Civil War was a result of a "lack of ability to compromise". I don't think Vengeance's post was even in light of this, but what timing.

https://twitter.com/...289478943633408

It's no wonder w/ the DHS under his watch ICE and CBP unleashed the storm trooper mentality more than ever. Not a single one of these dudes disagrees w/ Trump on the substance, they just want to manage his "saying the quiet parts loud" tendencies.

[Tiste Simeon]

Here is an excellent and quite long thread of Tweets about some of the implications of the Mueller proceedings...

https://twitter.com/...988111880417280

[HoosierDaddy]

Terrorism sucks. Where there's a will there's a way and that is the stone cold sad truth.

[worry]

In the past, studies seemed to show that the subtleties of priming subconscious racial biases worked while more overt or explicitly bigoted rhetoric against African Americans was a political turnoff, a deal-breaker, had consequences. It appears that is no longer the case, at least at this point in time: overt 'derogation' of African Americans seems to have no effect on people's positions on policy.

https://twitter.com/...823676095848448


In other words, setting aside the small % of ideologically racist blocs who'd be happy to hear it anyway, the much larger blocs that at one point moderated their views in rejection of overtly bigoted policies no longer do so.

[amphibian]

A terrific article on gerrymandering and how exactly the Republicans broke the election system their way by subdividing groups (unethically and illegally) to better take advantage of their greater infrastructure and data collection for this: https://www.theatlan...ap-2020/543888/

This in part explains why the GOP has gone so right wing over the last 30 years - because their politics are increasingly detached from what the people actually want and their ability to micro-target messages convinces people to still vote for them.

[Vengeance]

This explains so much. Really it is a reflection on both obama and the DNC how poorly they fundraised between 2012 and 2016 to find themselves in that position.

https://www.politico...cks-2016-215774

[worry]

What if Mueller proves his case and it doesn’t matter?

https://www.vox.com/...pistemic-crisis

This is the worst case scenario, I suppose, but it's not an irrational fear. Article lays it out pretty plainly.

[QuickTidal]

worry, on 02 November 2017 - 09:10 PM, said:

What if Mueller proves his case and it doesn’t matter?

https://www.vox.com/...pistemic-crisis

This is the worst case scenario, I suppose, but it's not an irrational fear. Article lays it out pretty plainly.

Yeah this is one of my fears too. Because Trump was taught (by Roy Cohn) "You walk through the ranks of those wanting to arrest you for breaking the rules/laws, and talk your way out of it from the other side in a (more) powerful position." It's how he lives his life, and the GOP enables it to hold onto their own power.

I dunno what happens if this happens. You're right, it's worst case scenario....but we already had one of those last November...so it's not uncharted waters. I would hope your democracy means more to enough people...to not let it die.

[QuickTidal]

And here is a fairly illuminating timeline of Trumps contact with Russia going all the way back to the 1970's and up until now!

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 03 November 2017 - 01:41 PM

[Gorefest]

Where is the actual time line (or link to it) in that article? It just says "Review the timeline to see" and then nothing...

[QuickTidal]

Gorefest, on 03 November 2017 - 02:08 PM, said:

Where is the actual time line (or link to it) in that article? It just says "Review the timeline to see" and then nothing...

It loads up below the main paragraph...maybe it's having trouble loading up on your comp? It's a long scrolling timeline of links/articles....but I think it'f flashed or something, so perhaps the applet is't running on your device?

[QuickTidal]

....and sweet merciful hell...what is going on?!

https://thinkprogres...e-b2e65e7200e2/