[EmperorMagus]

http://abcnews.go.co...ory?id=47875090

This could be so awesome if it happens.

[Aptorian]

worry, on 07 June 2017 - 02:31 AM, said:

In the highly contested Georgia 6th district special election, the Republican actually nails the difference between "liberals" and "conservatives":

I wonder what her position would be on not paying politicians a livable wage. I mean, Liberals believe that governments spend too much money, right? Why not just pay her 5 dollars an hour?

It reminds me of one of the teachers from my highschool who argued the merits of paying politicians and various civil servants the median income of the countries citizens.

This post has been edited by Seduce Goose: 07 June 2017 - 08:27 AM

[QuickTidal]

This is interesting, and kind of speaks volumes.

Watching this was interesting. If I understand this correctly...Here we have two people who are SO very CLEARLY not saying something...because they are not willing to lie outright (probably because they know what's going to come out down the line o the investigation?) and as such have danced around the question instead.

Crazy.

And a follow-up WaPo article: https://www.washingt...8c1f06#comments

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 07 June 2017 - 05:35 PM

[QuickTidal]

And then there is this: https://twitter.com/...513981952425992

[Aptorian]

A lot of these quotes and "leaked" secret talks, like Trump asking Sessions for loyalty, aren't really the problem.

Trump, or any president for that matter, asking for loyalty (or demanding it) is not the problem. Any leader needs such a thing. The problem is what he does to try and get that loyalty and afterwards the lies he's told to cover up that behaviour.

Just like Clinton got impeached for his lies and attempts at covering up his lies, not his indiscretions, Trump should be impeached for how he's tried to subvert the systems in place and the lies that never stop flowing out of his administration.

[worry]

Start drawing your Trump as a big dumb Don Corleone political cartoons, if you wanna go viral tomorrow.

[QuickTidal]

Seduce Goose, on 07 June 2017 - 06:55 PM, said:

A lot of these quotes and "leaked" secret talks, like Trump asking Sessions for loyalty, aren't really the problem.

Trump, or any president for that matter, asking for loyalty (or demanding it) is not the problem. Any leader needs such a thing. The problem is what he does to try and get that loyalty and afterwards the lies he's told to cover up that behaviour.

Just like Clinton got impeached for his lies and attempts at covering up his lies, not his indiscretions, Trump should be impeached for how he's tried to subvert the systems in place and the lies that never stop flowing out of his administration.

Actually, I think it IS part of the problem that the very fact that these behind-closed-doors meetings even took place between a sitting president, and the director of the FBI in which Trump leaned on him in any way, even mildly. From what I understand, part of the issue is that it's grossly improper for the President to demand loyalty from an FBI director in such a way.

It sounds like Comey was even AWARE of how weird this all was and decided to take notes (something he says he would not have done with someone else) to make sure he recorded it accurately.

Now, I don't think that Comey's testimony tomorrow is goring to produce any kind of "Aha!" snap resolution to the whole thing...but these varied pieces of the pie are going to very much be a significant part of the investigation and their results.

[Aptorian]

Trumps behavior is weird, but I don't think his handling of Comey or Sessions are ones of direct malice or corruption. Rather they are the actions of a buffoon, who doesn't know anything about governments or the legislative system.

America has elected "an ordinary citizen" to the government, something everyone once in a while imagines would be great because he wouldn't be like those dirty politicians. Unfortunately that means you have a selfish, spoiled, ignorant billionaire sitting in the White House. A person who knows nothing about how to lead a country, nor how a government works. Why shouldn't he just make demands of the FBI Director and fire him? He's the CEO of America, Trump is used to just hiring and firing people. That's the only thing he understands.

Just listen to Trumps comments on the Paris Climate agreement. He's clearly not been briefed properly, probably didn't really care, doesn't understand what "a climate" is and just makes shit up on the fly.

The guy has been floundering since he was sworn in.

[worry]

I think what QT is getting at is obstruction of justice is against the law even if you do it because you're stupid.

[worry]

This is an about-face from the Trump talk, but a good reflection on the recent reevaluation of the Clintons (among others) benefiting from slavery while Bill was governor of Arkansas (several states follow this tradition to this day): https://www.currenta...tons-had-slaves

[Tapper]

worry, on 07 June 2017 - 09:52 PM, said:

I think what QT is getting at is obstruction of justice is against the law even if you do it because you're stupid.

Politico says (http://www.politico....15236?lo=ap_b2_) that the way the memo is phrased, this will not be obstruction of justice - which the Guardian more or less confirms in expert interviews.

As a result, it might be that the Democrats and the anonymous intelligence officers (plus James Clapper, with his 'bigger than Watergate' comment) have actually shot themselves in the foot by playing up the 'this is abuse of power' angle.
Unless Comey has a lot more to reveal (plausible, but why would he not record that information if he did write this memo?), it might just only have an impact as one of the many straws that can perhaps break this camel's back with the Mueller investigation, which is probably going to be a lengthy affair.
It seems the best outcome from this interview would be if Trump tweets diametrically opposing statements to what Comey reveals, prompting the Donald to be heard by the committee under oath.

[Silencer]

Tapper, on 08 June 2017 - 07:44 AM, said:

worry, on 07 June 2017 - 09:52 PM, said:

I think what QT is getting at is obstruction of justice is against the law even if you do it because you're stupid.

Politico says (http://www.politico....15236?lo=ap_b2_) that the way the memo is phrased, this will not be obstruction of justice - which the Guardian more or less confirms in expert interviews.

As a result, it might be that the Democrats and the anonymous intelligence officers (plus James Clapper, with his 'bigger than Watergate' comment) have actually shot themselves in the foot by playing up the 'this is abuse of power' angle.
Unless Comey has a lot more to reveal (plausible, but why would he not record that information if he did write this memo?), it might just only have an impact as one of the many straws that can perhaps break this camel's back with the Mueller investigation, which is probably going to be a lengthy affair.
It seems the best outcome from this interview would be if Trump tweets diametrically opposing statements to what Comey reveals, prompting the Donald to be heard by the committee under oath.

Which I'm not sure would matter much anyway. Trump isn't the kind of person to let a little thing like being under oath change his story, so without substantive evidence that his statements under oath were lies, it makes little difference.

[QuickTidal]

Silencer, on 08 June 2017 - 11:33 AM, said:

Which I'm not sure would matter much anyway. Trump isn't the kind of person to let a little thing like being under oath change his story, so without substantive evidence that his statements under oath were lies, it makes little difference.

Actually, from what I've read, the "burden of proof" shifts to Trump in the situation of He Said, He Said and Trump has to offer up proof that he DIDN'T say what Comey is saying he said or did...which means ponying up the "tapes" the WH might have of the convos...which would (almost certainly) prove Comey right, so Trump would not do that. How else can he prove Comey's account is inaccurate? He can't.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 08 June 2017 - 12:38 PM

[Vengeance]

Seduce Goose, on 07 June 2017 - 06:55 PM, said:

A lot of these quotes and "leaked" secret talks, like Trump asking Sessions for loyalty, aren't really the problem.

Trump, or any president for that matter, asking for loyalty (or demanding it) is not the problem. Any leader needs such a thing. The problem is what he does to try and get that loyalty and afterwards the lies he's told to cover up that behaviour.

Just like Clinton got impeached for his lies and attempts at covering up his lies, not his indiscretions, Trump should be impeached for how he's tried to subvert the systems in place and the lies that never stop flowing out of his administration.

Actually Trump asking for personal loyalty is a problem. The head of the FBI is nominated by the President but approved by the senate and swears an oath to the Constitution. That is the only loyalty that the head of the FBI or any other government official should have. There for the President asking for personal loyalty is a violation of the constitution especially if the presidents inner circle is being investigated.

I fully expect for Congress to start issuing subpoenas to compel the head of the National intelligence to reveal what may or may not be said to them. I thought that King was going to start spitting he was so mad that they wouldn't answer. Comey's memos are considered impeccable evidence. There have been numerous court cases verifying that FBI memory memos are evidence and not hearsay. For trump to prove that it didn't go down as Comeys says that it he would have to have audio recordings. I want this this to drag out as long as possible and to tie as many of Trumps appointes into this mess as possible. Especially that miserable snake Pence. That fucker shouldn't be president if Trump resigns or is impeached and thrown in jail.

[HoosierDaddy]

Nah, it takes a lot more than a he said/ he said conversation to do anything worthwhile.

[Vengeance]

HoosierDaddy, on 08 June 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

Nah, it takes a lot more than a he said/ he said conversation to do anything worthwhile.

All it has to do is completely drown his presidency until 2018 and we can run against an unpopular and corrupt president. Take back the house and senate. The more unpopular he becomes the less congress will care about what he wants to do and then most likely nothing will get done.

[HoosierDaddy]

Vengeance, on 08 June 2017 - 01:29 PM, said:

HoosierDaddy, on 08 June 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

Nah, it takes a lot more than a he said/ he said conversation to do anything worthwhile.

All it has to do is completely drown his presidency until 2018 and we can run against an unpopular and corrupt president. Take back the house and senate. The more unpopular he becomes the less congress will care about what he wants to do and then most likely nothing will get done.

He is unpopular with the populace at base, Not with his base. And, midterms are shitty for getting anyone to vote in them that aren't regular voters. And, his supporters will be and Dems won't be.

[Vengeance]

HoosierDaddy, on 08 June 2017 - 01:34 PM, said:

Vengeance, on 08 June 2017 - 01:29 PM, said:

HoosierDaddy, on 08 June 2017 - 01:21 PM, said:

Nah, it takes a lot more than a he said/ he said conversation to do anything worthwhile.

All it has to do is completely drown his presidency until 2018 and we can run against an unpopular and corrupt president. Take back the house and senate. The more unpopular he becomes the less congress will care about what he wants to do and then most likely nothing will get done.

He is unpopular with the populace at base, Not with his base. And, midterms are shitty for getting anyone to vote in them that aren't regular voters. And, his supporters will be and Dems won't be.

I disagree on his supporters voting during the midterms.

Presidential 1st term midterms are notorious for voting in the opposition party into congress. His base is becoming smaller and smaller every day.

[QuickTidal]

Vengeance, on 08 June 2017 - 01:55 PM, said:

I disagree on his supporters voting during the midterms.

Presidential 1st term midterms are notorious for voting in the opposition party into congress. His base is becoming smaller and smaller every day.

^^This. From what I've gleaned there are a lot of regretful people who voted for him.

His vociferous base (the stupid ass ones who just will never see things any other way) may remain, but all the outliers that voted for him for other reasons...have dropped off, regretful that he's turned out to be as much of a train wreck as advertised.

[HoosierDaddy]

I'd be delightfully surprised. Yes, midterms are rough for an sitting president, but you neglect to realize that the voting districts are so very gerrymandered that even if only 30% of his base comes out, the House remains Republican. Senate might be a better chance.

Anyways, lets hope Comey hangs him out to dry.