[Varan]

Spoiler






Spoiler



















Spoiler - final warning!!



















So at the end tay replaces k'rul?

He goes into a tunnel in kruls temple then meets kruppe at the place where k'rul normally meets him, and kruppe asks what happens of the other? and the new name t'renn..

Am i reading this right? or have i got the wrong end of the stick

[Use Of Weapons]

Until we see more, I remain to be convinced. K'Rul has met a lot of people via Kruppe's dream, and like someone in the other thread, I think Kruppe was referring to Tayschrenn's innocent self when he said 'the other'.

[Harvester]

I thought it wasn't possible to ascend to elder godhood. Maybe it is, but ICE really needs to start explaining things in his novels. IT FRUSTRATES THE HELL OUT OF ME.

Yes, caps lock rage.

This post has been edited by Harvester: 29 January 2012 - 01:54 PM

[polishgenius]

Harvester, on 29 January 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

I thought it wasn't possible to ascend to elder godhood.

Maybe not specifically to ascend to elderhood, but Paran has effectively taken over the Errant's role, and we're told the Qeen of Dreams took over from Ardata too.

[tiam]

polishgenius, on 29 January 2012 - 03:25 PM, said:

Harvester, on 29 January 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

I thought it wasn't possible to ascend to elder godhood.

Maybe not specifically to ascend to elderhood, but Paran has effectively taken over the Errant's role, and we're told the Qeen of Dreams took over from Ardata too.

Yes we see that Elder Gods arent really a thing at all. Ardata isnt that old to be called Elder in the same way as Mael say. Hood could have become and EG. So I think EG should simply considered how they accept worship. EG simply use the elder method of blood worship maybe?

Im too hungover to put that down properly

[Silk]

a bit confused how it could possibly be in reference to his otherself ....... especially after explaining how T'riss took over from Ardata, which would make the whole meeting and getting approval from Drek for the 'upgrade' meaningful otherwise there was no point in even mentioning it. If Ardata is an elder god, as has been said in past books with Mael, then it must be possible to ascend to the elder god route.... or even to just replace the elder force.

This post has been edited by Silk: 29 January 2012 - 03:57 PM

[Use Of Weapons]

It's just how I read it, is all. It's possible that what was holding him back from ascending previously was that element of innocence that he got from his sojourn at the shores of creation. We don't really have enough info to say for definite as yet, I think.

[fidge]

I thought the end of the novel took us to the end of The Crippled God. The way the scene with K'rul is descriped I thought Tayschrenn replaces the Crippled God in the House of Chains as the king seat is empty.

[polishgenius]

tiam, on 29 January 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

Yes we see that Elder Gods arent really a thing at all. Ardata isnt that old to be called Elder in the same way as Mael say. Hood could have become and EG. So I think EG should simply considered how they accept worship. EG simply use the elder method of blood worship maybe?

Are EG's gods that came to be before the creation of the Warrens, perhaps? Which would make K'Rul, as the maker of the Warrens, the ender of that era.
It also makes me wonder, now I think about it, whether there was someone before K'Rul who fulfilled a similar function for the Holds as K'Rul does for the Warrens.

[Harvester]

Yes, kind of.

Quote

Udinaas on The Realm Forgers (MT, p.31, UK Trade):



'Udinaas, like all Letherii, knew the sequences and the forms. First would come the three Fulcra known as the Realm Forgers. Fire, the silent scream of light, the very swirl of the stars themselves. Then Dolmen, bleak and rootless, drifting aimless in the void. And into the path of these two forces, the Errant. Bearer of its own unknowable laws, it would draw Fire and Dolmen into fierce wars. Vast fields of destructions, instance upon instance of mutual annihilation. But occasionally, rarely, there would be peace made between the two contestants. And Fire would bathe but not burn, and Dolmen would surrender its wandering ways, and so find root.

The Errant would then weave its mysterious skein, forging the Holds themselves. Ice. Eleint. Azath. Beast. And into their midst would emerge the remaining Fulcra. Axe, Knuckles, Blade, the Pack, Shapefinder and White Crow.'

[Use Of Weapons]

I wonder if, given the Errant's presence in Lether for so long, he might not have manipulated Letherii mythology to increase his own prominence. It would suit his personality and self-inflated importance, IMO

[amphibian]

fidge, on 29 January 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

I thought the end of the novel took us to the end of The Crippled God. The way the scene with K'rul is descriped I thought Tayschrenn replaces the Crippled God in the House of Chains as the king seat is empty.

Skinner is the King in Chains.

The Crippled God wasn't ever a member of the actual House.

[Harvester]

UseOfWeapons, on 29 January 2012 - 10:09 PM, said:

I wonder if, given the Errant's presence in Lether for so long, he might not have manipulated Letherii mythology to increase his own prominence. It would suit his personality and self-inflated importance, IMO

Could be, but we have nothing else to work with.

[Paran]

I got the impression he has taken on Krul's role as Maker of Paths as his appearance was similar to Krul's in GotM. But then again, it's left quite obtusely.

[tiam]

Paran, on 30 January 2012 - 09:36 AM, said:

I got the impression he has taken on Krul's role as Maker of Paths as his appearance was similar to Krul's in GotM. But then again, it's left quite obtusely.

It is. Its very similar, to my mind atleast, of Icariums making of the new warrens. We just got 'if Krul can do it why cant I' then a bright light.

[jammerculture]

Deck of dragons.

The card that previously referred to K'rul, now refers to Tay. Think of it as Tay taking Krul's job now that Krul wants to retire and explore his new body

[The Darklord]

OST takes place more or less simultaneously with the DoD/tCG storyline so i still think the kruppe - Tay dialogue refers to something with Kaminsod

[Lady Bliss]

I was pretty thrown by the K'rul as a woman spin, unless he was so broken that he had lost his man parts. Tay may have replaced K'rul, but not as an EG. It would seem like a backwards move to require blood magic like the EGs do, and I can't see that from Tay.

[Ben Delat]

Just finished reading it, the only two conclusions I thought were possible with that closing line were...

Tay is replacing D'rek.....I think we all assumed she didnt die from the OD in tCG but maybe she did and that was the bargain they came to....

Tay replacing K'rul.....seems unlikely, but in this world anything is possible, it would be a bigger role than becoming an elder god IMO because the warrens are your lifeblood as K'rul so I would assume this burden would need to be....assumed. But it is possible.

I mean it could be he ascended and picked a name similer to D'rek since is was a demi-d at one point, hopefully the real answer isnt that bland tho

edit: also, when Kruppe says "and the other" he is referring to whoever Tay is replacing, I'm almost positive about that part.

This post has been edited by Ben Delat: 08 February 2012 - 04:19 AM

[Tattersail_]

Paran, on 30 January 2012 - 09:36 AM, said:

I got the impression he has taken on Krul's role as Maker of Paths as his appearance was similar to Krul's in GotM. But then again, it's left quite obtusely.

I agree. He has taken a name like and I thought he had replaced K'rul.


Either way look at the name he takes, T'renn.



K'rul, D'rek, D'riss, T'riss,