[Thyrllan]

I'm just reading up a bit so I won't have to do as much tomorrow, but only going to be on for 15-20 min here

[Thyrllan]

Atrahal, on 30 November 2011 - 01:02 AM, said:

Ah shit... Sorry guys, I hoped we had pinned down scum on day 1 (eternally optimistic ).

By the way, little late in response to this:

Rashan, on 29 November 2011 - 11:39 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 29 November 2011 - 10:56 AM, said:

No one has commented yet on PS's mid-day storyline. I was wondering if we have to work with a communicating network of scum (since it talks about Hojo sending out messages). Does anyone think that Hojo is a hidden identity running the show with anonymous messages? I was just remembering that final game of Ro3K where we had the anonymous messaging directing fellow faction members (and yes, I know this is a town vs scum game, so don't give me shit about bringing up factions).

If they can talk, it is killer to killer, as usual. P-S mentioned that this wouldn't be TMDI Skyhigh and communications are really tough to deal with in balance. To me, a killer pair consisting of Hojo and maybe the Ise guy also somehow in there (he was mentioned as a schemer and opposed to Ashikaga Minamoto in the inn-scene in the OP - Ise was another province close to Hojo lands, iirc, so he's perhaps a bit more also than a blank role).

Quote

And it seems like town may have a new role with the introduction of Masamoto.

Ehm, why would a role be introduced halfway day 1? Once again, Ashikaga Masamoto has been mentioned several times already and is likely our main man concerning actions, hence the emphasis being placed on him in stories. If you see the 'send more men!' plea he does to the shogun as an action, well, perhaps it is an indication that he can promote RIs to more effective roles (aka he's a Teacher).

Anyhow, back to my meeting.

Hate to say it Rashan, but Hojo and Ise are the same person according to wikipedia:

"Hōjō Sōun (北条 早雲^?, 1432 – September 8, 1519) was the first head of the Late Hōjō clan, one of the major powers in Japan'sSengoku period. Born Ise Moritoki, he was originally known as Ise Shinkurō, a samurai of Taira lineage from a reputable family of Shogunate officials. Although he only belonged to a side branch of the main, more prestigious Ise family, he fought his way up, gaining territory and changing his name in imitation of the illustrious Hōjō."

And I see we have already discussed the potential for RI's to gain roles.

So if he is "first head of the Late Hojo clan" is he probably the "top" scum then?

[Thyrllan]

Uh, yeah, that's all I've got atm...

I'm willing to give Meanas another day to get his act together before we low-post lynch him though, it's only early day 2 after all! Maybe he got mauled by a bobcat on his way to mafia yesterday!

[Emurlahn]

I'm sure the afterlife has computers.

[Path-Shaper]

Thyrllan, on 30 November 2011 - 04:46 AM, said:

Uh, yeah, that's all I've got atm...

I'm willing to give Meanas another day to get his act together before we low-post lynch him though, it's only early day 2 after all! Maybe he got mauled by a bobcat tanuki on his way to mafia yesterday!

Fixed.

[Mockra]

Is it me or are there a bunch of long quote blocks with no commentary after them on this page? It's such a tease.

Hood, on 30 November 2011 - 02:03 AM, said:

as you can see there was a almost a hour between there cases more then enough time for them to conlude and then mess up as to why the would go after the same person well that would have to be a mess up wouldn't it no right minded scum would both go after the same target unless they messed up
tennes the fact that people thought that I was kesso's symp speaks not to my symp hood but to their own lack of ability
mockra the only reason that scum would make the same case on a person is that they messed up it has happened before there for it is possible.
galain what else could you possibly say that you were in fact scum and that atrahal was your partner and that you had thought that you were suppose to make the case while atrahal thought that he was suppose to make the case you two still look scummy and much to chummy for my tastes
still getting caught up

I don't see how that lines up with your original story on this whole thing:

Hood, on 29 November 2011 - 03:02 AM, said:

So after going over the thread. Abit not with a fine tooth comb. But still I did read most everything. To my eyes this two posts are the most suspicious all game. When I see something like two people who just happen to make cases on the same person and post them a little while after each other. It seems to me that it smacks of people who can talk off thread agreeing that they need to go after ________ then both of them going after that same person at the same time. Of course they will say that Kesso was scummy enough to trip both of their radar at the same time. But none the less posting cases like this trips my radar.

Emphasis mine. So you're saying that from this first post you actually meant that they were two killers who got confused about who was supposed to make the case on Kesso? I guess you could interpret it that way but it reads to me like you suggested they were coordinating their attacks on purpose, not by mistake. And yeah, that is a ridiculous position because scum would probably not do that, but it just sounds to me like you made a shitty case and are trying to salvage it by changing the angle.

[Mockra]

Path-Shaper, on 30 November 2011 - 05:08 AM, said:

Thyrllan, on 30 November 2011 - 04:46 AM, said:

Uh, yeah, that's all I've got atm...

I'm willing to give Meanas another day to get his act together before we low-post lynch him though, it's only early day 2 after all! Maybe he got mauled by a bobcat tanuki on his way to mafia yesterday!

Fixed.

Out of curiosity, what's the modkill timer? It's been at least 36 hours since we've seen him. Maybe if we say his name he'll magically appear?

....Meanas?

[Tennes]

Mockra, on 30 November 2011 - 06:09 AM, said:

Is it me or are there a bunch of long quote blocks with no commentary after them on this page? It's such a tease.

Hood, on 30 November 2011 - 02:03 AM, said:

as you can see there was a almost a hour between there cases more then enough time for them to conlude and then mess up as to why the would go after the same person well that would have to be a mess up wouldn't it no right minded scum would both go after the same target unless they messed up
tennes the fact that people thought that I was kesso's symp speaks not to my symp hood but to their own lack of ability
mockra the only reason that scum would make the same case on a person is that they messed up it has happened before there for it is possible.
galain what else could you possibly say that you were in fact scum and that atrahal was your partner and that you had thought that you were suppose to make the case while atrahal thought that he was suppose to make the case you two still look scummy and much to chummy for my tastes
still getting caught up

I don't see how that lines up with your original story on this whole thing:

Hood, on 29 November 2011 - 03:02 AM, said:

So after going over the thread. Abit not with a fine tooth comb. But still I did read most everything. To my eyes this two posts are the most suspicious all game. When I see something like two people who just happen to make cases on the same person and post them a little while after each other. It seems to me that it smacks of people who can talk off thread agreeing that they need to go after ________ then both of them going after that same person at the same time. Of course they will say that Kesso was scummy enough to trip both of their radar at the same time. But none the less posting cases like this trips my radar.

Emphasis mine. So you're saying that from this first post you actually meant that they were two killers who got confused about who was supposed to make the case on Kesso? I guess you could interpret it that way but it reads to me like you suggested they were coordinating their attacks on purpose, not by mistake. And yeah, that is a ridiculous position because scum would probably not do that, but it just sounds to me like you made a shitty case and are trying to salvage it by changing the angle.

I was just baout to point this out.

contradictory statements are contradictory

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 2, 21 hours and 22 minutes are left.

15 players alive: Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Galain, Gamelon, Hood's Path, Meanas, Mockra, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Spite, Tennes, Thryllan

8 votes to lynch

1 vote Thyrllan: Spite
2 votes Meanas: Galain, Emurlahn


Players not voting: Anomandaris, Atrahal, Gamelon, Hood's Path, Meanas, Mockra, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Tennes, Thryllan

[Path-Shaper]

The gates of Odawara castle stood open, and traffic flowed freely between the grounds of the keep and the villages beyond. The guards were typically vigilant, watching for any signs of a disturbance in which they would be only too happy to intervene. It had been a quiet day so far however, and the noon day sun stood partially obscured by haze - a midday sight common this close to the ocean. In a few weeks everything would turn to muck as the rainy season was approaching. The people would then settle into a new routine for the new season. Farmers would be more diligent in monitoring the irrigation of their crops, and commerce would slow somewhat. Mud-caked clogs would soon be everywhere, something no one looked forward to, especially the porters who would be more bogged down than most under their heavy burdons.
Rumor had it that the lord of the castle was taking extra precautions against potential insurrections, but if this were true it didn't appear to be reflected in the disposition of the castles samurai. And what sort of insurrection, and by whom no one seemed to have any knowledge. As went a phrase popular with the locals, it was all just "farts on the wind".

Everywhere you looked it was business as usual.

This post has been edited by Path-Shaper: 30 November 2011 - 07:37 AM

[Mockra]

Ruse, on 30 November 2011 - 04:06 AM, said:

I'm all aloooooone. I think I have the worst timezone ever.

Ruse, instead of whining, maybe you should use your time to give your thoughts again? Except this time don't make a post right after saying, "Oops, got my facts wrong, guess that was all bullshit..." You're pretty much back where you were before Galain and whoever called you out, since you blatantly dismissed everything you said. So...try again?

[Meanas]

Dammit, I knew I would forget I was playing. Sorry guys, I'm pretty useless. Let me try to catch up fast.

[Meanas]

Tiamatha, on 28 November 2011 - 08:44 AM, said:

Meanas are you a little confused who the good guys are and who the bad guys are? Did you read the OP?

Quote

This is a town vs. killer(s) game. Town is the Ashikaga and their vassals. Scum are the Hojo clan attempting to gain power and influence

Quote

loyal to the Ashikaga shogunate.
You are RI.

If you are saying we should all be Shoguns then your wrong about that. There is only one Shogun, he rules absolute.


That does bring up the question what are we to be called? Fellow clan members? Samurai? Soldiers?

"Shogunate - a form of government in which the ruler is an absolute dictator (not restricted by a constitution or laws or opposition etc.)"

"Shogun - The hereditary commander of the Japanese army who until 1867 exercised absolute rule under the nominal leadership of the emperor."

I don't know shit about Japanese. I just figured that the "town" were all Shogun since we're a part of the "Shogunate". Whatever.

[Meanas]

Atrahal, on 29 November 2011 - 12:20 AM, said:

I personally don't like all of the vote jumping this first day. I'm good with the initial joke votes (despite creating a haven for signaling), but just voting when someone tickles the other's fancy: counter-productive. Right now, Kesso is catching my attention with posts like this:

Quote

precisely. when skimming the thread to try to locate a relevant point, we rely on the avatars to easily identify the poster. it is an incredibly useful shortcut that allows us to focus on analyzing a point, and constructing elaborate case around it. it's much harder to do so, when the you go though a 20-post conversation, between players with the identicad "dark, with a spot of colour in the laft portion" avatars. Made me spend my limited attention onfiguring out who made what point, making us read the poster's name, as well as looking at the avatar... well, oyu get the picture.

He tends to start with the promise of insight but ends up getting sidetracked by distractions such the similar avatars of Rashan and Mockra, or Spite's penchant to vote like a bored inno with nothing to lose. He's very involved, but not altogether that helpful. Even the couple of summaries help more than him....

I would like to point out that Emur called him out, asking him what HE thought, to which Kesso hemmed and hawed (such as with the quote above). Who are you planning to vote for Kesso. I see you haven't put one down yet (not that it seems to mean much in this game )

Vote Kessobahn

I'm skimming but that is a lot of random voting. Point to Atrahal.

[Anomandaris]

Osseric, on 30 November 2011 - 02:16 AM, said:

So Anomandaris has eight posts, seven of which are one line long and go along the lines of: "I need coffee"; "Haha at that thing nothing to do with the game", etc. Below is his one post of note, his reasoning for a Kessobahn vote.

Anomandaris, on 29 November 2011 - 08:22 AM, said:

well a lo of two and fro on day 1. Interesting that people say i was interacting with galain and rashan when someone voted for me and another voted for them and I hadnt nor did post since. Early cases are always hard to fathom, and day 1 when people havent really started make that more so.

The triple vote was very strange, people seem to forget that no matter if you are town or scum you should always try at least to look inno. Strange voting behaviour never looks like an inno tactic.

3 vote Thyrllan: Emurlahn, Mockra, Kessobahn

3 votes Kesso: Thryllan, Atrahal, Galain

1 vote Atrahal: Hood's Path

This voting also looks highly suspect given that three people are voting for kesso and both mockra and kesso come on to vote thyrllan while hp comes on and builds against atrahal with a case built on more than one player voting for another player within a certain time frame. Though i dont find thyrllan or kesso especially suspicious by their content the division of votes at what is generally a turning point phase of the day makes me think there is something in this.

vote kessobahn

The atrahal and thyrllan votes feel more like a way to counteract this train than an actual case built upon suspicious activity.

Ano's reasoning is essentially that he thinks there's something in the fact that the votes between Kesso and Thyr were being evenly split at that point.

It seems like there is quite detailed reasoning here but actually there isn't. He simply says that the votes on Atrahal and Thyrllan look like attempts to derail a Kessobahn lynch. Why though? He doesn't say. Saying why this was so would be actual reasoning for voting Kessobahn.

Anomandaris arrives, slap bang in the middle of the lynch train, having made what at first glace looks like a reasoned vote, and then disappears to post one-liners again. In other words, a non-contributor who steps up only to hammer a nail into an inno's coffin.

Omtose, on 29 November 2011 - 06:23 PM, said:

Also, after the swing, the Anno and Ruse votes look the most shady to my eyes. It definately swung to Kesso quickly. Hard to believe that it was all innos on the train after it was 3 vs. 3.

I agree, Anomandaris and Ruse votes seem the most suspicious to me also. Anomandaris' vote is the one where the train gathered unstoppable momentum.

What a strange post. My reasoning is perfectly well explained, so firstly you dont need to summarise it in your opening line then contradict yourself by claiming there isnt any later on. Also meta reasoning based on peoples posting times in relation to the game isnt a valid or legal argument so my timing which you will find is always the same is irrelevant. When i came on it was 3v3 and i used the voting to decide which player i voted for based on three votes being placed on two players who were both voting against one other player. Why would i ignore what was happening on thread at the time?

[Meanas]

Path-Shaper, on 29 November 2011 - 03:01 PM, said:

It is Day 1.

17 players alive: Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Galain, Gamelon, Hood's Path, Kessobahn, Meanas, Mockra, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Spite, Tennes, Thryllan, Tiamatha

9 votes to lynch, 9 to go to night.

1 vote Rashan: Spite
2 votes Thyrllan: Mockra, Kessobahn
1 vote Mockra: Osseric
8 votes Kesso: Thryllan, Atrahal, Galain, Anomandaris, Tennes, Tiamatha, Ruse, Gamelon, Emurlahn
1 vote Atrahal: Hood's Path



17 Players still alive,

Players not voting
Meanas, Omtose,Rashan
------------------------
Masamoto crumpled the last paper and threw it into the brazier. Nothing. No help. The smaller lords claimed allegiance but either they knew nothing, or were deliberately working against him. He wondered if the bad news would even register with the Shogun while he prepared for his latest role in a Noh play. Perhaps he should…keep the development under wraps for the moment so everything would appear stable. At the very least, the subjects appeared forthcoming which was better than Masamoto had expected after hearing the rumors in Kyoto of the silly arrogance of provincial lords. However, the situation of power balance appeared to be as tenuous as he had been led to believe. Hojo said all the right words, but Masamoto couldn’t help but wonder if his authority had been undermined before he even arrived from Kyoto.

-----------------------
Uji the innkeeper watched as they hammered the hand-inked notice below the head of Morizono Kuniyoshi. He couldn’t read the notice himself, but he heard people muttering it quietly, so the dead man’s spirit wouldn’t overhear them and switch his soul with theirs. “I wonder who he upset so much that they had to do that.” He wondered. Shaking his head sadly he continued walking on to the small patch of vegetables he kept on the edge of the village to pick some gobo. He smiled as he considered how much his guests were going to like his freshly made kinpira for their suppers.

Kessobahn (Mentalist) is dead. He was Morizono Kuniyoshi, Loyal to the Shogunate.



Night resolution coming.

How does Mentalist manage to either die first or die last?

[Meanas]

Tiamatha, on 28 November 2011 - 05:04 PM, said:

Tennes, on 28 November 2011 - 04:42 PM, said:

just got back from a long pointless seminar....

Quite knackered, wont be of much use till i get some food and sleep.


consider this my obligatory "check in" so you know i know the game is running

Pre empting you're going to be away from the thread for a while, low lying scum maybe. If that's how you want to play it then fine


Vote Tennes


I'm agreeable with contribution.


I'm busy with school too at the moment, especially with some exams coming up, but there is always time for Mafia

Quoted for interesting but then he died.

[Meanas]

Mockra, on 30 November 2011 - 06:12 AM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 30 November 2011 - 05:08 AM, said:

Thyrllan, on 30 November 2011 - 04:46 AM, said:

Uh, yeah, that's all I've got atm...

I'm willing to give Meanas another day to get his act together before we low-post lynch him though, it's only early day 2 after all! Maybe he got mauled by a bobcat tanuki on his way to mafia yesterday!

Fixed.

Out of curiosity, what's the modkill timer? It's been at least 36 hours since we've seen him. Maybe if we say his name he'll magically appear?

....Meanas?

[Osseric]

Mockra, on 30 November 2011 - 06:09 AM, said:

Is it me or are there a bunch of long quote blocks with no commentary after them on this page? It's such a tease.

Hood, on 30 November 2011 - 02:03 AM, said:

as you can see there was a almost a hour between there cases more then enough time for them to conlude and then mess up as to why the would go after the same person well that would have to be a mess up wouldn't it no right minded scum would both go after the same target unless they messed up
tennes the fact that people thought that I was kesso's symp speaks not to my symp hood but to their own lack of ability
mockra the only reason that scum would make the same case on a person is that they messed up it has happened before there for it is possible.
galain what else could you possibly say that you were in fact scum and that atrahal was your partner and that you had thought that you were suppose to make the case while atrahal thought that he was suppose to make the case you two still look scummy and much to chummy for my tastes
still getting caught up

I don't see how that lines up with your original story on this whole thing:

Hood, on 29 November 2011 - 03:02 AM, said:

So after going over the thread. Abit not with a fine tooth comb. But still I did read most everything. To my eyes this two posts are the most suspicious all game. When I see something like two people who just happen to make cases on the same person and post them a little while after each other. It seems to me that it smacks of people who can talk off thread agreeing that they need to go after ________ then both of them going after that same person at the same time. Of course they will say that Kesso was scummy enough to trip both of their radar at the same time. But none the less posting cases like this trips my radar.

Emphasis mine. So you're saying that from this first post you actually meant that they were two killers who got confused about who was supposed to make the case on Kesso? I guess you could interpret it that way but it reads to me like you suggested they were coordinating their attacks on purpose, not by mistake. And yeah, that is a ridiculous position because scum would probably not do that, but it just sounds to me like you made a shitty case and are trying to salvage it by changing the angle.

I'm looking hard, but I can't see the devastating contradiction that you can here, Mockra. Can you enlighten me? What I see is HP first saying that he feels that when two people make cases on the same person in quick succession, they're colluding off-thread and agreed to both attack that person....and then he says that they made a mistake by both making cases at the same time so their collusion was easier to spot by the likes of HP.

So where's the horrible contradiction? Both posts say that Atrahal and Galain agreed to attack Kessobahn - the later post just says they made a mistake in both attacking, with cases, at nearabouts the same time, when they should have come at Kesso from different angles. Have I missed something, because at the moment it seems to me that you're working quite hard to make something out of not much?

[Meanas]

Path-Shaper, on 28 November 2011 - 11:22 PM, said:

It is Day 1, 16 hours and 40 minutes are left in the day.

17 players alive: Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Galain, Gamelon, Hood's Path, Kessobahn, Meanas, Mockra, Omtose, Osseric, Rashan, Ruse, Spite, Tennes, Thryllan, Tiamatha

9 votes to lynch, 9 to go to night.

1 vote Galain: Rashan
1 vote Tennes: Tiamatha
2 votes Rashan: Spite, Mockra
2 votes Thyrllan: Galain, Emurlahn
1 vote Mockra: Osseric
1 vote Kesso: Thryllan



17 Players still alive,

Players not voting
Anomandaris, Atrahal, Gamelon, Hood's Path, Kessobahn, Meanas, Omtose, Ruse, Tennes

Galain swapped votes to Kesso right after Atrahal showed up and voted Kesso. Mockra came in and voted Thyr, along with Kesso, making it 3-all. Galain is suspicious for jumping. The vote for Thyr could have been signalling and he was eager to drop it when a better choice showed up. It could also be just flat out fake-symping from Galain.

Could be either/or, but when in doubt, vote for the symped, not the symp.

Vote Thyrllan