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I just finished Ghost Story... SPOILER

#21 User is offline   Morgoth 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 08:36 AM

so no love for Cthulhu? Alas
Take good care to keep relations civil
It's decent in the first of gentlemen
To speak friendly, Even to the devil
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#22 User is offline   Chance 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 09:01 AM

 Abyss, on 03 August 2011 - 07:47 AM, said:

Quote

I wonder what 'the parasite' that worked with Mab and Demonreach is, and if it'll be of wider significance later on.


i TOO wonder about that. Fair bet we'll find out...


Lash is a parasite and there has been implication that she might be coming back both in the books and from Jim in interviews. Just a possibility which I'm not sure to be happy about but it could connect to the next plotline if it will be Harry solving Mabs anger issues connected to hellfire and general destruction in her stronghold.

/Chance

This post has been edited by Chance: 03 August 2011 - 09:05 AM

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#23 User is offline   Cause 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 09:59 AM

Also does anyone else want Harry and Molly to get together. Its odd, I don't actually see any reason for them to get together, Im not sure I would approve of the relationship but the way Butcher writes Molly's unrequited love for the DRESDEN I'm really starting to feel bad for her! I kinda just want him to make her feel better. Some of the lines in ghost story relating to this sub-plot were brutal!
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#24 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 11:03 AM

 Chance, on 03 August 2011 - 09:01 AM, said:

 Abyss, on 03 August 2011 - 07:47 AM, said:

Quote

I wonder what 'the parasite' that worked with Mab and Demonreach is, and if it'll be of wider significance later on.


i TOO wonder about that. Fair bet we'll find out...


Lash is a parasite and there has been implication that she might be coming back both in the books and from Jim in interviews. Just a possibility which I'm not sure to be happy about but it could connect to the next plotline if it will be Harry solving Mabs anger issues connected to hellfire and general destruction in her stronghold.

/Chance


Close.

Someone asked about Lasciel to him in an interview, not Lash...and he said something like, "it's funny you should put it like that."

So I think GOOD Lash, the reflection from his head is gone gone gone...but now it's time to turn the real deal Lasciel.
"When the last tree has fallen, and the rivers are poisoned, you cannot eat money, oh no." ~Aurora
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#25 User is offline   Chance 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 12:27 PM

 King Kazma, on 03 August 2011 - 11:03 AM, said:


Close.

Someone asked about Lasciel to him in an interview, not Lash...and he said something like, "it's funny you should put it like that."

So I think GOOD Lash, the reflection from his head is gone gone gone...but now it's time to turn the real deal Lasciel.


Nop not what he said...but lets not get picky here are the relevant inteview stuff and people can get their own opinion on what it means. The spoiler on the last thing is potentially a spoiler for later books (however very very minor) as it is not explicitly stated in Ghost Story.

What roll will Lasciel play in future books?
That's going to be another one of those where I go "Hahaha, I know and you don't" because, you know, it's the whole, I want to provide for my family thing. Were're not done with Lasciel. We might not even be totally done with Lash, but we will have to see how that goes.
2009 Chicago signing:
Q: Will we see Lash or Lasciel again?
A: Lasciel’s story is not over. And keep in mind what’s said about ‘a woman scorned.’ Also keep in mind that Lasciel is NOT Lash; Lasciel did not reabsorb the entity that Harry actually changed. (Yes, he use those words “that Harry actually changed.”)
2009 Independence signing
Q: Was the voice in Harry’s head at the end of White Night (when he was playing guitar) a sign that Lash is still there?
A: Not really. But Lash’s story isn’t done.
There's a WoJ from the Atlanta book signing that
Spoiler


/Chance

This post has been edited by Chance: 03 August 2011 - 12:50 PM

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#26 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 12:49 PM

Actually, yeah it is what he said...if he's changed that since I heard it...I'm cool with that, but he most certainly did say it...though it might have been before your quotes.

I made a post about missing Lash at the Butcher forums and someone in the know there said he made a comment about using the specific name Lasciel and how that was an interesting way of putting it.

Like I said, if he's modded that to include Lash now, then that's news to me.
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#27 User is offline   Held 

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Posted 04 August 2011 - 08:38 AM

Ok so I have been following the Ghost Story discussion on the Butcher Forum and after reading all the thoughts on whether Lash might be the parasite and whether Lash is the shadow next to his bed I found some posts that make sense to me. I don't think Lash is in this book. These quotes describe it better than I could.

Quote

Dresden was shot in the chest near his heart by someone who does not miss. So there was some major heart damage. If the blood circulation was maintained by a beating heart, then Mab must have healed his heart almost instantly. And Mab was apparently providing "breath". If she can do all that, then causing the heart to beat is trivial. On top of that, the freaking tree can somehow magically grow conduits into Harry's blood vessels. If the tree can magically do that, it should be easy for it to also circulate the blood. Either way, there is no need to involve Lash to circulate the blood. If Butcher does write Lash into there for no good reason, then it is just lame. I hope he does not.


Quote

The problem with saying one of the Denerians is responsible for whispering to Dresden is the simple fact nothing they do qualifies as cheating. They exist in balance with the Knights and are free to maim, deceive, kill, and subvert to their black heart's content. Another reason to exclude the Denerians is because something so subtle would not really be practical at that moment and time for them. If they wanted him dead and managed to get that close to him, then why waste the breath? Just bash his head in and be done with it. As for Lash specifically, assuming that she even survived giving up her 'life' for Dresen, what would she gain by getting Dresden to kill himself? The entire purpose of the Shadow of Lasciel is to subvert Dresden so he will take up the coin; killing him would be quite counterproductive.

The truth is that Uriel's care to avoid saying the Fallen's name makes it clear who he is talking about. Think about how in Small Favors, Mab takes great care to refer to the archangels by titles and not by names, even cautioning Dresden about saying Uriel's name. How in Changes, the Erlking warned Dresden about the consequences about saying Mab's name a third time. To put all that it into context, the idiom "speak of the Devil" is more than just a turn of phrase in the Dresdenverse, and quite literal in this moment and time. It was the Prince of Darkness cheating in Small Favors that dragged Uriel into the story, and it seems the Prince of Darkness cheating in Changes dragged Uriel back in again.


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#28 User is offline   Gwynn ap Nudd 

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 01:39 AM

Interesting read, and not quite what I was expecting. I'm sure I missed some bits in my first read, so I'll go back over it next weekend.

The book came across as an opportunity for Dresden to grow, to see how his friends view him and what they are capable without him leading the charge. For parts of the book he is essentially viewing them from the other side of the fourth wall. Corpsetaker was only relevant in that a big bad was needed for the Justice League to fight, and she works well in terms of Harry recovering that last memory. The actual conflict was secondary to the rest of the novel.

From my view, it did not advance the plotline much but did give us some insight into a few of the characters and thier relationships. I was disappointed by Butters coming back so quickly though. Other than that, I had hoped for a few answers from this book and instead am left with even more questions.

And to whoever said it up thread, I definately feel sorry for Molly. One has to wonder what will happen the next time Harry meets Molly or Karrin in the land of the living.
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#29 User is offline   Paran 

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 03:25 AM

What if the whole point of the whispered words was to force the path Harry took, not in killing himself, but towards the post of Winter Knight? Probably being addressed in Cold Days.

BTW, saw no evidence of Lash in this book??
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#30 User is offline   wolf_2099 

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 09:08 PM

Question:

Did they ever explain Dresdens' death curse?

If he was messed up, and had his memory wiped, then how did the death curse not hit Kincaid?
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#31 User is offline   Chance 

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 11:58 PM

 wolf_2099, on 12 August 2011 - 09:08 PM, said:

Question:

Did they ever explain Dresdens' death curse?

If he was messed up, and had his memory wiped, then how did the death curse not hit Kincaid?


Deathcurses as explained so far need concious direction and intent...Dresden died confused and uncertain what was happening aka no deathcurse most likely.



/Chance

This post has been edited by Chance: 12 August 2011 - 11:59 PM

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#32 User is offline   Gwynn ap Nudd 

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Posted 13 August 2011 - 01:23 AM

 Paran, on 08 August 2011 - 03:25 AM, said:

What if the whole point of the whispered words was to force the path Harry took, not in killing himself, but towards the post of Winter Knight? Probably being addressed in Cold Days.

BTW, saw no evidence of Lash in this book??


I believe Lash was the parasite mentioned by Mab or Demonreach at the end of the book.
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#33 User is offline   Traveller 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 11:47 AM

Did anyone else copy finish with the final line
Spoiler


Which can't be right.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 15 August 2011 - 11:47 AM

So that's the story. And what was the real lesson? Don't leave things in the fridge.
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#34 User is offline   wolf_2099 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 07:59 PM

 Traveller, on 15 August 2011 - 11:47 AM, said:

Did anyone else copy finish with the final line
Spoiler


Which can't be right.



Mine did, too. Why can't it be right?
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#35 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 08:16 PM

 Gwynn ap Nudd, on 13 August 2011 - 01:23 AM, said:

 Paran, on 08 August 2011 - 03:25 AM, said:

What if the whole point of the whispered words was to force the path Harry took, not in killing himself, but towards the post of Winter Knight? Probably being addressed in Cold Days.

BTW, saw no evidence of Lash in this book??


I believe Lash was the parasite mentioned by Mab or Demonreach at the end of the book.


Lasciel.

"Lash" was the mirror image of Lasciel (brought on by touching the Denarian coin and not possessing it) in Harry's head that he corrupted to be good, but she died in the use of power exhibited in BLOOD RITES finale.

Butcher has made sure to differentiate the two as differing entities.

If that whispered words demon was Lasciel (I have my doubts, but maybe) then it was certainly the real deal Denarian...

though it raises a point...

The Denarian Coin for Lasciel (IIRC) was last buried inside the Copper circle embedded int he floor of Harry's lab 'neath his house...which was destroyed in CHANGES, and is now the location of Marconi's Justice League HQ...does that mean Lasciel's coin is still buried under the earth of the new HQ?
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#36 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 08:33 PM

I seem to remember Harry digging it up and giving it to Michael after Harry admited coming in contact to the coin with Ammorachius to his throat... I thought...
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#37 User is offline   20 Days of Sheep 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 09:53 PM

It is now in Forthills care after White Night when she sacrifised herself.
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#38 User is offline   Traveller 

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Posted 15 August 2011 - 09:57 PM

 wolf_2099, on 15 August 2011 - 07:59 PM, said:

 Traveller, on 15 August 2011 - 11:47 AM, said:

Did anyone else copy finish with the final line
Spoiler


Which can't be right.



Mine did, too. Why can't it be right?


'to do be done?' Surely it should be '..to do' OR ' ..to be done'. The latter sounds better. But 'to do be done' looks like a cock up to me.
So that's the story. And what was the real lesson? Don't leave things in the fridge.
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#39 User is offline   QuickTidal 

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Posted 16 August 2011 - 12:25 PM

 Briar King, on 15 August 2011 - 09:53 PM, said:

It is now in Forthills care after White Night when she sacrifised herself.


Dammit it WAS WHITE NIGHT (not BLOOD RIGHTS), and thanks for BK who recently ran through the entire series like a boss for current location of Lasciel's Denarian coin...

...which wait a minute...puts that "demon whispering in Harry's ear" thing into a new light...since he was laying on Forthill's cot in the room next to his secret safe....hmmm....possibility that the whispering demon was Lasciel is raised.

Good find team!
"When the last tree has fallen, and the rivers are poisoned, you cannot eat money, oh no." ~Aurora
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#40 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 16 August 2011 - 02:55 PM

 King Kazma, on 16 August 2011 - 12:25 PM, said:

 Briar King, on 15 August 2011 - 09:53 PM, said:

It is now in Forthills care after White Night when she sacrifised herself.


Dammit it WAS WHITE NIGHT (not BLOOD RIGHTS), and thanks for BK who recently ran through the entire series like a boss for current location of Lasciel's Denarian coin...

...which wait a minute...puts that "demon whispering in Harry's ear" thing into a new light...since he was laying on Forthill's cot in the room next to his secret safe....hmmm....possibility that the whispering demon was Lasciel is raised.

Good find team!


But how is that cheating? Lash indicated that the fallen can get on holy ground but generally dont because it makes them feel.

It had to have been someone who 'couldn't' have been there, so I assume it had to have been the Devil.
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