[tiam]

Defiance, on 23 September 2013 - 04:37 AM, said:

Jeez. Ozymandias turned the tension up to 11 and brought everything crashing down. This episode just rubbed our faces in the dirt for good measure. Seeing how everyone's life is so broken is incredibly depressing. The call between Walt and Junior especially. Also, at this point Jesse living would be far more tragic than him dying. I'm pretty sure he'd end up committing suicide if ever gets free. I just hope he has a chance to kill Todd before he gets his sweet release.

And the opening music at the end? Perfect. Fucking perfect.

Also, what are Walt's specific motivations?

We won't know for sure until the next episode. But here's my thoughts on what went through his head when he was watching TV:

It insulted his pride. Pride is the biggest part of Walt's ego - it's his Heisenberg side. It's the one thing that will make him do things he would otherwise never do. I don't think he's going after Gretchen and Elliott, though. Sure, they pissed him off, but I doubt that he wants his son (and daughter) to view him only as a mass murdering drug dealer who killed their uncle and two unarmed family friends. Even if Junior hates his father, Walt most definitely cares what he thinks (thus his complete breakdown at the end).

Walt hears his empire is still around. He built it. E&G mention Walt never built anything and that Heisenberg is all that remains. His pride is spurring him to prove them wrong. He built this empire, and he will die with it. He doesn't want a do-over of Gray Matter where he helps build something but doesn't get any of the credit for it. Walt wants to be remember for HIS empire, and by bringing it down with his own hands he will certainly be remembered. After all, what will people think when the news that Walter White aka Heisenberg, the now-fugitive who built a meth empire, was the very same person who destroyed it?

The tagline for this half of the season is "Remember My Name", and I think this is how Walt will be remembered.

Ive just watched it on netflix and had a slightly different view.

The man who was going to turn himself in after that tearful conversation with his son was Walter White. He was broken by that conversation to the point where he was willing to turn himself in but after the news report his entire being was called into question. I think there is a bit of the Heisenburg pride but id say its more in line with him accepting who he is now and going to deal with his legacy. He is Heisenburg protecting his illegal legacy now rather than Walter White trying to make amends.

Also epic drill sergeant cameo was epic.

Prediction- Jesse will take over the reigns after Walt goes and the uncles are gone with support from Lydia as he can make a purer batch. He will do this to provide for Brock who he orphaned by association.

This post has been edited by Jean-Claude Van tiam: 25 September 2013 - 02:09 PM

[Defiance]

Why do we think Jesse will get off freely? I've had the idea that he might end up in prison if he lives. After all, his deal with Hank was never official.

[Agraba]

Defiance, on 26 September 2013 - 03:47 AM, said:

Why do we think Jesse will get off freely? I've had the idea that he might end up in prison if he lives. After all, his deal with Hank was never official.

Because Walter is his get out of jail free card.... bitch

[Abyss]

Jean-Claude Van tiam, on 25 September 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

...
Prediction- Jesse will take over the reigns after Walt goes and the uncles are gone with support from Lydia as he can make a purer batch. He will do this to provide for Brock who he orphaned by association.

It's an interesting prediction. Would be all kinds of poetic.

...Andrea... fuck me but that was just brutal.

[Jakovasaurus]

[tiam]

Abyss, on 26 September 2013 - 05:56 PM, said:

Jean-Claude Van tiam, on 25 September 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

...
Prediction- Jesse will take over the reigns after Walt goes and the uncles are gone with support from Lydia as he can make a purer batch. He will do this to provide for Brock who he orphaned by association.

It's an interesting prediction. Would be all kinds of poetic.

...Andrea... fuck me but that was just brutal.

Jesse also spoke up for Lydia when they were going to kill her when Mike was involved and I actually thought they might get together at one point. I dont really think she cares where the meth is coming from as long as its coming.

Edit- Yes Todd is a little c**t. His face when he sees Jesse crying on the tape when he mentions shooting that kid highlights how much Mike was necessary.

This post has been edited by Jean-Claude Van tiam: 28 September 2013 - 07:10 PM

[Jakovasaurus]

Every scene was a holy fuck moment! Brilliant, brilliant television. The best ending, ever.

[Defiance]

Wow, that was fantastic.

My favorite part was probably Walt talking to Skyler. "I did it for me. I liked it. I was good at it. And I was alive." He has no more delusions.

[Abyss]

Brilliantly done finale. Hit all the right notes, no low points, no contrivances. Loved it. Totally satisfying way to end the series.

[Agraba]

The whole thing felt kinda shady... y'know, like, morality-wise?

The scene when Walter entered Jack's bunker felt very reminiscent to him entering Tuco's office. There was that same kind of tension when they handled his car keys and when they handled his mercury fulminate bag that's like, "if you mishandle that you'll kill us all". Except we didn't know about the mercury bag at the time, but we knew damn well about the keys.

It was a solid, or "satisfying" ending, but it certainly wasn't the best episode in the show, or even this season. For this season I would say Confessions is a winner, with Ozymandias coming in a close second.

[End of Disc One]

It was solid but also played it too safe IMO. Ozymandias was basically the climax, and the last two episodes were falling action. I didn't really like it how Walt accomplished everything he wanted to in the finale. I thought the point of the show was that there were consequenses to living a life of crime. And that Walt is no longer a hero by the end. But in the finale he came across as the hero and had a pretty happy ending.

I don't want to sound too negative though. It was a good episode. I especially liked the Gray Matter part and was happy to see Badger and Skinny Pete again.

[Jakovasaurus]

A lot of artsy fartsy students of film and renowned critics say the best episode of the series is "Fly" from season 3. It's hard for me to pick my favorite episode, but I gotta agree that Fly is up there. Also, I very much enjoyed the story arc of the twins. The tension that built up through those episodes as they made there way to New Mexico was spectacular.

Anyway back to the finale.

Spoiler

Boy did Todd and Lydia get their just desserts.

[End of Disc One]

Lol Fly. I always laugh when someone says that's the best episode.

[Defiance]

For me, this entire eight episode stretch has been the show's climax.

I didn't feel like the show was trying to portray Walt as a hero in the end. Yeah, it wasn't as dark as I expected, but that's okay. Why does every movie or show need to preach/hammer in the point of consequences to being a criminal? I thought Breaking Bad did things perfectly in a way that wasn't hamfisted. Consider the picture at large: there were most certainly consequences.

1) Walt will never be loved by his family
2) Hank's death
3) Jesse has lost almost everything, torture of body and spirit.
4) Walt admitted that it was, by and large, for him. Yeah, he started doing it for his family, but it quickly became about the power and his ego. He finally owned up to that.

I didn't see it as any sort of redemption or making Walt a hero. Walt was never a hero to begin with, and even though he found a way to get money to his family, it doesn't even begin to absolve/redeem everything he's done in the past. And let's be honest - killing Jack was about revenge more than anything else.

Instead, I saw the ending as peace of mind. Walt got it and was able to die on his own terms. As for everyone else, they'll endure and live on, but not a single other person is better off in the grand scheme of things. Monetarily, his family may survive, but was all of this really worth 9 million dollars? No way in hell it was.

[tiam]

Defiance, on 30 September 2013 - 03:08 PM, said:

And let's be honest - killing Jack was about revenge more than anything else.

Ive just finished watching it.

Jack became Walts Heisenburg character in a way. He and his what 9-10? relatives have just got 80 million. They can all go and retire but they dont they continue with the meth. Pride. And Walt uses that pride against Jack the way it was used against him, using Jacks ego that he was Jesse partner rather than simply keeping Jesse as a slave. Even though Jack was going to kill him it was to end on Jacks terms with Jack proving his superiority to Walt, similar to the Walt and Gus conflict. Jacks final plea to Walt about the mainstay of the money shows the parellel of the two. When Walt met Saul in the last episode thats what he was going to do, using hired mercenaries to get his fortune back. But he now knows hes gained more money for his family then theyll ever need, much more than the 747 000 dollars of the original goal. He no longer cares about his pride whereas Jack has died for his.

Honestly I wasnt blown away by this episode either. I know theres a Saul Goodman spin off coming up but I would have liked to have known what Jesse did from now on. Its better than a Sopranos cut to black but I would have liked a Wire style montage of a bit more. Ozymandias was the best episode this season.

As for a favorite epsiode I dont know what its called but the one where Walt refuses treatment and they pass the cushion around the couch. Acting is superb all round especially Cranston who goes on about not wanting to be remembered like that by his loved ones. The callback to that in season 4 where Walt talks to Walt Jr about how he claims to not remember his own father but does and he remember the strong smell of disinfectant covering up the smell of death. Fantastic all round.

[Defiance]

Yup.

The scene with Jack had a lot of great moments. Beyond the pride, I love how it paralleled Hank's death. Both were killed in mid-sentence, but there was one big difference: Jack went out trying to beg and bargain, whereas Hank went out with his dignity.

Todd getting up and looking out the window was hilarious. He's the perfect sociopath. He doesn't really care about everyone that just got massacred. He's just trying to figure out what exactly happened. "Jesus...Mr. White..." And the ringtone, perfect. First we got "She Blinded Me With Science," then this Lydia song - it's actually from something which surprised me, can't remember what though.

And Jesse walking away and the little head-nod between the two of them at the end. Very powerful.

[Ceda Cicero]

I've heard a lot of complaints that Walt was able to wrap things up too neatly, that it was too easy for him to go out on his own terms after five seasons of banking bad karma. I think that's totally incorrect. Walt DID go out on "his" terms but it was only after he finally looked in the mirror, stopped lying to himself, and recognized what a self-serving fuck he'd been. Going out on his terms in the wake of that realization to me isn't a cop out, or too neat. He died having accomplished what he could, but he also died without delusion—which for him was probably an emotional agony that cut deeper than any satisfaction he got from killing Jack, laundering his money to Flinn through the Schwartzes, saving Jesse, etc.

[Jakovasaurus]

If you have paid attention to Walt's => Heisenberg's story throughout the series you will be absolutely 100% satisfied with how the series ended. Vince Gillagan has stated (on numerous occasions) the main theme of Breaking Bad was to "transform Mr. Chips into Scarface". Watch Scarface and you will agree he accomplished this without a doubt.

[flea]

Briar King, on 30 September 2013 - 07:19 AM, said:

I think we re so impressed it didn't have Soprano "fade to Black, who do YOU think happen"

This was the most epic way to end the show possible.

Great ending.
But you are wrong about The Soprano's: the fade to black is the death of Tony.

[Ceda Cicero]

Briar King, on 01 October 2013 - 04:50 AM, said:

flea, on 01 October 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

Briar King, on 30 September 2013 - 07:19 AM, said:

I think we re so impressed it didn't have Soprano "fade to Black, who do YOU think happen"

This was the most epic way to end the show possible.

Great ending.
But you are wrong about The Soprano's: the fade to black is the death of Tony.

Ahh but you see I'm not wrong it was left for you as a viewer to make up your own mind. So if you decide he was killed then he was. If you decide he looked up as Meadow came in the door then she did. Unless of course David Chase has stated in an interview I've not read since 07?

All the signs are there. David Chase has never said (probably never will) but I feel very strongly that the blackout was Tony's death.

This absurdly longwinded essay covers it piece by piece: http://masterofsopra...ion-of-the-end/