[Kalse]

Anomandaris, on 16 June 2011 - 06:32 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:26 PM, said:

But they don't have to be cult. What if they are UMP or UMCP, masquerading as Trumpet to be 'unlynchable'? If one of them has some sort of defense against getting hit by amnions, like a vig-response, that would be an awesome play.

My head hurts.

It's a possibility, but I think they've outed themselves as likely cult targets, so they're bound to get lynched eventually. I say leave them for now. It's unlikely they are recruited yet, so if cult wants to try and profit from knowing some easily recruited players they'll go for it and then we'll have some easy cult lynches. OTOH, cult may figure the same and not recruit them, in which case there's still no reason to lynch them. Either way, I say we go for someone else today. Looks like Fener is shaping up to be a big candidate today, and Barghast a bit, too.

Use their votes, and watch to see any sudden changes in behavior or priorities. Same as always in a Cult game.

I'm going to just repeat from yesterday:

Vote Fener


The two possible Trumpet reveals don't change my mind on that.

[D'riss]

Eloth, on 16 June 2011 - 10:22 AM, said:

but that would mean he was recruited and killed the same night? Recruitment usually comes after kill. i would guess order is

guard > heal > unrecruit > kill > recruit

In some pastt games we sometimes started with a 'mod puppet' alt being killed in the opening scene to set the game up. anytime there is a cult there is always a recruit in place to be given to new recruits. maybe roldom and tapper just wanted to give their recruit a bit of back story

I really don't like this. Everything is supposed to happen at the same time in mafia, and you don't know what the 'order' is for this game... it seems like you are trying to imply that the cult is smaller than I would expect it to be, by claiming that he had to be an original member of the cult due to recruit coming after kills...

[D'riss]

Fener, on 16 June 2011 - 12:23 PM, said:

Ugh... So because ruse mentioned me i am now supposedly the likely cult?. Sigh...i suppose i would be looking at me too so i can't fault you there. Well there is not much i cant do or say that changes that. Im not cult. He simply stated what a few others also said about my and eloth's little scrap yesterday. And since we where the main focus its not unreasonable that he would mention or side with one of us. If he had agree'd the other way around we would be looking at eloth now... Wat ever...

This is a rather good defense against a rising murmur about Fener being cult. He just said 'I don't blame you guys for looking at me, im cool because im not cult, lets talk about eloth now...'.
He isn't telling us anything we don't know, but just trying to be relaxed and throwing out some gentle misdirection... a very large change from his first day 'LEAVE LOW POSTERS ALONE!' one man calvalry charge.

[Barghast]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:26 PM, said:

But they don't have to be cult. What if they are UMP or UMCP, masquerading as Trumpet to be 'unlynchable'? If one of them has some sort of defense against getting hit by amnions, like a vig-response, that would be an awesome play.

My head hurts.

True, but I don't really see the point in them doing so. By exposing their faction they're basically forcing us to lynch them at some point.

Anomandaris, on 16 June 2011 - 06:32 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:26 PM, said:

But they don't have to be cult. What if they are UMP or UMCP, masquerading as Trumpet to be 'unlynchable'? If one of them has some sort of defense against getting hit by amnions, like a vig-response, that would be an awesome play.

My head hurts.

It's a possibility, but I think they've outed themselves as likely cult targets, so they're bound to get lynched eventually. I say leave them for now. It's unlikely they are recruited yet, so if cult wants to try and profit from knowing some easily recruited players they'll go for it and then we'll have some easy cult lynches. OTOH, cult may figure the same and not recruit them, in which case there's still no reason to lynch them. Either way, I say we go for someone else today. Looks like Fener is shaping up to be a big candidate today, and Barghast a bit, too.

I agree that we leave them for now. Unfortunately the WIFOM of whether or not the recruiter would go for the most obvious target ends up turning into an elephant in the room.

And I am? Based on what now exactly?

[Okaros]

not to mention how many assumptions that makes.... for example, who's to say there's no finders?


of course, not all actions are resolved simultaneously. there is an order, wich is necessary, from a mod's perspective. so i'm not fully dissagreeing with Eloth.



however, reading back, i really don't think it's of any use trying to figure out if Ruse was anight 1 recruit or not. esp since it sems PS has pretty clearly stated he was an original Amnion

[Okaros]

Barghast, on 16 June 2011 - 06:46 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:26 PM, said:

But they don't have to be cult. What if they are UMP or UMCP, masquerading as Trumpet to be 'unlynchable'? If one of them has some sort of defense against getting hit by amnions, like a vig-response, that would be an awesome play.

My head hurts.

True, but I don't really see the point in them doing so. By exposing their faction they're basically forcing us to lynch them at some point.

Anomandaris, on 16 June 2011 - 06:32 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:26 PM, said:

But they don't have to be cult. What if they are UMP or UMCP, masquerading as Trumpet to be 'unlynchable'? If one of them has some sort of defense against getting hit by amnions, like a vig-response, that would be an awesome play.

My head hurts.

It's a possibility, but I think they've outed themselves as likely cult targets, so they're bound to get lynched eventually. I say leave them for now. It's unlikely they are recruited yet, so if cult wants to try and profit from knowing some easily recruited players they'll go for it and then we'll have some easy cult lynches. OTOH, cult may figure the same and not recruit them, in which case there's still no reason to lynch them. Either way, I say we go for someone else today. Looks like Fener is shaping up to be a big candidate today, and Barghast a bit, too.

I agree that we leave them for now. Unfortunately the WIFOM of whether or not the recruiter would go for the most obvious target ends up turning into an elephant in the room.

And I am? Based on what now exactly?

my guess would be, oyu're being linked with Gamelonb and Ruse.

[D'riss]

ooo Kalse is here.

Kalse, why did you claim that the cult could recruit every other day?

@Barghast - yes, the trumpets will have to be lynched, but that isn't to say they need to be lynched right now.

[Okaros]

also, allow me just to say, I don't like Tiam's "contingency reasoning" bit. At all.



I won't harp on it excessively, since it appears his story "checks out" so to speak, bu I am vary.

[Kalse]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:48 PM, said:

ooo Kalse is here.

Kalse, why did you claim that the cult could recruit every other day?

I didn't. I said it made more sense for a game this size, based on previous games, otherwise they'd be overpowered.

I don't know how often they can recruit, or whether it's a straight-up recruiting or token-based system.

[Karatallid]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:48 PM, said:

ooo Kalse is here.

Kalse, why did you claim that the cult could recruit every other day?

@Barghast - yes, the trumpets will have to be lynched, but that isn't to say they need to be lynched right now.

To lynch them now would give the recruiter a free night. That might change tomorrow, but today it would seem like a stupid move.

[Anomandaris]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 06:42 PM, said:

Eloth, on 16 June 2011 - 10:22 AM, said:

but that would mean he was recruited and killed the same night? Recruitment usually comes after kill. i would guess order is

guard > heal > unrecruit > kill > recruit

In some pastt games we sometimes started with a 'mod puppet' alt being killed in the opening scene to set the game up. anytime there is a cult there is always a recruit in place to be given to new recruits. maybe roldom and tapper just wanted to give their recruit a bit of back story

I really don't like this. Everything is supposed to happen at the same time in mafia, and you don't know what the 'order' is for this game... it seems like you are trying to imply that the cult is smaller than I would expect it to be, by claiming that he had to be an original member of the cult due to recruit coming after kills...

Actually, in most games actions do get processed in a particular order. This is especially true of faction and cult games.

[Anomandaris]

You know what, I'm happy with a Fener lynch if there's enough people who agree. His behaviour has been pretty inconsistent as if trying to not appear to passive while still get agreeableness in. That could be indicative of him trying to hide himself or of being recruited. He has possible ties from Ruse and Gamelon. And he's FENER. When in doubt, you always lynch Fener!

Vote Fener

[D'riss]

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

[Barghast]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:05 PM, said:

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

Is there any other reason you figure me for cult except the day one banter and the fact that we both found Tiam's suspicious behavior suspicious?

Fener will likely only be on again in around 12 hours. Luckily we still have about 20.

[D'riss]

Barghast, on 16 June 2011 - 07:09 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:05 PM, said:

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

Is there any other reason you figure me for cult except the day one banter and the fact that we both found Tiam's suspicious behavior suspicious?

Fener will likely only be on again in around 12 hours. Luckily we still have about 20.

As I did a read-through, your name came up a couple times. If we are going to do it, I think you would be a from game start Amnion, whereas fener strikes me more as a recruit.

However, thinking about what Kalse said, those recruiting options make sense depending on the size of the team. If, for instance, trumpet started with 6, and the amnions started with two, (assuming the other factions have 4) then once a night recruiting could be fair. If, however the cult started with 3-4, then I see the every other night, or even a token system, working well...

So the question is, are the trumpet reveals real? If so, then I don't think you are an Amnion. If the trumpet reveals are fake, then I think you very well could be an Amnion.

[Barghast]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:13 PM, said:

Barghast, on 16 June 2011 - 07:09 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:05 PM, said:

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

Is there any other reason you figure me for cult except the day one banter and the fact that we both found Tiam's suspicious behavior suspicious?

Fener will likely only be on again in around 12 hours. Luckily we still have about 20.

As I did a read-through, your name came up a couple times. If we are going to do it, I think you would be a from game start Amnion, whereas fener strikes me more as a recruit.

However, thinking about what Kalse said, those recruiting options make sense depending on the size of the team. If, for instance, trumpet started with 6, and the amnions started with two, (assuming the other factions have 4) then once a night recruiting could be fair. If, however the cult started with 3-4, then I see the every other night, or even a token system, working well...

So the question is, are the trumpet reveals real? If so, then I don't think you are an Amnion. If the trumpet reveals are fake, then I think you very well could be an Amnion.

Fair enough. Looking back I can see how Ruse's reference to Gam's uncle could possibly be signalling (very likely if Gam was in fact the alt told to recruits). Personally I think the Amnion started with three. The two players named in the wiki entry of which Gam would appear to be the non-recruiter and Ruse, the pre-game recruit.

[Barghast]

Reading back through the first few pages, I think Fener's attitude changed more when D'riss joined the conversation and he started to get frustrated with arguing the same point again. The vote for Merrid was a while after that and the point that he gave in. The tone from then to now has changed a bit more though, so I can still see it being justifiable as the reasoning behind a vote. That said it comes across as a new recruit trying to lay a bit lower than anything else. Not a bad vote with no other info, but not the best that we could possibly hope for either.

The other person that stands out to me is Eloth. Not just because they said a fair bit, because of some of their reasoning, especially the thought that all four factions would be balanced when we have been told there is a cult.

[Okaros]

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:05 PM, said:

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

i love it.

[Kalse]

Okaros, on 16 June 2011 - 08:29 PM, said:

D, on 16 June 2011 - 07:05 PM, said:

I'm thinking Fener, Barghast, or possibly Okaros. Why Okaros? I have no idea.

There is still plenty of time in the day, so I'm going to hold off voting until Fener can show up and maybe do some posting.

i love it.

I was actually thinking the same about you - until fairly recently, you'd been making a lot of vague, hit-and-run posts.

[Alkend]

i'm going away for a little while, be back on tomorrow still plenty of time but at this moment I am going to

vote fener

This seems the best option with all that has been said so far, i'd also be happy with a tiam vote because i think he was lying about his faction, i only outed myself because i didn't understand his motivations and it would have looked fishy if i just said i think he is wrong without backing it up.