Malazan Empire: Warran is the best part of this book - Malazan Empire

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Warran is the best part of this book Rate Topic: -----

#1 User is offline   CussersForChristmas 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 01:09 AM

Quote

Kiska did not know where to begin. Jheval pointed. 'That's a big fish.'
The old fellow hunched, peering suspiciously about. He held his arms out as if trying to hide the huge corpse. 'It's mine.'
'Okay.'
'You can't have it.'
'I assure you—'
'Get your own.'
'I don't want your damned fish!' Jheval shouted.
The old man put a finger to one eye, nodding. 'Oh, yes. That's what they all say … but they're lying!'
Jheval caught Kiska's gaze. He tapped a finger to his head. 'Let's go.'


Quote

He looked to the empty sky, then glanced to one side. It was a slim man in a loose dark shirt and trousers, with a rope draped round his neck which he held in both hands. 'It just so happens that yes, I am.'
'Thank the Ancients – you've wasted enough attention here.'
'The creeping loss of Emurlahn is not to be ignored.' He raised a finger. 'No one steals from me. Not even a fish.'
The other furrowed his thin brows, opened his mouth to make a comment, reconsidered. 'Well, this was never a threat.'
'You are too sure of yourself.'
'My confidence has gotten us where we are.'
'As has my wariness and paranoia!'
Each glared at the other until Warran's slit gaze slid aside and he murmured, 'At least I think so …'
The other began fading away. 'We're too busy for this …'
Warran let out a tired breath, began thinning into transparency as if wafting away into shreds of shadow. 'But I was enjoying the unravelling of the Whorl, the desolate landscape, the useless flailing of the Liosan …'
In moments both were gone.


I love shadowthrone comic relief, ICE does a really good job of making him more personable. I thought when the priest appeared in shadow it would be Pust but I was pleasantly surprised with kellanvad accompanying kiska and leoman, his jealously of edgewalker was a nice touch, edgewalker being on my list of top mysteries I want solved. Maybe a past ruler of shadow? And trapping that creature was a good scene too. The trip through shadow was one of the better parts of the story imo.

Any theories on edgewalker guys?
No one steals from me. Not even a fish!
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#2 User is offline   Gatekeeper 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 02:34 AM

I also enjoyed the hell out of our I'm-Crazy-Good-At-What-I-Do emperor. I love the way ICE writes him, and after learning for sure that ICE was indeed Kell and SE was Dancer, it makes it even better. I've said before that Emp. Kell has to be one of the harder people to write, so I enjoy reading about him. ICE has really grown in his writing (though I loved NoK and had a man-gasm over RotCG) and I'm so happy he writes about what I want to read about, i.E, the Malazan Empire, and not about gods I could care less about and other races that I like only as cameo appearances. Bring on more Claw, marines, and sappers ICE! Thanks for telling stories I care about!
HAIL THE MARINES!
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#3 User is online   Alternative Goose 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 03:08 AM

YOU LIE!

Manask is the best part of this book but I agree the Warran parts were also gold. Just the image of a tiny old man trying to haul a shadowtuna out of a dead lake is an amazing image.
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#4 User is offline   Gatekeeper 

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Posted 27 April 2011 - 05:38 AM

AAAhahaahahhhahh "ShadowTuna" aaaahahahahahahahahaahahahahah!
HAIL THE MARINES!
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#5 User is offline   Punchy Pete 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 03:42 AM

Edgewalker says at some point that he actually briefly sat on Shadow's throne that's what enslaved him to Shadow. I'll try to dig up the quote.

 CussorsForChristmas, on 27 April 2011 - 01:09 AM, said:

Quote

Kiska did not know where to begin. Jheval pointed. 'That's a big fish.'
The old fellow hunched, peering suspiciously about. He held his arms out as if trying to hide the huge corpse. 'It's mine.'
'Okay.'
'You can't have it.'
'I assure you—'
'Get your own.'
'I don't want your damned fish!' Jheval shouted.
The old man put a finger to one eye, nodding. 'Oh, yes. That's what they all say … but they're lying!'
Jheval caught Kiska's gaze. He tapped a finger to his head. 'Let's go.'


Quote

He looked to the empty sky, then glanced to one side. It was a slim man in a loose dark shirt and trousers, with a rope draped round his neck which he held in both hands. 'It just so happens that yes, I am.'
'Thank the Ancients – you've wasted enough attention here.'
'The creeping loss of Emurlahn is not to be ignored.' He raised a finger. 'No one steals from me. Not even a fish.'
The other furrowed his thin brows, opened his mouth to make a comment, reconsidered. 'Well, this was never a threat.'
'You are too sure of yourself.'
'My confidence has gotten us where we are.'
'As has my wariness and paranoia!'
Each glared at the other until Warran's slit gaze slid aside and he murmured, 'At least I think so …'
The other began fading away. 'We're too busy for this …'
Warran let out a tired breath, began thinning into transparency as if wafting away into shreds of shadow. 'But I was enjoying the unravelling of the Whorl, the desolate landscape, the useless flailing of the Liosan …'
In moments both were gone.


I love shadowthrone comic relief, ICE does a really good job of making him more personable. I thought when the priest appeared in shadow it would be Pust but I was pleasantly surprised with kellanvad accompanying kiska and leoman, his jealously of edgewalker was a nice touch, edgewalker being on my list of top mysteries I want solved. Maybe a past ruler of shadow? And trapping that creature was a good scene too. The trip through shadow was one of the better parts of the story imo.

Any theories on edgewalker guys?

This post has been edited by Punchy Pete: 28 April 2011 - 03:48 AM

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#6 User is offline   Punchy Pete 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 04:35 AM

Okay, here's some quotes:

From "Night of Knives"

Quote

"The amber eyes narrowed. 'You know this small circle is my world now. Have you come to taunt?'

'You know I am bound just as tightly.'

Jhedel looked Edgewalker up and down. 'Not from where I'm sitting. Poor Edgewalker. Moaning his enslavement. Yet here you were long before the ones I slew to take the Throne. And here you remain after those who bound me in turn are long gone and forgotten. I've heard things about you... rumours.'


This indicates that others, many others have taken the throne, but all either enslaved or died. Then, later again in Night of Knives:

Quote

'What of a ruler? If this is Shadow then does it have a throne?'

Edgewalker remained silent for a time, long enough for Kiska to lean closer. Had he died?

But at last he asked, 'What of it?'

'I was told someone would attempt to take it this night.'

'Countless have tried. All have failed. Even those who succeeded for a time. Myself included, after a fashion. Now I walk its boundaries forever. And I fared better than most.'


So here he indicated that he took the throne, but is now bound to walk the boundaries forever.

Later, again in Night of Knives, at the end Edgewalker meets ST and Cot and admits to being a slave to shadow, to which ST responds that he commands shadow. EW then thinks to himself the following:

Quote

Edgewalker turned and limped from the House. Out upon the open plain he struck a direction towards the featureless horizon. Dust-devils dogged his heels. How many times, he wondered, had he heard that very same conceit from a claimant to the Throne? Would they never learn? How long, he wondered, would this one last? Why was it non of the long chain of hopefuls ever bothered to ask why the Throne should be empty in the first place? After all, perhaps there was a reason.


Hope that helps!
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#7 User is offline   Use Of Weapons 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 07:46 AM

Given that SE has said that when they gamed, he was Cotillion and ICE was Shadowthrone, I feel a sense of overwhelming relief that the experience has clearly given ICE a handle on the character's distinctive voice and made him able to realise it in words. Now, if only he could do that for all the other characters he's writing, he'd be close to a major breakthrough in the quality of his books, IMO. Manask was the only other character that really rang true all the way down.

Which leads me to a question: I wonder if ICE would be up for writing a fantasy comedy series in Wu? He could be the next Pterry!
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#8 User is online   Alternative Goose 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 07:57 AM

I don't know what I'd think of a comedy set in the Malazan Universe. It think it runs contrary to the nature of the universe.

The comedy bits are small pools of relief in a tale that is otherwise soul crushing in its meaningless nihilism and brutal conviction that people suck. The gods suck. The whole world sucks.
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#9 User is offline   MTS 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 10:25 AM

*shrugs* GotM was originally written as a comedy script centred around the Phoenix Inn regulars. Tehol's comedy, Pust's insanity, Kruppe's meanderings etc. don't all consist of black comedy or are solely intended to be comedic relief in the midst of a depressingly bleak story. I'd read a Tehol/Bugg comedy myself. Comedies aren't necessarily all levity anyway, so I think it would work.
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#10 User is online   Alternative Goose 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 10:43 AM

I think there was one hell of a switch between the themes and the tone of GotM and TCG. Seriously, the stuff about humanity as the destroyer is pretty fucking depressing.
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#11 User is offline   MTS 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 10:51 AM

You could say the very same thing about ICE's books and the novellas though (the switch, not the depressing part). The theme and tone of the world isn't a fixed thing, and never has been. Those books still have their nastier elements, but there's nothing saying every book has to be depressing and brutal, or even that brutal shit has to happen to stay true to the 'feel' of the world.

This post has been edited by MTS: 28 April 2011 - 10:52 AM

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#12 User is online   Alternative Goose 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 08:31 PM

Personally I think the narrative/feel is an important part of what makes the series special. I know no other author that is as unrelenting in his description of the human condition as Erikson is.
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#13 User is offline   CussersForChristmas 

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Posted 28 April 2011 - 09:09 PM

Pete, I picked up on those quotes, and I suppose I can just settle for Edgewalker being a once ruler of shadow, but he's been described several times as an Elder force, IE the talking about the impossibility of summoning him as though he is on Setch, killy, draconus and his level etc. What doesn't jive for me is that if he was a once ruler of shadow how does he become a slave to his own realm? I get the fact that shadow is some form of prison or at least dumping ground for rebellious elements but can you imagine Mael being enslaved in Ruse? Maybe shadow is unique like that, perhaps because of Emurlahns sundering? Which is why it is up for grabs in the first place?

Either way, Shadowthrone sure is touchy about his realm being "inferior" lol. And no fish are going to poach his shadows.
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#14 User is offline   Punchy Pete 

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 03:02 AM

I agree he's an elder force, as the references all point to him being in Shadow since the beginning. That's what makes him so dangerous. I admit to being confused about the timeline on shadow breaking down. Where does it fit in? Has someone done a timeline somewhere?
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#15 User is offline   MTS 

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 05:21 AM

Edgewalker is just one out of countless many who have tried for the Shadow Throne, and his failure resulted in his enslavement. Why, I don't know, but we know he wasn't there from the beginning, and as far as we know isn't aspected to Shadow in the same way that Mael is aspected to Denaeth Rusen, for instance.
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#16 User is online   Alternative Goose 

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Posted 30 April 2011 - 01:47 PM

I wonder whether the imprisonment/binding that happens to old rulers is not connected with them taking the throne but rather with them leaving it. Maybe once you are bound to the throne you are forever bound to the warren. You can serve or you can be chained.
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#17 User is offline   bars 

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Posted 18 July 2011 - 04:54 AM

I enjoyed reading the parts that had Warran in them. I also thought when he was first introduced to the book he was Pust. I enjoy reading about shadowthrone and the rope.
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#18 User is offline   Salt-Man Z 

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Posted 18 July 2011 - 09:00 PM

 Pennyapt, on 28 April 2011 - 07:57 AM, said:

I don't know what I'd think of a comedy set in the Malazan Universe. It think it runs contrary to the nature of the universe.

The B&KB novellas are pretty obviously comedy, or at least highly comedic. Dark comedy, to be sure, but comedy nonetheless. Even the narration in those is pretty funny.

This post has been edited by Salt-Man Z: 18 July 2011 - 09:06 PM

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#19 User is offline   Kanese S's 

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Posted 19 July 2011 - 11:52 AM

Warran is hilarious, especially going back and reading some of those parts again while knowing that he is, in fact, Shadowthrone.
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#20 User is offline   iron chef iskaral 

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 06:51 PM

iskaral pust would have been way better. i thought for sure it was gunna be him at first - don't we see iskaral fishing at some point in the bonehunters? I find SE's Shadowthrone more entertaining. He's got a more cliche crazy going on that works well I think. Or maybe I was just mad at Warran cause he wasn't iskaral ><
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