[Kurt Montandon]

I figure we should probably have a thread devoted to the Erikson's mistakes in TCG. Not the characters making mistakes, mind you. I'm talking about mis-steps or inexplicable changes in terminology/logic. Not logical flaws on the part of the characters like "Why didn't Shadowthrone, Cotillion, Quick Ben, Kalam, Hood & his dozen Jaghut undead, and the various cooperative Soletaken Eleint like Draconus, Silchas Ruin, and Tulas Shorn just storm the very top of the Spire in person?" Which would've made massively more sense. I doubt a dozen Pures could've stood up to that.


* Why are the Tarthenal of the Letheri continent now referred to as Teblor? It's possible Karsa got them to change their name, but there's absolutely no actual hint of it. It's just a sudden, inexplicable name change, that I first really noticed when the reinforcements from Letheras showed up by ship, and everyone called them "Teblor" as though the name "Tarthenal" had never existed.


* Korlat didn't recognize Ganoes Paran at the very end there, though she'd probably had more contact with him in MoI than she had with the various members of Whiskeyjack's squad that she did recognize.


* Referring to the non-Marines & non-heavies as "regulars," a term that I don't think was never used before - it was always "medium infantry." The term "regulars" got seriously over-used towards the end, and Erikson was kind of lazy in not bothering to show any of them to us as individuals, until the Adjunct addressed them that way. They've been kind of a faceless mass since The Bonehunters.


... all I can think of at the moment. Others?

This post has been edited by Kurt Montandon: 08 March 2011 - 09:56 PM

[Lister of Smeg]

1) A lot of the time, it was Spax thinking of the Tarthenals as Teblor which makes sense, seeing as he comes from Genabackis. There were a couple of slip-ups though with the Letherii using that name.

2) Korlat should definitely have recognised Paran if she recognised the others. I don't remember the scene in tCG where she doesn't recognise him though.

3) I'm fairly sure the term "regulars" was used before this book, though can't be certain. But the regulars being a faceless mass wasn't a mistake. Erikson was making a point with them that these heretofore unmentioned characters, who have just been seen marching by in the background, have performed their own small acts of heroism as noticed by Tavore in her closing speech. I found it funny that even that late in the day, Blistig still didn't have faith in her being able to motivate her troops.

[Daydreamer]

Lister of Smeg, on 08 March 2011 - 10:01 PM, said:

2) Korlat should definitely have recognised Paran if she recognised the others. I don't remember the scene in tCG where she doesn't recognise him though.

There's mention of her seeing 'a man and a woman- possibly siblings'. Tavore and Ganoes, of course. So it doesn't specifically say she doesn't recognise him (possibly she just isn't paying attention) but it is weird given how many other characters are named there. Including Kalam, who I can't recall if she should know or not right now.

Personally, I really enjoyed the sudden recognition of the previously faceless regulars. Thought it was a great touch.

I think I noticed a genuine mistake early on. Isn't Gall's eldest son's wife referred to as Gilk several times? Which makes no sense. But later Semk is used so I guess that's a mistake that never got noticed.

[D'rek]

Daydreamer, on 08 March 2011 - 10:16 PM, said:

I think I noticed a genuine mistake early on. Isn't Gall's eldest son's wife referred to as Gilk several times? Which makes no sense. But later Semk is used so I guess that's a mistake that never got noticed.

Isn't that two different people? Gall's son's wife is either Gilk or Semk and Shelemassa is the other, or something like that?

There's also a Bonehunter in Urb's new squad that was Semk.

[Sinisdar Toste]

D, on 08 March 2011 - 10:22 PM, said:

Daydreamer, on 08 March 2011 - 10:16 PM, said:

I think I noticed a genuine mistake early on. Isn't Gall's eldest son's wife referred to as Gilk several times? Which makes no sense. But later Semk is used so I guess that's a mistake that never got noticed.

Isn't that two different people? Gall's son's wife is either Gilk or Semk and Shelemassa is the other, or something like that?

There's also a Bonehunter in Urb's new squad that was Semk.

jastara (the widow in question) is consistently referred to as gilk. and it isn't all that hard to believe, as we don't know how long the khundryl were in bolkando before they started a war. could have been for the entirety of the lether invasion and subsequent sitting around in letheras. plenty of time for the gilk and the khundryl to mix.

semk only pops up a couple times, and always in relation to urbs new squad.

regulars has been used all over the place as it is basically a synonym for medium infantry. way back in NoK, temper is referring to regulars. i don't see how this is a mistake.

but korlat indeed should have recognized the master of the deck, she was there at the birth of his card after all. and the sudden inexplicable adoption of teblor across the board was very strange. it's like karsa's presence engenders some kind of subliminal mental innoculation - maybe cuz he's so badass? this would be one for a future Q&A i'd say.

[Daydreamer]

Sinisdar Toste, on 09 March 2011 - 02:21 AM, said:

D, on 08 March 2011 - 10:22 PM, said:

Daydreamer, on 08 March 2011 - 10:16 PM, said:

I think I noticed a genuine mistake early on. Isn't Gall's eldest son's wife referred to as Gilk several times? Which makes no sense. But later Semk is used so I guess that's a mistake that never got noticed.

Isn't that two different people? Gall's son's wife is either Gilk or Semk and Shelemassa is the other, or something like that?

There's also a Bonehunter in Urb's new squad that was Semk.

jastara (the widow in question) is consistently referred to as gilk. and it isn't all that hard to believe, as we don't know how long the khundryl were in bolkando before they started a war. could have been for the entirety of the lether invasion and subsequent sitting around in letheras. plenty of time for the gilk and the khundryl to mix.

semk only pops up a couple times, and always in relation to urbs new squad.

The Crippled God, p.581 (beginning of chapter 20):

A knife pressed hard against his cheek. Jastara's voice hissed in his ear. 'If you do not go to her now, Gall, I will kill you myself.'
I cannot.
'For the coward you are, I will kill you. Do you hear me, Gall? I will make your screams drown out the world - even your wife's cries - or do you forget? I am Semk'

I got the impression that the timeline ruled out an inter-marriage between the Khundryl and the Gilk but I could definitely be wrong about that. And, anyway, I know the timeline isn't the best thing to base an argument on.

[Sinisdar Toste]

Daydreamer, on 09 March 2011 - 06:12 PM, said:

Sinisdar Toste, on 09 March 2011 - 02:21 AM, said:

D, on 08 March 2011 - 10:22 PM, said:

Daydreamer, on 08 March 2011 - 10:16 PM, said:

I think I noticed a genuine mistake early on. Isn't Gall's eldest son's wife referred to as Gilk several times? Which makes no sense. But later Semk is used so I guess that's a mistake that never got noticed.

Isn't that two different people? Gall's son's wife is either Gilk or Semk and Shelemassa is the other, or something like that?

There's also a Bonehunter in Urb's new squad that was Semk.

jastara (the widow in question) is consistently referred to as gilk. and it isn't all that hard to believe, as we don't know how long the khundryl were in bolkando before they started a war. could have been for the entirety of the lether invasion and subsequent sitting around in letheras. plenty of time for the gilk and the khundryl to mix.

semk only pops up a couple times, and always in relation to urbs new squad.

The Crippled God, p.581 (beginning of chapter 20):

A knife pressed hard against his cheek. Jastara's voice hissed in his ear. 'If you do not go to her now, Gall, I will kill you myself.'
I cannot.
'For the coward you are, I will kill you. Do you hear me, Gall? I will make your screams drown out the world - even your wife's cries - or do you forget? I am Semk'

I got the impression that the timeline ruled out an inter-marriage between the Khundryl and the Gilk but I could definitely be wrong about that. And, anyway, I know the timeline isn't the best thing to base an argument on.

i'd actually just got to that page in my reread and was coming here to post on it. coincidence?? anyhow, it's my feeling that in this instance it is a typo, cuz everywhere else, Jastara is referred to as Gilk. though it seems my memory may not be the best thing to base an argument on either

[D'rek]

Ah, I see. Typo I guess, then, as the notion of a Semk pretending to be a Gilk Barghast to a tribe of Khundryl (who would know plenty about the Semk) is rather farfetched.

Re Teblor: need to go back and re-read the sections of Karsa and Ublala Pung's meeting. There might have been a "this man is a Teblor. Teblor do not kneel!" or something like that, and Ublala did "pass word" on to the islands, so it's not inconceivable for Karsa's time in Letheras to have lead to the Tarthenal's name change.

[Daydreamer]

Re Jastara: I think I'll take it that she's Semk and the earlier references (I don't think there are that amny of them) are a mistake due to SE being more used to writing Gilk at the time. I don't suppose it matters.

Re Teblor: If I have the right bit (Karsa and Ublala only speak once, right?) then Toblakai is mostly used but Karsa does say he is 'Toblakai and Teblor'. So I guess the possibility is there.

[Abyss]

Jastara and the Gilk/Semk thing is the only overt error i can think of.

Karsa was around Leth long enough to convince the Tarthenal to change their name and everyone els eto adopt it. At least, that's my story and i'm sticking to it.

'Why didn't character X do this another way?' isn't a mistake. Its the author's choice for the purpose of the story, however the author views it. The reader can disagree, but it's not a mistake in the Gilk/Semk sense.

Either one of those works, btw. The Khundryl were from 7C and active in Bolkado. The Gilk were from Genebackis and active in Bolkado, but as mercenaries they could have gone anywhere. The Semk were from 7C.


- Abyss, also notes that in the DRAMATIC PERSONAE at the end THE SNAKE apprently ate THE SHAKE.

[SuperSapper]

1) Why do the Forkrul Assail have bluish blood in Dust of Dreams, but red blood in the Crippled God?


from dust of dreams

Quote

...the Forkrul Assail shifted his stance, lifting his hands. 'One way or another, I will know you, mortal.'
'Yes, you will.'
Repose attacked, his hands a blur. But those deadly weapons cut empty air, as Yedan was suddenly behind the Forkrul Assail,
sword chopping into the back of the creature's elongated legs, the iron edge cutting between each leg's two hinged knees,
severing the buried tendons - Repose toppled forward, arms flailing.
Yedan chopped down a second time, cutting off the Assail's left arm. Blue, thin blood sprayed on to the ground.

Quote

...this shout burst from him in shock - three enormous, hulking, black-skinned demons were on the road just beyond the dead horse.
One of them held a club of driftwood that looked like a drummer's baton in its huge hands, and was using it to pound down some more on a mangled, crushed corpse.
The other two followed the blows as if gauging the effects of each and every crushing impact.
Bluish blood had sprayed out on the road, along with other less identifiable discharges from the pulped ruin of their victim's body.
In a low voice Sandalath said, 'Your Nachts - the Jaghut were inveterate jokers. Hah hah. That was a Forkrul Assail.

from the crippled god

Quote

The Forkrul Assail collapsed in red ruin.

Quote

...he saw the Forkrul Assail cease his attacks, saw the man look up.
And then the swarm plunged down in an eveloping cloud, a
storm of wings that suddenly blossomed crimson...the locusts formed a seething pillar,
which fell as the body it shrouded toppled to one side. Flashes of red gristle, of pink bone, and then the
creatures were lifting away on their wings, rushing into the Kolansii
infantry...

2) And why was Corporal Honey a male in Dust of Dreams and Reaper's Gale, but female in the Crippled God?

from Dust of Dreams

Quote

Badan pointed at the now cowering garrison guards. 'No move now.' And then he twisted in his saddle to glare at Honey and Skim.
In Malazan he said, 'Don't even think about reloading! Shit-brained sappers!'
'Sorry,' said Skim, 'I guess we both just sort've . . . twitched.'And she shrugged.
Honey handed her his crossbow and dropped down from his horse. 'I'll retrieve the quarrels - anybody see where they ended up?'

from the Crippled God

Quote

Sinter looked across at her sister. Their eyes briefly locked. Just past Kisswhere, Corporal Rim
sat hunched over, rubbing oil into the stump of his right arm. He made no sign of listening, but
she knew he was. Same for Honey, lying shrouded under stained linen to keep the sun from her eyes.

[tiam]

SuperSapper, on 10 March 2011 - 10:25 PM, said:

1) Why do the Forkrul Assail have bluish blood in Dust of Dreams, but red blood in the Crippled God?


from dust of dreams

Quote

...the Forkrul Assail shifted his stance, lifting his hands. 'One way or another, I will know you, mortal.'
'Yes, you will.'
Repose attacked, his hands a blur. But those deadly weapons cut empty air, as Yedan was suddenly behind the Forkrul Assail,
sword chopping into the back of the creature's elongated legs, the iron edge cutting between each leg's two hinged knees,
severing the buried tendons - Repose toppled forward, arms flailing.
Yedan chopped down a second time, cutting off the Assail's left arm. Blue, thin blood sprayed on to the ground.

Quote

...this shout burst from him in shock - three enormous, hulking, black-skinned demons were on the road just beyond the dead horse.
One of them held a club of driftwood that looked like a drummer's baton in its huge hands, and was using it to pound down some more on a mangled, crushed corpse.
The other two followed the blows as if gauging the effects of each and every crushing impact.
Bluish blood had sprayed out on the road, along with other less identifiable discharges from the pulped ruin of their victim's body.
In a low voice Sandalath said, 'Your Nachts - the Jaghut were inveterate jokers. Hah hah. That was a Forkrul Assail.

from the crippled god

Quote

The Forkrul Assail collapsed in red ruin.

Quote

...he saw the Forkrul Assail cease his attacks, saw the man look up.
And then the swarm plunged down in an eveloping cloud, a
storm of wings that suddenly blossomed crimson...the locusts formed a seething pillar,
which fell as the body it shrouded toppled to one side. Flashes of red gristle, of pink bone, and then the
creatures were lifting away on their wings, rushing into the Kolansii
infantry...

2) And why was Corporal Honey a male in Dust of Dreams and Reaper's Gale, but female in the Crippled God?

from Dust of Dreams

Quote

Badan pointed at the now cowering garrison guards. 'No move now.' And then he twisted in his saddle to glare at Honey and Skim.
In Malazan he said, 'Don't even think about reloading! Shit-brained sappers!'
'Sorry,' said Skim, 'I guess we both just sort've . . . twitched.'And she shrugged.
Honey handed her his crossbow and dropped down from his horse. 'I'll retrieve the quarrels - anybody see where they ended up?'

from the Crippled God

Quote

Sinter looked across at her sister. Their eyes briefly locked. Just past Kisswhere, Corporal Rim
sat hunched over, rubbing oil into the stump of his right arm. He made no sign of listening, but
she knew he was. Same for Honey, lying shrouded under stained linen to keep the sun from her eyes.

As for the FA im gonna go and suggest that the FA killed by the watch were watered rather than Pure. This explains the blood...honest...

That corporal Honey one could just be a typo and SE could have simply assumed hed made Honey a female in DoD and changed it by accident in TCG. Tbh it doesnt have a patch on Orfantal

[D'rek]

tiam, on 10 March 2011 - 10:33 PM, said:

That corporal Honey one could just be a typo and SE could have simply assumed hed made Honey a female in DoD and changed it by accident in TCG. Tbh it doesnt have a patch on Orfantal

Goes well with Balgrid changing from a master of Meanas to a necromancer, and Saltlick teleporting in RG


There's one mis-step that stands above all others though - no Aragan

[Iamme]

It was Spax chief Gilk who first used the word Teblor. He was Genabackan afterall.

[tiam]

I actually dont think the Teblor thing is that big of a deal given Karsas presence likely leading to the Islander renaming themselves. It seems the original tribe that Hull Beddict came across considered themselves Tarthenal and thats what the Letherii called them but doesnt really affect anyone else.

[Bauchelain the Evil]

Also at one point one of the new Unbound (not Nom Kala) is called the half-Trell. However if I recall correctly the half-Trell was Ulag Togtil, who remained with Tool and was then killed by Calm.

[Harvester]

Serenity having a history with Malazans? As far as I know Serenity was trapped on the continent of Lether, then freed by Letherii soldiers and and then thrown into a well by our farming demon friends.

Where the hell was Twilight's Shake company (last seen in RG)? : D

[Tatterdemalion]

Whys is 'Nenanda' in the glossary as 'Nemanda'?

Also - if he, like, the only one of that group who can't semble into a dragon? In TtH all of them turning into dragons probably would have been useful killing clip and flying to meet Anomander. I know the blood would drive them crazy and they probably couldn't control the chaos, or something, but Rud Elalle seemed to veer a few times at a young age and been fine - granted with Silchas' tutilege.

Eh, that's all I can thunk up.

[Abyss]

Bauchelain the Evil, on 11 March 2011 - 07:12 PM, said:

Also at one point one of the new Unbound (not Nom Kala) is called the half-Trell. However if I recall correctly the half-Trell was Ulag Togtil, who remained with Tool and was then killed by Calm.

Iirc, that's two different Imass.... one was an original Unbound and one was one of Tool's later crowd who joined them then buggered off to get re-killed by Calm.

[Agraba]

This isn't as much a mistake as it is just a hilarious typo, but in the Dramatis Personae at the end, all the Shake are listed under the header "The Snake", right under Badalle and crew. It must be because Erickson looked at that header haphazardly and didn't notice the "N", or though "Hell, that's close enough to the word 'Shake', I don't need a new header."