Malazan Empire: So what do you think of NoK? - Malazan Empire

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So what do you think of NoK?

#61 User is offline   The Drum 

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Posted 02 December 2008 - 01:32 PM

I finished NoK LATE last night, you now when your near the end of a book and want to finish it so you plough on until the end.

Overall I quite enjoyed this one, it was good to look back over events that you already now the outcome off but didn't really know what happened.

I thought Temper was a good character and loved his flash-backs to the last night of the Sword. Though I still don't understand what Dancer wanted Temper to do?

it was also nice to find out a bit about tayschren, I haven't read RotCG or TtH yet but up to now i didn't really think much of him.

Kiska just got on my nerves, why the hell nobody just killed her is beyond me.

The ending with the old fisherman and kids intrigued me, maybe theres more to come on the subject of the Riders?
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#62 User is offline   Stefan 

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Posted 25 February 2009 - 10:39 AM

I'm almost to chapter five and my current impressions are very positive. I can wholeheartedly say both Ian and Steve are pretty much equals when it comes to their literary talent, both better than the other in some areas. And from what I can tell by the book so far, I'd like to see it in some sort of graphic novel format. Considering how fast-paced it is and how it takes place a little bit over a night, with the added flashbacks for variety, I think of all the Malazan books it would be the best fit for an adaptation. Then again, graphic adaptations of Steve's novellas would be sweet as well.
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#63 User is offline   waydoug 

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Posted 27 February 2009 - 12:38 AM

Sorry, but I wasn't that crazy about it. With Steve's writing it all flows so smoothly, but I found with NoK, it was too...choppy.
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#64 User is offline   Cowl's Disciple 

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Posted 28 February 2009 - 01:18 AM

View Postwaydoug, on Feb 27 2009, 10:38 AM, said:

Sorry, but I wasn't that crazy about it. With Steve's writing it all flows so smoothly, but I found with NoK, it was too...choppy.


I agree, although I found that ICE had improved alot with RotCG. :whistle:
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#65 User is offline   QuickSam 

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Posted 16 June 2009 - 02:56 AM

I finished it yesterday. I hadnt really thought about reading it, but saw it in the local library so grabbed. I have already read books 1-8 by Erikson and return of the Crimson Guard by ICE, so i was a bit hesitant about reading it. But i found that reading about "The Rise of Shadowthrone " was immensely rewarding. Kinda like a Malazan Begins way of reading about it. Although if i had to read them all again i would have read it before the Return of the Crmson Guard.

Overall thoroughly enjoyed it. It was not standard filler for money that we've seen in the past with other authors, but really interesting, standing by its own to introduce us to events that otherwise would only be guessed at.

Now can we please have Dust of Dreams as i am out of Malazan books to read.

p.s. Every part of the book that had Temper in it was un-friggin-believable! What a great character and immaculately written.
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#66 User is offline   Pilgrim 

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 04:17 PM

I just finished NoK and thought it was a great first effort. I can't say I "loved" it, and it really opened up more questions than answers for me. That said, I felt the same way after reading RotCG the first time, but on re-read, thought it was incredible. Now I'm wanting to know more about what happened to the characters in the years between the two. Need more books! Agree with above, Dust of Dreams and Stonewielder can't come too soon.
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#67 User is offline   Ain't_It_Just_ 

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Posted 07 July 2009 - 04:19 AM

NoK was too slow, in my opinion. It was hard to keep track of everything for some reason, and all these characters we didn't know the names of annoyed me. But I enjoyed it overall.
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#68 User is offline   koryk 

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 12:32 AM

Just over halfway through NoK, and I like the feel of the book. The writing is brief but poetic, a bit like David Gemmell. I do agree that it is a bit choppy, and a bit confusing at times - you are never sure who is fighting for whom. On a separate note, why did Temper just walk off with Corinn, after going through all the hardships to get to the heart of the goings on? He should have stayed and chosen a side. Nevertheless, very promising.
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#69 User is offline   maro 

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Posted 02 February 2010 - 12:25 AM

I finished it last night and enjoyed it immensely.

I found no problems with his writing stlye - it's just different to SEs. If anything, I'd say ICE writes better on the the micro scale and SE better on the macro. ICE's fight scenes are much more in depth than SE - more Posted Image

I've read DoD and now just have to read RoTCG - it appears that both are adept at leaving pointers to past events that will never really be written about (Fall of 7 Cities, Kellanved's origins and the dwelling in the Deadhouse).
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#70 User is offline   Gladius 

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 10:36 AM

Unlike most NoK was my first Malazan novel, so when I read it about 3 weeks ago, I hadnt yet read any Erikson. I think it let me judge Esselmont's work fairly ( meaning I never had the need to compare the 2 authors ). Ive since read GotM, as well as Blood Follows, The Lee's of Laughters End, and The Healthy Dead. I found myself enjoying all of them for different reasons, so I dont believe I will spend any time comparing the 2 authors because Im desperately, greedily searching for more Malazan material to burn into my brain. Night of Knives is the perfect place to start as far as Im concerned, it left me prepared to tackle GotM with little or no confusion as to affiliation, and mythology. If it had a drawback it would have to be that Esselmont left me with a distinctly different character assesment of Tayschrenn, than Erikson did. Im not saying it was a mistake, just that it confused me somewhat, the sad , yet wonderful fact is that I still have alot more reading to do. On that note I will continue my quest in search of that piece of forgotten lore known as Dead House Gates.
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#71 User is offline   Juvenis 

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 08:13 PM

Whoa, I can see how reading NoK first would be all right (its more chronological really) though of course it still seems weird to me. But you read the three novellas before even meeting those guys in MoI? Man, I wonder what thats like...

You are in for so much epic-ness! I think its really hard for you to be able to compare Esselmont and Erikson yet though. I know you've read the three novellas and Gardens, but the novellas are way different, and most of us agree that Gardens is definitely a first novel (know what I mean?) But I think it'll be really cool to see how you will perceive things. So stick around!
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#72 User is offline   Gladius 

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 09:30 PM

View PostJuvenis, on 15 February 2010 - 08:13 PM, said:

Whoa, I can see how reading NoK first would be all right (its more chronological really) though of course it still seems weird to me. But you read the three novellas before even meeting those guys in MoI? Man, I wonder what thats like...

You are in for so much epic-ness! I think its really hard for you to be able to compare Esselmont and Erikson yet though. I know you've read the three novellas and Gardens, but the novellas are way different, and most of us agree that Gardens is definitely a first novel (know what I mean?) But I think it'll be really cool to see how you will perceive things. So stick around!


Well I was at a book sale, NoK, GotM, and the three novellas were all they had left. Funny I stumbled here on a whim.
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#73 User is offline   Defiance 

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 03:43 AM

I'm only 75 pages in, just started it today, but so far I love it. There's not a whole lot going on, but I'm fine with it - it's more time in the world of Malazan, plus is telling one of the most alluded to events in the SE books. The only criticism I have so far is the idiotic, stereotypical guard, Eli, in the Hanged Man. Luckily he got what he deserved, but I thought his whole thing with the knife and going to stab Faro was a bit overdone.

I really like Temper right now, although mostly because I'm waiting for another Y'Ghatan flashback with Dassem. Also anticipating Kiska running into Dancer, perhaps with Kellanved as well. That should be awesome, if it happens. ST and Cotillion are some of my favorite characters.

Probably have it finished by Friday, so I'll post my final thoughts then.
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#74 User is offline   Defiance 

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 09:27 PM

Okay, just finished, and it was pretty good. I could have done with someone more interesting than the Kiska character, but oh well. For me the most interesting parts were Temper's flashbacks to Dassem, learning more about Tayschrenn in general, and finding out more or less exactly what happened with K&D.
uhm, that should be 'stuff.' My stiff is never nihilistic.
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#75 User is online   worry 

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 12:17 AM

I didn't dislike Kiska but she was definitely a tourist character...But it was actually kind of neat to have a witness to the action rather than a participant, even if she was too much of a plucky heroine type, just because she was often as wowed or impressed by the events as the reader might be. Also since there was a pretty conscious choice to limit the POVs in this one, she was kinda necessary.

Temper hearkened back a little to Strings, the vet with his head down, and was definitely the heart of the book.

The Stormriders vs. island mages storyline was the only one that was a little undercooked--at least in terms of screen time--but it also felt like ICE trusted readers to use their brains a bit here in terms of putting some pieces together. We already know we're gonna be left with more questions than answers, that what's happening now is rooted in some pretty murky history, and that there are plenty of awesome characters who aren't the answers to MBotF's major mysteries...by which I mean, we all wanna know about Grizzin Farl, but there's plenty of one-book characters with their own lives and powers and histories that aren't gonna patch up the other unknowns. So more mundane answers for say who Obo is aren't gonna satisfy the big questions, but they're pretty cool nonetheless. I guess I'm saying that during the time before the MBotF, there's actually plenty of more compact-but-awesome GRRM-scope historical intrigue stories that COULD be told about the Seven Cities or Kellanved's Old Guard.
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#76 User is offline   Thel Akai 

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Posted 22 October 2010 - 10:08 AM

I liked the story, but there were a few weak spots in the story-telling itself which in my opinion an editor should have been able to point out so that the author could fix them. For example, relatively early on Kiska is having a flashback, but I had to read through that part three times and was still not sure if what I read was part of the flashback or not - simply due to the way it was written. It became clear only at the end of the flashback just because the step back to 'now' was so obvious.

Later, Kiska realized some major sorcery was going on.. but _why_ did she realize that? It's not really clear. Not the fog, because that had been going on for a while and I don't believe she referred to that - she understood right away that that wasn't natural. I figured eventually it must have been because there were some trees visible in one direction, and this was supposed to be inside a tree-less city. The images the author paints for us are not always well painted.

When re-reading the book (as I will do at one point, something I do with almost all good books) the above will not be problematic of course, so I don't know - maybe the editor had been reading so many revisions that the problems I mentioned wouldn't be so visible.

And finally, as with RoTG, there's a lot of flinching going on when people are talking.. :)
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#77 User is offline   Severian 

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 05:59 PM

İ liked the book, there are some questions about stormriders and kiska looked somewhat unnecessary characther to me, but overall i enjoyed it nonetheless
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#78 User is offline   Ceda Cicero 

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Posted 28 December 2010 - 04:34 PM

Finally got around to this one. I hardly touched any of ICE's books on my first read-thru of the MBotF. Picked up RotCG and read about 1/4 of it after tBH but I really had a hard time sticking with it. Now, as I re-read the entire series, I'm sequencing ICE's books in in their correct placement. So far I'm halfwya through NoK and really enjoying it, much, much more than I enjoyed what I read of RotCG and way more than I expected to in general. I love the spooky atmosphere with buildings fading in and out, fog cover, hounds howling, etc, etc. All in all I'm pleased with ICE's writing as well - many of the mechanical issues that hurt my eyes in RotCG just don't seem to be here for me, which is odd given the publication order (though, wasn't RotCG technically written first? Or did I dream that up?)

There are issues, of course. ICE latches on to certain words the same way SE does but for some reason it doesn't irk me nearly as much with SE. I'm going to scream if I read "opalescent" one more time.

Unlike some other posters here, I quite enjoy Kiska's character and development in this book. I will say, however, that while I enjoy her as a character, I feel she could've gotten better treatment. Mostly so far her arc has been 1.) Kiska goes to point A while reflecting on how much she doesn't want to live on Malaz Isle 2.) Kiska arrives at Point A and gets knocked out/trussed up/scorned 3.) Kiska regains consciousness/escapes/wanders off 4.) Return to part 1 of cycle.

All in all though I have few complaints, and think that finally getting around to NoK will make grappling with RotCG again a lot easier.

This post has been edited by Ciceronian: 28 December 2010 - 04:36 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 07 April 2011 - 08:37 PM, said:

How do you rape a cave? Do you ask, "You want to fuck, yes?" hear the echo come back, "Yes... es... es..." and get your barnacle-gouged groove on?

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#79 User is offline   Helius 

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Posted 19 January 2011 - 05:52 AM

Just finished reading NoK and quite enjoyed it , yes there are a few questions left to me what real part do the stormriders play? but then again the whole series has me with questions there was a much more even flow of events and characters comparing to RoTC, no complaints about kiska...well in reality my only complaint it was a bit too short ...seeing i have nothing else to read till TCG comes out...
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#80 User is offline   Orlion 

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Posted 26 January 2011 - 06:40 PM

I really enjoyed this one. The only complaint I have is that you still don't entirely know how Kelevendad and Dancer ascend (specifics, anyway), but I got over that. I really liked Kiska as a point of view character and Temper with his background was just amazing.
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