[caladanbrood]

It's a question of concentration. Obviously outside, the smoke spreads out so much that it has negliable effect. But that takes a while, and if you have three or four people standing in the door smoking, you're gonna get a high concentration of smoke there while they're doing it, obviously. This is hardly the same as walking through a group of fat smelly people, health-wise Obviously once would make no difference, but if you work at that pub, and have to walk through it 6 or 8 times a day, there will be an appreciable effect over time.

[cerveza_fiesta]

 caladanbrood, on Aug 7 2009, 03:39 PM, said:

It's a question of concentration. Obviously outside, the smoke spreads out so much that it has negliable effect. But that takes a while, and if you have three or four people standing in the door smoking, you're gonna get a high concentration of smoke there while they're doing it, obviously. This is hardly the same as walking through a group of fat smelly people, health-wise Obviously once would make no difference, but if you work at that pub, and have to walk through it 6 or 8 times a day, there will be an appreciable effect over time.

I guess that's my argument. I equate outdoor second-hand smoke with walking through a group of fat smelly people. Mildly irritating or disturbing, but no physical harm.

I'd just like to see what the quantitative effect of walking through the smoke outdoors. If you're walking through it 6 or 8 times a day, say the front door of your office. Just a "for-instance".

Now say those smokers are huddled near the door and are all puffing smoke directly into the path of anybody leaving or entering. There is a light breeze. For the 10 seconds it takes to enter and then exit the "smoke zone" this adds up to a maximum of about 80 seconds of exposure per day to the unfortunate nonsmoker.

Toxicity is governed by concentration and duration of exposure primarily. In the light breeze -- which is a minimum wind case, cause in the real world there's always some movement of air -- the smoke particles and chemicals diffuse very quickly, reducing the concentration. Duration-wise you're getting the equivalent of about 80 seconds, or about 15-20 total inhalations (based on 13 breaths per minute if I recall as an average...maybe a bit more if you're walking around). So very low duration and reduced concentration compared to the indoor second-hand smoke case.

Add to that the fact that your body is constantly filtering toxins, which at low levels do negligible damage to your overall condition...so 80 seconds of exposure divided into 10 second installments over the course of a day is much less damaging overall than 80 seconds of continuous exposure to the same concentration level.

Still don't see it hurting anybody. Truly I don't.

Is there a major flaw with my logic? Maybe bashing outdoor smokers is just one of the baby steps we need to get a totally smoke free society. It just doesn't make any kind of logical sense to me. It looks good and feels right to do, but is anybody doing it for a scientific reason or just because it makes them feel good to bash an evil smoker?

[caladanbrood]

If smokers can't work out what they're doing is dumb on their own, us lot have to bash it into them, screw science

i.e. no, I don't have any quantitive information on it...

[Obdigore]

It has been proven that smoking, even second hand smoke, is harmful.

Can you prove that walking through it for 10 seconds a time, 8 times a day, 5 days a week is too little to be harmful?

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

If I have a minute later I will try to find that article I read, or one like it.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

It's official. I went to the casino last night, where I normally smoke at least two packs, to watch UFC and didn't cave. Zero smoking. I am unstoppable. No more smoking for me, this was my last big test.

[Darkwatch]

Rock on RLY!

Good to hear your succeeding.
How are you feeling otherwise?

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

 Darkwatch, on Aug 9 2009, 02:02 PM, said:

Rock on RLY!

Good to hear your succeeding.
How are you feeling otherwise?

Fine, I suppose.

[Darkwatch]

Well good to see the withdrawal isn't hitting you hard.

[Slow Ben]

Nice job RLY!

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

 Darkwatch, on Aug 9 2009, 02:38 PM, said:

Well good to see the withdrawal isn't hitting you hard.

It's been a month, so the physical withdrawals are gone. It's all mental at this point. When the cravings hit though, they hit hard. The only thing that saves me is my zero tolerance policy. If I allowed myself to sneak one every now and then I would be smoking again no doubt.

[caladanbrood]

Well done RLY, casino sounded tough

[HoosierDaddy]

The fact that you don't drink often should help immeasurably. It is at times of lessened inhibitions that quitters are most likely to give in. And, why it is so hard for "social smokers" to just give in all-together. Keep on keeping on, buddy!

[cerveza_fiesta]

good jeorb RLY. Your zero tolerance thing is a good mindset.

I got the wifey on board with me so she'll help by nagging.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Another thing that helps is to tall as many people as you can that you are quitting, and then brag that there is no way you will fail. If you do it enough, the embarrassment of having to fess up the next time you see them if you cheat will be greater than the temporary joy of having a smoke. On Saturday at the casino, when my wil power was slipping, I called my mom and told her I had quit. She was so happy she nearly started crying. I couldn't very well go buy a pack of smokes after that, now could I?

[Darkwatch]

 Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Aug 10 2009, 04:25 PM, said:

I called my mom and told her I had quit. She was so happy she nearly started crying. I couldn't very well go buy a pack of smokes after that, now could I?

Excellent strategy that.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

 Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Aug 10 2009, 07:01 AM, said:

It's official. I went to the casino last night, where I normally smoke at least two packs, to watch UFC and didn't cave. Zero smoking. I am unstoppable. No more smoking for me, this was my last big test.

Hell yeah! When you don't have a huge internal war happening, that's a great sign.

Don't let us down now RLY...if you do, your mother will take you from us

[Mezla PigDog]

I like to imagine RLY enjoying his 30th cigarette of the day while he posts in this thread.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

 Ain't_It_Just_, on Aug 10 2009, 11:49 PM, said:

 Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Aug 10 2009, 07:01 AM, said:

It's official. I went to the casino last night, where I normally smoke at least two packs, to watch UFC and didn't cave. Zero smoking. I am unstoppable. No more smoking for me, this was my last big test.

Hell yeah! When you don't have a huge internal war happening, that's a great sign.

Don't let us down now RLY...if you do, your mother will take you from us

Oh, there was a massive iinternal war. I almost went home before the fights started because I didn't know if I even wanted to sit there and watch them without smoking. Once i stopped feeling sorry for myself though it was fine.

My parents are seriously pumped about this. Me smoking has always been the only thing we ever fought about, since my grandfather almost died from lung cancer. I'm 30 years old and still hiding my smokes before pulling up to my parents house. Ridiculous. Part of the reason to quit actually, sneaking a smoke at my parent's house made me feel like I was 16 again. It never would have been acceptable to smoke in front of them. If I screw this up and start smoking again, it's really going to make me look like an asshole.

[Abyss]

 Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Aug 9 2009, 06:31 PM, said:

It's been a month, so the physical withdrawals are gone. It's all mental at this point. When the cravings hit though, they hit hard. ...

Nice work. The craving thing lasts a while but eventually revulsion sets in.

I went a few years without. All the resturants and bars around went smoke free so i lost all tolerance to be in a smoking environment (seriously, a recent trip to Vegas was brutal in the casinos). A friend was in a particularly dire situation and I was doing the 'sit and listen' thing and took one just to have something to do and damned near fell over with nausea after a couple of inhales.

- Abyss, now needs to work on the gummi bear problem...