[Galain]

Okay I'm going to bed for real this time.

[Silanah]

So for Mockra's benefit, I am quoting the stuff that makes him look decidedly scummy from my point of view:

Right, its day 2, we have 20 something hours left in the day and Mockra had pinged my radar earlier when he ignored a question I asked earlier, so he gets on, posts and you can all see how it went here:

Mockra, on Jun 24 2009, 01:26 PM, said:

Silanah, on Jun 24 2009, 08:06 PM, said:

Mockra, on Jun 24 2009, 04:30 AM, said:

Wow 5 votes on Rashan already... Im all for the Rashan lynch but im not placing a vote right now as it would be at l-4 in just a few hours...
@Kaschan, Yeah Korlat hasn't said much but you should always give the benefit of the doubt on the first day..

So in other words a cop out, you want to go for the easiest target?
And tbh I have looked over your posts and besides misunderstanding the mechanics, you have agreed with someone else's case and you have given no reasons why you would vote for Rashan.

:avote: Mockra

Well first of all if I wanted to go for the easist target, I would have placed a vote but I wanted speculation first..
Secondly, you must be pretty stupid if you think I need to point out the obvious... he voted night, why do I need to restate the obvious..
I find it a little weird that you would go after me rather than one of the people who hoped aboard the train in the early votes considering I didn't even place one.
For now I am going to place my vote on him as he voted night... happy?
Vote Rashan

Now the scummiest thing about this is that the expected response of an innocent is usually to tell the person harrassing them (in this case me) to sod off, he didn't instead he panicked, he cited possibly the worst reason for voting Rashan, tried to make it seem like I had forced his hand in voting and voted.

Mockra, on Jun 25 2009, 04:24 AM, said:

Damn forum downs...
Wow I wasn't expecting all this talk about me from my one post while I was checking in...
I didn't vote under pressure... I voted as I found him to be the best candidate earlier and others didn't seem to hesitate. Why should putting him at l-3 be a bad thing from my position.. its not like i am hammering him with 20 hours left. The reason I placed my vote is that I was hoping for a speed lynch on the inevitable target so the 2 infected players in play would die from not having their vote on a specific alt if that power is currently in effect. The fact that 2 people jumped on my is beginning to make me think that there is the DG forcing them to do so which gives me much more suspicions of Sil. It seems not many of you realized that I made a post with a vote that I said I would place earlier and you all begin talking about me over reacting...
Im going to leave my vote where it is and we still have 7 hours with Rash at L-2.
Copy pasta

Note the underlined bit, no he didn't panic, he just wanted a speed lynch in the hopes that we might kill 2 infected in the process.
Then he claims that the 2 jumping on him must be infected, compelled to do so and then he tries to implicate me as something.

I find these 2 posts to be the most telling as there is contradiction and a very panicked reaction from a single vote and most of his earlier posts were very lazy going with the flow posts. Which looks to me like someone trying to hide in plain site.


And after those the rest of his posts have him going on about how he is sure the infected have been compelled and how he suspects people who keep moving their votes. Especially those moving their votes from Rashan.

[Silanah]

And I am all alone now

[Mockra]

Ok so it seems I need to repeat myself, fantastic
I said I was going to vote for him earlier, why is it so weird that I did it then? I only left my vote off as I wanted to get a little more discussion in but during that time there were more votes so I don't see why I wasn't allowed to keep mine off... it had nothing to do with Sil's vote on me, I only wanted to get my vote in before I went offline again. If you see my posting times, I wasn't online for several hours after that so I wanted the inevitable lynch of Rashan to be over with and hopefully if a speed lynch occurred, infected would die due to not voting as needed. Its not a fact that I wanted a speed lynch, its a fact that I wanted to place a vote and in the occurrence of a speed lynch, we would have taken down the infected if the power was in effect. What if I hadn't quoted Silanah when I made that post, would anyone say anything about it then? Me placing that vote before I left I was going to do before I even read up to that post as I saw that Barg had voted.
As to your comment of my being suspicious of people moving votes, why not? Is that to say you are not suspicious of people moving their votes off a clear lynch target? We have to be aware of the off votes if lynch targets are not clear and watch to see who may be compelled...

Edit: Typos

This post has been edited by Mockra: 26 June 2009 - 08:00 AM

[Mockra]

1 User(s) are reading this topic (0 Guests and 1 Anonymous Users)
Great... offline for a while

[Emurlahn]

i am back, wow a four way split today. that is actually very worrying for going forward imo. As for the cases, the one on liosan is that he is playing too hard for the innos, well fuckadoodle thats just plain ridiculous to be fair. You cant penalise someone for not being scummy, how do you make the case, "here he could have said something scummy but instead he looks inno! he must be scummy!" sorry dont buy into that shit.

Kachan - linked quite heavily with another player and disappeared for a while. Possibly fake symping or paired or something was the accusation thrown out but its hardly compelling and pointing out pairs without voting means you are setting someone up for a night kill.

Which leads into hp - who doesnt really answe the accusations and seems to be playing totally differently now he is in the limelight.

And mockra - well there has been no response to the cases made at all beyond "i am inno" so for now my vote stays there, but if pushed i would vote for hp because he seems like a symp pointing to possible roled innos.

[Mockra]

Emurlahn, on Jun 26 2009, 09:20 PM, said:

i am back, wow a four way split today. that is actually very worrying for going forward imo. As for the cases, the one on liosan is that he is playing too hard for the innos, well fuckadoodle thats just plain ridiculous to be fair. You cant penalise someone for not being scummy, how do you make the case, "here he could have said something scummy but instead he looks inno! he must be scummy!" sorry dont buy into that shit.

Kachan - linked quite heavily with another player and disappeared for a while. Possibly fake symping or paired or something was the accusation thrown out but its hardly compelling and pointing out pairs without voting means you are setting someone up for a night kill.

Which leads into hp - who doesnt really answe the accusations and seems to be playing totally differently now he is in the limelight.

And mockra - well there has been no response to the cases made at all beyond "i am inno" so for now my vote stays there, but if pushed i would vote for hp because he seems like a symp pointing to possible roled innos.

Did you completely miss my post?..

[Emurlahn]

Mockra, on Jun 26 2009, 10:31 AM, said:

Emurlahn, on Jun 26 2009, 09:20 PM, said:

i am back, wow a four way split today. that is actually very worrying for going forward imo. As for the cases, the one on liosan is that he is playing too hard for the innos, well fuckadoodle thats just plain ridiculous to be fair. You cant penalise someone for not being scummy, how do you make the case, "here he could have said something scummy but instead he looks inno! he must be scummy!" sorry dont buy into that shit.

Kachan - linked quite heavily with another player and disappeared for a while. Possibly fake symping or paired or something was the accusation thrown out but its hardly compelling and pointing out pairs without voting means you are setting someone up for a night kill.

Which leads into hp - who doesnt really answe the accusations and seems to be playing totally differently now he is in the limelight.

And mockra - well there has been no response to the cases made at all beyond "i am inno" so for now my vote stays there, but if pushed i would vote for hp because he seems like a symp pointing to possible roled innos.

Did you completely miss my post?..

i guess i must of.

[Korlat]

Crap. Talk about long periods of inactivity (on my part)...

I really need to spend more time on this game, don't I?

Fak, most attention seems to be on Mockra and Hood's Path. I really don't see why HP is being focused on? Something about being a n00b...I'll have to go over the details. And Mockra is still our if-nothing-else-takes-off card, as yesterday, for general scum-like behaviour. And then there is HP's...poor attempt at diverting?...onto Liosan.

Alright, will read up on HP case.

[Eloth]

Liosan, on Jun 26 2009, 02:17 AM, said:

Eloth, on Jun 25 2009, 04:56 AM, said:

Ok, here's the two posts where I discussed infected revealing. My main point concerns the healer. As people pointed out this helps the scum more than the DG. At the end of the day it's still bad for town. The whole thing is a bit moot now since D'riss revealed, since whether or not he survives the night will probably decide how the infected play, rather than our views on the matter.

Eloth, on Jun 22 2009, 04:05 PM, said:

Woo, it seems I might be giving Ano a run for his money in the cool avatar category. Hah, take that you smug account tongue.gif

Healing the infected person before they are killed is a cool theory, but there are a couple of drawbacks to it. We dont know if we have a healer, it will be pretty obvious that the healer is dead when infected people start dying and it gives the killers free reign if they know who the healer is aiming for each night.

We really shouldnt get overly focused on the cult-like faction this game. With the mechanics laid out, a single transfer of recruiting power and the lack of a clear leader means they aren't the massive threat they usually are. I think hunting for killers and for the DG should both be equally important.

Eloth, on Jun 23 2009, 12:38 AM, said:

As interesting an idea as the infected constantly revealing is, there are several reasons they likely wont, which have been brought up before:

We dont know for a fact that we have a healer. The DG can kill whichever infected he feels isnt worth keeping around and a revealed infected would definitely classify in that category.
Even if we do have a healer, we are then forcing them to devote all their time to only ever healing infected, meaning the killers have almost nothing to fear.
If the healer dies it would become obvious that this is the case - information both scum teams are better off not having.
We wont know whether the DG or Shriek has been hit if some unrevealed comes up as infected.

There's just too many ways the plan could possibly fall to pieces. Maybe the first one or two infectees might be willing to chance it, but it's really there choice. I dont see any strategy that will immediately nullify the DG, Morgy wouldnt build a game so easily broken.

Having thought about it some more, there's also the fact that we cant be 100% certain that the person who revealed is back in their original team should they survive. The chances would be good that they are, but there is the slight possibility they could survive the night without being uninfected. I would also assume the DG v2 doesnt get told who the first DG infected. If all the infected reveal, then it makes it much easier for the DGv2 to try figure out who Duncan is. It also makes it easier for any infected with a kill to do the same and upgrade themselves to symp.

Okay, you realize that in these posts you don't directly talk about the DG in the context of giving him information, so I'm still a little hung up on your argument.

That's an interesting assumption to make about DGv2 that I hadn't thought about, though. Thinking about it, I would have to assume that he is told who his infected are, otherwise, how would he be able to SO them? "I'm really angry at that guy. I'm gonna try and SO him and hope he's one of my infected." Seems counter-intuitive.

Also, could you please clarify the following underlined sentence? Are you talking about DGv2 there, as well, or DGv1? How does it give v1 a better idea about his pool?

Eloth, on Jun 24 2009, 06:42 PM, said:

Galain, on Jun 24 2009, 08:51 PM, said:

Eloth, on Jun 24 2009, 11:48 AM, said:

For the record I still think the whole infected revealing thing could hurt team inno since it will give the DG lots of information, but since I doubt any of the infected will come forward it's a moot point.

TBH I could actually go for Mockra or Rashan, since Mockra's reaction was pretty telling, but Rashan is one of those players that we will have to lynch at some point, else they will become a sticking-point in the game. Anyway, I'm going out for some drinks, see you guys later.

What information will it give the DG? It may give the scum information about the existence of a healer, which is one valid reason to not reveal, but it will not give any information to the DG. On Day 1 he knows 19 other people can be infected and a healer isn't going to stop that.

It let's the DG (and the scum) know whether or not they have to worry about the healer. It also gives the DG a better idea of what his pool of infected look like. If duncan dies it could people under the impression that infected are being uninfected when they aren't (although the first unknown infected would WCS be regarded as duncan rather than the DG). I made a much more thought out argument on day one - when I made that message I was in a bit of a rush and 'giving the DG information' was the best summary of my previous points.

Galayn Lord, on Jun 24 2009, 09:32 PM, said:

Hood's Path, on Jun 24 2009, 02:19 PM, said:

Eloth from the general pattern of his posts, seem to be is that he comes in the middle of the conversation, agrees with one side, and makes some casual remarks about players like how they seem odd or so forth. I'll give it a much thorough check to be sure I'm right in my assessment of him.

Isn't Eloth the one who keeps waving an obi-wan-ish hand in front of our face and says 'ignore the cult, find the killers'?

I've never said ignore the cult. Half of my posts concern the cult and how to deal with it. I've just been doing my doing my best to remind everyone that the killers are still around and we should also be paying them a fair amount of attention.

Liosan, on Jun 24 2009, 10:05 PM, said:

I would also like Eloth to explain why he thinks an infected reveal "will give the DG lots of information."

Same as above. If you lot really want, I will try find the various posts on day one that give my thoughts on the situation.

I feel like a lot of what I have said has been taken out of context or mis-interpreted, reread what I originally said.

For some reason I've just assumed the v2 wont be told who the current infected are, since that's usually the case when the recruiting power is passed on in cult situations. I'm sure the v2 could choose to SO all infected without knowing who they are if he felt he needed to, or use compulsion to narrow the list of people who are currently infected.

And it gives both a better idea - the DGv1 has no reason to use SO or compulsion early on in the game. Those are his only two ways of checking if an infected is still an infected. If every infected reveals, the DG will be forced to keep SO'ing them - if they survive he can be pretty sure they are no longer infected and he knows exactly how many people are still on his team. If people dont reveal, there's a chance that Duncan may be able to disinfect a couple of them without the DG realising. This would likely result in the DG playing his hand too early and getting caught out, which is a good thing.

[Gamelon]

alright i am here for a few hours then wont be here for the weekend.

I think i need to reveal.

I am duncan, i think (hope) i can safely reveal this because i believe i am an asset (as long as DG1 and DG2 are around) to the killers aswell.
I am not a threat in any way to the killers. I can only heal infected and will get a find on DG if i disinfect him.

I am also revealing because im afraid i might get NK'd over the weekend and all the information that i gather would be lost.

On night one i disinfected Hoods Path.
On night 2 i disinfected Eloth.

So these two are not the DG for sure.

I just hope that the DG himself cant kill me or that one of his infected dont do it...the infected shouldnt because when both DG's are dead then they become cured.
Now...

I have a big problem believing Galain is innocent.
He has been pushing all the "cheap" cases, and has focussed pretty much solely on the infected and the DG.
He has Made cases that people are infected?.....infected cases? WTF?


So both of these guys are not the DG...

I do have a sister that will inherit my role...so i feel this is the best thing to do.

[Gamelon]

If there is a healer around it would be great if you could pick me.

[Eloth]

Wow, that's a big reveal. I understand your motivations but it's a pity that you felt you needed to.

[Emurlahn]

i dont see why the scum would want to kill you, you arent a threat to them, while dg cant kill you.

[Gamelon]

As for the cases presented,

I find the mockra case to be based purely on him making dumb choices.
I dont know if a killer would be so blatantly obvious.

He could however be a symp.

The hoods path case is based on him asking too many questions?
Hmmm....i dont like that cae at all. I ask people allot of questions too, sometimes to gauge there response. He's also does seem pretty new.

Kaschan....well i need to look over this again....im not sure.


My numero UNO suspect however is ....Galain.
Galain has pretty much continually searched for the DG and infected. He even made a case on serc that he was infected?.
I mean what the fuck for?....why take the time to make a case that someone is infected?...as an inno you are looking for the DG and the killers. Not the infected
I think he is focussing on the infected and the DG because he is the killer and is doing so becuase well frankly he finds teh DG to be his biggest threat. And it looks like he is a massive contributor aswell.

The only "scum cases" he has pushed are all the easy lynches and he pushed these VERY hard.
Rashan made a noob mistake and paid for it....Galain pushed harder than most for the rashan lynch and the same goes for the Mockra case.
Mockra seems to me like he is just tripping over his feet.
And now galain is liking the HP case as well....he looks like he is painting all the red crosses on the doors if you ask me.

If i have time i thin i will go over his posts to see exactly why i feel he is scum....

[Eloth]

And why didnt you try disinfect D'riss?

[Gamelon]

Eloth, on Jun 26 2009, 07:45 AM, said:

Wow, that's a big reveal. I understand your motivations but it's a pity that you felt you needed to.

well

is it really?...you all are gonna get the info, it wont die with me i i do die and the only person it hurts cant kill me.
I cant communicate with my sister, so if i die she will more than likely pick people i have already picked...so i think my revealing is much better than not revealing.
call it a calculated gamble..

[Gamelon]

Eloth, on Jun 26 2009, 07:50 AM, said:

And why didnt you try disinfect D'riss?

because i wanted to know if there was a healer first.
If i had tried it would have been a waste...as you can see he died so it was the right move


edit - typo

This post has been edited by Gamelon: 26 June 2009 - 11:53 AM

[Emurlahn]

Gamelon, on Jun 26 2009, 12:50 PM, said:

Eloth, on Jun 26 2009, 07:45 AM, said:

Wow, that's a big reveal. I understand your motivations but it's a pity that you felt you needed to.

well

is it really?...you all are gonna get the info, it wont die with me i i do die and the only person it hurts cant kill me.
I cant communicate with my sister, so if i die she will more than likely pick people i have already picked...so i think my revealing is much better than not revealing.
call it a calculated gamble..

no one can communicate with their sister, being female blocks all intelligent conversation........


i jest, i jest

[Gamelon]

Emurlahn, on Jun 26 2009, 07:53 AM, said:

Gamelon, on Jun 26 2009, 12:50 PM, said:

Eloth, on Jun 26 2009, 07:45 AM, said:

Wow, that's a big reveal. I understand your motivations but it's a pity that you felt you needed to.

well

is it really?...you all are gonna get the info, it wont die with me i i do die and the only person it hurts cant kill me.
I cant communicate with my sister, so if i die she will more than likely pick people i have already picked...so i think my revealing is much better than not revealing.
call it a calculated gamble..

no one can communicate with their sister, being female blocks all intelligent conversation........


i jest, i jest

thats for sure