[Aztiel]

Hey everybody. So I know that the new Dresden book will be titled Changes, or at least that is what it is listed as on the Wikipedia site. I am using some of the many hours I have at my boring summer job to read this series over again, and right now I am reading the seventh book, Dead Beat.

There is a pretty interesting discussion in Chapter 29 - sorry, I can't give page numbers as I am reading on a Kindle. It is listed as line numbers 9921-36.

Dresden and Kumori are talking about "changing death".

Now, I can't quite remember how this one goes, which is good when re-reading, somewhat, but that seems to me to be an interesting tie-in to the potential title of the next Dresden book. Which, if it follows the pattern, is nearly a year away.

Just thought that was interesting, and wondered what other people thought about it.

[Sindriss]

Seems like a very big stretch for a few words, but who knows.

[Abyss]

Over in the original Dresden thread before we incorporated the mini-forum, someone quotes a recent Butcher interview re CHANGES...

i'm going to use SPOILER SPOILERS SPOILERS warning here one time and one time only so no one who passes this point can whine about not wanting to know anything about the book...

spoilers
SPOILERS SPOILERS MAJOR DEMON FUCKING DRESDEN CHANGES PLOT SPOILERS
SPOILERS MAGIC FLAMING POO THROWING MONKEY DEON SPOILERS
SPOILERS
BLOODY SPOILERS


OK, CAN'T SAY I DIDN'T WARN YOU...



Apparently CHANGES opens with Harry's ex Susan (former reporter now semi vampire vampire hunter) showing up at his door to tell him...

honestly, FOR FUCK'S SAKE SPOILERS
SPOILERS
LAST CHANCE
SPOILERS

"Harry, they've taken our daughter."


And there you have it.
Relatedly, Kumori was Cowl's sidekick and it's been speculated more than once that Cowl is Dumorne returned from death, so Aztiel's link may in fact not be offside.


- Abyss, ...tried to warn you, really...

[Coco with marshmallows]

nah, i still think Cowl is the dude from Archangel that everyone assumes was killed by the vampires.

I reckon the 'vampire expert' saw what way the wind was blowing, ie that the vamps were about to attack,
and sold out the base for his own life, leaving him free to concentrate on his black council activities.

This post has been edited by Cocoreturns: 02 June 2009 - 08:08 PM

[Assail]

I think the book is definitely going to be centered around the island in Lake Michigan. When Harry was reading McCoy's journal in Turn Coat it was saying things about the island and 'taking up the mantle'. 

Edit: Of course there's going to be more ideas, obviously the Thomas sub plot, his role as a Warden, Denarians etc etc, but I seriously think the island is going to have a huge impact on further Dresden books.

This post has been edited by Assail: 02 June 2009 - 08:40 PM

[Coco with marshmallows]

nah, i don't think the island will come up in Changes,

it's just been in two in a row, so will probably only be mentioned in passing.
How about a scene in Harry's office?

not been there in a while now.

[Obdigore]

I'm sure the message is on Harry's answering machine at his office.

I would guess there is another Mab task involved and probably some Red Court activity.

I don't think its time for Cowl just yet.

I would guess the message is after harry is told that someone has something he wants and he dosen't know what it is or what the 'ransom' task is until Susan calls.

Next 3 books are going to be:
Mab/Vampire
Black Council/Denarians
Thomas/Murphy/Archive.

[Abyss]

We're due for a vamp storyline and Susan showing up certainly seems to support that.

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

I expect the Soulfire plotline will advance tho'. Much like Lash, that seems like an element that will run through a few books in a row.

Interesting tho' that Harry is now linked to angels via the soulfire AND whatever Demonreach is. The powerup-per-book theme is still going strong.

- Abss, giddy.

[Coco with marshmallows]

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 04:36 PM, said:

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 04:36 PM, said:

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 04:36 PM, said:

Obdi

Obdi? Obdi? it was ME. In the words of the reverend Spooner, Cucking Fat!

and relax.

[Obdigore]

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 10:36 AM, said:

We're due for a vamp storyline and Susan showing up certainly seems to support that.

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

I expect the Soulfire plotline will advance tho'. Much like Lash, that seems like an element that will run through a few books in a row.

Interesting tho' that Harry is now linked to angels via the soulfire AND whatever Demonreach is. The powerup-per-book theme is still going strong.

- Abss, giddy.

I still maintain that the root of demonreach is a demon prince/king that was summoned fully into the world and then trapped there, becoming a part of the worlds' ley-line system. Harry is going to tap in to it to fight some outsiders... although I wouldn't be suprised to see some more outsiders in the next couple books - the last actual outsiders were what, he who walks behind in the one where harry helps Lara overcome the white king? He Who Walks Behind possessed the dead ex-porn star and said he has returned... We might very well be due for that.

This post has been edited by Obdigore: 05 June 2009 - 04:22 PM

[Abyss]

Cocoreturns, on Jun 3 2009, 01:34 PM, said:

...

Obdi? Obdi? it was ME. In the words of the reverend Spooner, Cucking Fat!
...

oh, don't get your little girl knickers in a twist - i meant i agreed that a vamp storyline was likely next. I also agree with you. There, do we feel better now?

Obdigore, on Jun 5 2009, 12:21 PM, said:

I still maintain that the root of demonreach is a demon prince/king that was summoned fully into the world and then trapped there, becoming a part of the worlds' ley-line system. Harry is going to tap in to it to fight some outsiders... although I wouldn't be suprised to see some more outsiders in the next couple books - the last actual outsiders were what, he who walks behind in the one where harry helps Lara overcome the white king? He Who Walks Behind possessed the dead ex-porn star and said he has returned... We might very well be due for that.

NICE old storyline fu there. Totally forgot that.

- Abyss, would rep you if he could...

[Slow Ben]

No, I dont have anything to add to the discussion at this point. But i've stayed away from this part of the forum because of a profound fear of spoilers.

I just finished all the books and, WHY THE HELL HAVE I NOT BEEN READING THIS?!?!?!?!?

Seriously amazing.

That is all.

[Coco with marshmallows]

Slow Ben, on Jun 5 2009, 11:38 PM, said:

No, I dont have anything to add to the discussion at this point. But i've stayed away from this part of the forum because of a profound fear of spoilers.

I just finished all the books and, WHY THE HELL HAVE I NOT BEEN READING THIS?!?!?!?!?

Seriously amazing.

That is all.

aaaaaaaand another one joins the dresden side.

[Assail]

Obdigore, on Jun 5 2009, 09:21 AM, said:

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 10:36 AM, said:

We're due for a vamp storyline and Susan showing up certainly seems to support that.

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

I expect the Soulfire plotline will advance tho'. Much like Lash, that seems like an element that will run through a few books in a row.

Interesting tho' that Harry is now linked to angels via the soulfire AND whatever Demonreach is. The powerup-per-book theme is still going strong.

- Abss, giddy.

I still maintain that the root of demonreach is a demon prince/king that was summoned fully into the world and then trapped there, becoming a part of the worlds' ley-line system. Harry is going to tap in to it to fight some outsiders... although I wouldn't be suprised to see some more outsiders in the next couple books - the last actual outsiders were what, he who walks behind in the one where harry helps Lara overcome the white king? He Who Walks Behind possessed the dead ex-porn star and said he has returned... We might very well be due for that.

It's possible. I mean that explains why the Gatekeeper would have had an encounter with it. Then again, I wouldn't count it to be extremely strong because the Gatekeeper did manage to permanently mangle it. He's strong, but we've all been told Outsiders are things that wizards can't exactly do much against.

Concerning Outsiders though I'm a bit unsure, Butcher has told us plenty of times how strong they are, yet he's given one instance when one was put on his ass by Harry.

[Aptorian]

Hmm. I had a dream last night that Dresden was turned into a Vampire. My subconcious is making up Crazytheories.

[RangerSG]

Aptorian, on Jun 6 2009, 12:07 AM, said:

Hmm. I had a dream last night that Dresden was turned into a Vampire. My subconcious is making up Crazytheories.

Now that is a crazy theory. I think it's more likely he sells his soul to the Denarians than becomes a vamp, IMHO. I agree that Susan returning definitely means that this is a vamp story. I also think it's going to be one where Molly has to make up her mind about whether she's going White or Black (I think the likelihood of her turning away from magic is minimal at this point).

An interesting tidbit I read on the Jim-Butcher forum is that

Spoiler

someone will report what they saw when they soulgazed Harry in book 12.

[Obdigore]

Assail, on Jun 5 2009, 08:08 PM, said:

Obdigore, on Jun 5 2009, 09:21 AM, said:

Abyss, on Jun 3 2009, 10:36 AM, said:

We're due for a vamp storyline and Susan showing up certainly seems to support that.

I agree with Obdi after two novels of Island we'll probably get a break.

I expect the Soulfire plotline will advance tho'. Much like Lash, that seems like an element that will run through a few books in a row.

Interesting tho' that Harry is now linked to angels via the soulfire AND whatever Demonreach is. The powerup-per-book theme is still going strong.

- Abss, giddy.

I still maintain that the root of demonreach is a demon prince/king that was summoned fully into the world and then trapped there, becoming a part of the worlds' ley-line system. Harry is going to tap in to it to fight some outsiders... although I wouldn't be suprised to see some more outsiders in the next couple books - the last actual outsiders were what, he who walks behind in the one where harry helps Lara overcome the white king? He Who Walks Behind possessed the dead ex-porn star and said he has returned... We might very well be due for that.

It's possible. I mean that explains why the Gatekeeper would have had an encounter with it. Then again, I wouldn't count it to be extremely strong because the Gatekeeper did manage to permanently mangle it. He's strong, but we've all been told Outsiders are things that wizards can't exactly do much against.

Concerning Outsiders though I'm a bit unsure, Butcher has told us plenty of times how strong they are, yet he's given one instance when one was put on his ass by Harry.

But its also mentioned that Harry is 'born with power over outsiders'. IE he is the only wizard that can really fight them well.

[Zanth13]

Harry is also being considered to replace the gatekeeper, i wonder when we will see that play a part... especially as he seems to be tied to the outsiders some how... maybe his uncle did something to him... or his mother

[Abyss]

Zanth13, on Jun 8 2009, 11:58 AM, said:

Harry is also being considered to replace the gatekeeper,...

speculation or reference?

- Abyss, rings a bell but not sure.

[RangerSG]

Abyss, on Jun 8 2009, 01:03 PM, said:

Zanth13, on Jun 8 2009, 11:58 AM, said:

Harry is also being considered to replace the gatekeeper,...

speculation or reference?

- Abyss, rings a bell but not sure.

I think that's speculation. IMHO, the gatekeeper has his own game going. And it's a long one.