[The Dark Wanderer]

Ok, reading through some of the threads in an attempt to re-brief myself before re-reading some of the later books prior to the release of DoD, I've seen most of the books referred to as divisive (ie some people love it, others feel it's the weakest book of the series), so I wondered which is in reality the most divisive book of the series so far. Unfortunately I cann't work out how to ask that as a decent poll question so instead I'm asking for people's opinion of where they think they most disagree with the consensus. I'm willing to beat that it won't be a couple of books, but have no actual clue as to which it is. Probably to make this slightly clearer reasons should be given and also a quick view on what the consensus is (in your opinion). As I'm foolishly starting this, I guess I should go first.

HoC - consensus seems to be that the first bit with Karsa doesn't really fit, the story meanders along a little and parts of it don't make a huge amount of sense at the time (specifically the scenes in the Nascent with Karsa/Trull/Onrack)

My opinion - this is the first book that really starts to give a bigger idea of the picture of the whole world and some of the backstory, see Apsalar's cmments on Traveller, the intoduction of Andarist and the other Andii. Karsa's bit is a nice change of pace from the rest of the series and works well as an introduction to the character. The final battle/s at Raraku are well written and the conclusion to the sisters storyline is beautifully ironic as is Pearl's/Lostara's reaction to it.

Any one else out wanting some of the abuse this thread will generate feel free to comment.

This post has been edited by The Dark Wanderer: 24 May 2009 - 10:56 PM

[HoosierDaddy]

Reaper's Gale. I love it. It is my favorite in the series. Others do not, therefore, I and the consensus disagree MOST on that book. However, everyone loves MoI and DG so those aren't going to really be in contention. Midnight Tides is fairly consistently liked as well.

[caladanbrood]

The book that most people don't like is probably GotM. We just never hear from them again because most don't keep reading. Whereas I love it, so I guess that.

[KeithF]

Opinions vary so much that I'm not even sure what the consensus is on some of the books. However, I'll probably vote for TtH as the book I most deviate from the consensus on: I've read a lot of moaning, um, complaints about how the finale doesn't make up for the meandering first 3/4 of the book, there's too much angst/philosophy etc. However, I think it's one of the best of the series (slight excess of angst in the middle notwithstanding).

[D'rek]

-GotM is divisive for its confusingness, but eventually people get into the series entire and they no longer find it divisive.
-Similarly, MT throws a lot of people off because so much of it is new and different, but again, people come around after the Edur storylines get more involved in BH and RG.
-A lot of people dislike RG, but that's just cause they're made at Trull/Beak dying, and eventually they quit whining and get over it.

However, there are a lot of people who really disliked TtH because of its slow beginning and middle, and few have changed their mind on this front. Of course, TtH may suffer on this front in that it's the most recent book, and folks mind like it better after DoD comes out, but for now I'd say TtH.

[MTS]

I'm agreeing with D'rek, there are a lot of people who believe TtH to be the worst Malazan book to date, but I'm not in that camp - I loved it.

[Sinisdar Toste]

i do think that most people (or perhaps the most vocal people) find TtH to be the weakest entry, i however loved it to shit and know that there is a lot of others who do as well. the split has gotta be the closest to 50/50 of all the books, so, most divisive

[Slow Ben]

I agreed with most everyone that TTH was the weakest until i did a re-read. For some reason i absolutely loved it the second time around.

But Reapers Gale was my favorite also even though a lot of people think its weak. How can you not love all that Malazan Marine goodness?

[Silencer]

This thread is soooo yesterday!

/end girl.

But seriously, we already know that Deadhouse Gates is the most divisive book - Yellow's Latest Update Here has all sorts of fancy stats. Including the fact that DG has the highest standard deviation, indicating that it's the most loved and most hated book, ergo the most divisive.

In any case, it's clear so far from this thread that TTH is not the most divisive. I'd say the opinions expressed about it are vocal, but not as extreme as we think (note it is also the fifth most popular book on the list in the thread linked above). I'd say that I, personally, have the most disagreements over the newer books - but that's really due to the lack of activity on (and the lack of me reading) the older forums.

>.>

Anyway, I'd probably have to go with HoC - if only for the first part of it. Though I didn't really dislike that, but I know that a lot of people have a love relationship with it, and a whole bunch of others have a hate relationship with it.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

I'd probably say HoC too...but I didn't like MT a lot. One minute we're in with the Malazans, warrens and 'Hood's breath", the next we're in Lether, where everything suxxorz. But it was a crucial step for the series, so I'm just being grumpy.

[Bauchelain the Evil]

Many people said that after MT the books started to become worse but I completely disagree. I loved TBH(after MoI it's my favourite book) and liked a lot Rg too. On the other hand I didn't think that DG was so awesome as everyone says. In fact, and I'm sure I'll be burned for my heresy, until the very end when the /th is slaughtered outside Aren and Coltaine was crucifixed, I found the CoD ,well, boring.

[Khellendros]

Well, at first I was going to vote for TtH, because I didn't enjoy it all that much, but then I read some of the posts above and the consensus seems to be that if you loved that book, then you're deviating from the norm.

So instead I voted for RG, as I loved many parts of it (yes, including the Redmask arc, which I've defended on numerous occasions on this board). Although it's not my favourite overall book either, in my opinion many of the criticisms of it are unjustified - or at the least too extreme.

[lord of tragedy]

HOC. the ghost army was pants. thuroughly unsatisfying. TTH is a masterpiece of the fantasy genre. lost in a city of words. genius. MT may just be better though.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

I loved BH...the prologue after reading MT was a beautiful appetiser. Y'Ghatan was terrifically written, as well as spine-chilling.

[Daser]

Cant vote anything else than Toll the Hounds.

It is such an even split between those that like it best and those that find it weakest that it has to win this poll.

[End of Disc One]

I voted GotM because I love it, but maybe I should have voted DG. It's my least favorite in the series.

[tiam]

errr BH anyone? i thought it was shaky at best and well accepted it as the link book but really some love it for the maine goodness mentioned above but i was not a fan.

GOTM- As already said confusing and most hardcore fans of the series love it. Not divisive
DG- quite divisive as the felisin plotline ruined it for some whereas the COD and Iccy and Mappo bouncing round the desert saved it for some
MOI-Win by everyone
HOC- Problems here. No real big battle but mainly divisive because of the anti climax. I myself am against the ghost army thing but did like Karsa plotline
MT-Throws people off series wise with new Empires being thrown around left right and centre but still regarded as a close scond if not superior to MOI. SOme love it some hate it
BH mentoned above
RG-Just finished this and really liked it alot more than i did on the 4th read thru although i still am bamboozled by the redmask plot
TTH-Hated it the first time a read it and though even the ending didnt make it up for it. 2nd time loved the bulk of the book and wasnt a fan of the flashy ending

Essentially opinions divided on whether MT is brilliant or shit beccause its on a diffeent continent, TTH because its like reading Platos Republic for the most part but i reckon BH which i maintain is the weakest book but many love it.

Of course no one loves the lapland day out american cover

This post has been edited by tiam: 28 May 2009 - 11:25 AM

[End of Disc One]

tiam, on May 28 2009, 06:24 AM, said:

errr BH anyone? i thought it was shaky at best and well accepted it as the link book but really some love it for the maine goodness mentioned above but i was not a fan.

TB is one of the only books for which I can't find any concensus on this board. Everyone thinks it's one of the best, or one of the worst. However on other boards there's this concensus of "series goes downhill after book 5" which frankly I don't understand.

[tiam]

End of Disc One, on May 28 2009, 02:41 PM, said:

tiam, on May 28 2009, 06:24 AM, said:

errr BH anyone? i thought it was shaky at best and well accepted it as the link book but really some love it for the maine goodness mentioned above but i was not a fan.

TB is one of the only books for which I can't find any concensus on this board. Everyone thinks it's one of the best, or one of the worst. However on other boards there's this concensus of "series goes downhill after book 5" which frankly I don't understand.

Consensus on post MT is truish. BH was the link book and weak at that, RG was a bit of a link and set up book and the redmask plolt confused many withits twist. After just reading it i still have no idea who/what redmask was accept what is stated. TTH is a differentstyle of book that many may not like but after a reread it makes more sense

[Lister of Smeg]

tiam, on May 28 2009, 12:24 PM, said:

GOTM- As already said confusing and most hardcore fans of the series love it. Not divisive
DG- quite divisive as the felisin plotline ruined it for some whereas the COD and Iccy and Mappo bouncing round the desert saved it for some
MOI-Win by everyone
HOC- Problems here. No real big battle but mainly divisive because of the anti climax. I myself am against the ghost army thing but did like Karsa plotline
MT-Throws people off series wise with new Empires being thrown around left right and centre but still regarded as a close scond if not superior to MOI. SOme love it some hate it
BH mentoned above
RG-Just finished this and really liked it alot more than i did on the 4th read thru although i still am bamboozled by the redmask plot
TTH-Hated it the first time a read it and though even the ending didnt make it up for it. 2nd time loved the bulk of the book and wasnt a fan of the flashy ending

If this is right, I should change my vote to MoI because on my recent reread of the series I found it one of the hardest to plough through The siege of Capustan is still great but so much of the rest of it was dull (and I don't just mean the Mhybe).

I voted for RG, because on other boards it gets panned a lot and I just loved it. It's my third favourite behind DG and MT.