[Path-Shaper]

Some interesting thoughts from our killer:

Gamelon said:

Roled or not, I'm not sad to have knocked Gem out of the game. She's proven to me in my short mafia career that she's a pretty smart player. As it stands, I know a lot less about the remaining players on the list, although every single one of them has had a longer career than me.


What's the deal with vigilante kills? (rhetorical question) If it's limited to only a few uses, I can't see using it on night one just for a hunch. 4 innos were whittled in one day/night sequence, and the chances of hitting a roled inno exists as well. Even if I was a vigilante and had unlimited vigs, I think I would try damn hard to be more sure of the kill since it seems just as likely to hurt as help.

Well, as long as they keep missing and doing my work for me.

[Path-Shaper]

I'm happy Bubba got silenced, I'm sure he was dying to get it


And once again, all the deaths are roleless innos. It's always like this in the Benses game, poor BB will have a hard time soon.

Anyways, it's always very hard for the first one, the reason I think it's balanced is because of the second BB.

[Gavin]

I think he's spot on there, that was almost the best possible night for him. It could only have been better if they had Vigged the Finder or Guard

I imagine they will withhold that last Vig till near the end though. I can't see them wasting it again.
Down to 11 players already so he's a day ahead of schedule. Its tough to get down to the final 4 though.

[Kurt Montandon]

Quote

Please cool down with the "I'm pissed" modkill requests. This is a team game so remember

1) You have a team
2) It's a game
3) Ridicule doesn't kill.

I can vouch for the last one.

Hell, if ridicule could Kill, I'd never be Inno.

[drinksinbars]

strange game. glad i am sticking with meat and tatters matches for the moment, these things just degenerate quickly. we really need a few tmdi 1 games with no theme just to allow people to see what being inno is all about, as it stands people just spam and go nuts when inno for no reason.

BASIC RULES OF INNO

1 - no faking inno roles
2 - no spamming needlessly
3 - no pissing contests
4 - No random lynches

its a pity we didnt have a few of the really early games still on hand, tempted to put forward a noob only area for the newer players to play one or two games without any old hands at all. Or a game for people who have played less than five games only.

This post has been edited by drinksinbars: 14 May 2009 - 07:47 AM

[Tapper]

While that would be a good initiative, strange stunts are being pulled by experienced players as well as new ones.

See Bent in 45, see Gem in 44, see RI's in a multitude of other games (for example me claiming killer in a game where you were scum, I needed to find the limits of what you can claim/ rp and how long it will stick), see the discussions on how Inno's should behave in the spoilers for the past 3 games.

Besides that, there still is the image problem that RI is somehow boring or irrelevant to the game, and that too isn't a newbie thing.
The amount of reactions that say 'booh, no role, damn, I hate you (to P-S) and I hate being RI' or 'woohooo, I'm roled!' are staggering, but imho it should make shit all difference, because RI has a role and a part to play, too.

[drinksinbars]

Tapper, on May 14 2009, 09:03 AM, said:

While that would be a good initiative, strange stunts are being pulled by experienced players as well as new ones.

See Bent in 45, see Gem in 44, see RI's in a multitude of other games (for example me claiming killer in a game where you were scum, I needed to find the limits of what you can claim/ rp and how long it will stick), see the discussions on how Inno's should behave in the spoilers for the past 3 games.

Besides that, there still is the image problem that RI is somehow boring or irrelevant to the game, and that too isn't a newbie thing.
The amount of reactions that say 'booh, no role, damn, I hate you (to P-S) and I hate being RI' or 'woohooo, I'm roled!' are staggering, but imho it should make shit all difference, because RI has a role and a part to play, too.

its the experienced players i am worried about

[Gavin]

Ahh DKT has dismissed the nonesense and got down and listed the 4 quiet ones who stayed out of trouble. Getting both scum in his list. Thats the kind of sensible posting thats bound to see him lynched.

This post has been edited by Gavin: 14 May 2009 - 08:23 AM

[Path-Shaper]

Some of Big Shin's thoughts:

Quote

Kill Korvalain. If Korv is lynched, kill Emurlahn.

I have an inkling this will change, so subject to confirmation.


If I was ballsy, I wouldn't put a kill in at all. That would mean utter confusion if there was a vig. Or it could get a guard to reveal himself. "I guarded so and so and there was no kill!" Then I whack the guard.

Of course, if there's no guard in the game (or one of the dead players was) that might mean nothing, and time added by not killing could hurt team scum.
Meh, maybe for a future game when I'm a killer.

So far, wacking the guard, which is the biggest threat for his team in this game.

[Gavin]

Ahh thats what you like to see, the killer weighing up his options and trying to make some sort of plan.
Having such a good night 1, I don't think I'd waste time with holding, the numbers are down to 11 already. I'd just keep killing and hope your hitting roled players. Eliminate as much as he can and then hand it over and hope the new Big Ben can weasel their way home.

With 4 paired players out there though he's got his work cut out for him, especially if there's a reveal fest.

This post has been edited by Gavin: 14 May 2009 - 08:54 AM

[Path-Shaper]

Oh, it's SEXPO TIME!!!

dktorode said:

Guess where i am going tomorrow!!!???!!!??

O
=(.)(.)=
) (
(|*|)

[Khellendros]

Gavin, on May 14 2009, 09:21 AM, said:

Ahh DKT has dismissed the nonesense and got down and listed the 4 quiet ones who stayed out of trouble. Getting both scum in his list. Thats the kind of sensible posting thats bound to see him lynched.

And I can't believe whoever came up with that ridiculous 'drumstick' thing (Malaese?) citing that 'killers only skim the thread and won't realise they have to say it', was actually totally and utterly right. I think Gamelon is the only one who forgot to put it first time in his post. Unbelievable. I say that's exactly what all day 1 lynches should be based on from now on.

[drinksinbars]

Khellendros, on May 14 2009, 11:24 AM, said:

Gavin, on May 14 2009, 09:21 AM, said:

Ahh DKT has dismissed the nonesense and got down and listed the 4 quiet ones who stayed out of trouble. Getting both scum in his list. Thats the kind of sensible posting thats bound to see him lynched.

And I can't believe whoever came up with that ridiculous 'drumstick' thing (Malaese?) citing that 'killers only skim the thread and won't realise they have to say it', was actually totally and utterly right. I think Gamelon is the only one who forgot to put it first time in his post. Unbelievable. I say that's exactly what all day 1 lynches should be based on from now on.

whats this?

[Khellendros]

It's this. Telas said, in reply to something D'riss said I think:

Telas, on May 12 2009, 10:47 PM, said:

so, lets have a random question, get some other opinions.

Anyone who has played scum in the past, have you enjoyed it?

And while we're at it, if you read this post say "drumstick" at the end of your next post.

Since apparently scum don't read the thread, they won't. Problem solved, right?

From then on everyone starts putting 'drumstick' in their posts for a couple of pages. Only one person doesn't do it straight away. Gamelon, the scum As HP noticed:

Hood's Path, on May 13 2009, 05:51 AM, said:

Vote Gamelon

nice reread, but you missed drumstick while making us look at 4 people, scummy.

This post has been edited by Khellendros: 14 May 2009 - 11:23 AM

[Gem Windcaster]

Tapper, on May 14 2009, 08:03 AM, said:

While that would be a good initiative, strange stunts are being pulled by experienced players as well as new ones.

See Bent in 45, see Gem in 44, see RI's in a multitude of other games (for example me claiming killer in a game where you were scum, I needed to find the limits of what you can claim/ rp and how long it will stick), see the discussions on how Inno's should behave in the spoilers for the past 3 games.

Besides that, there still is the image problem that RI is somehow boring or irrelevant to the game, and that too isn't a newbie thing.
The amount of reactions that say 'booh, no role, damn, I hate you (to P-S) and I hate being RI' or 'woohooo, I'm roled!' are staggering, but imho it should make shit all difference, because RI has a role and a part to play, too.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me RI is the hardest to play, because you have no control over anything. You basically either get lynched for some retarded reason, or you get nk'd for playing too clean. It gets to you. I'm pissed that I was nk'd because I think I was doing great as RI for once. I was gonna up the game too, day 2. Just simple unlucky.

This post has been edited by Gem Windcaster: 14 May 2009 - 11:30 AM

[Path-Shaper]

More from Big Shin:

Quote

I just noticed on the game specific rules that the vigilante gets a vig to use once. So unless there's another vigilante in the game, that's it. So, with only one vig at their disposal, WHY NIGHT ONE and WHY HP? Is that on of the reasons why there are people whining to be mod-killed? Not that I care that much in the context of my current role, obviously it helps me, but I don't get that move.

The only thing occurs to me has to do with something I've been meaning to ask you PS. What is the order in which night actions take place? (sorry, I still have that new noob smell)

Also, just for curiousities sake. What happens if my soul moves into a vigilante who hasn't used their vig yet? Since BB gains the person's power that he shifts into, does he then get a double kill night? That would be pretty sweet.

Indeed, the new BB keeps his role, if any. A lone vigilante with an unused vig is the only exception, however, I was feeling that 2 NKs would be too much

[Path-Shaper]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Guess where i am going tomorrow!!!???!!!??

O
=(.)(.)=
) (
(|*|)

Visiting Tapper?

SEXPO BABY!!!!

haha

[Tapper]

Gem Windcaster, on May 14 2009, 01:30 PM, said:

Tapper, on May 14 2009, 08:03 AM, said:

While that would be a good initiative, strange stunts are being pulled by experienced players as well as new ones.

See Bent in 45, see Gem in 44, see RI's in a multitude of other games (for example me claiming killer in a game where you were scum, I needed to find the limits of what you can claim/ rp and how long it will stick), see the discussions on how Inno's should behave in the spoilers for the past 3 games.

Besides that, there still is the image problem that RI is somehow boring or irrelevant to the game, and that too isn't a newbie thing.
The amount of reactions that say 'booh, no role, damn, I hate you (to P-S) and I hate being RI' or 'woohooo, I'm roled!' are staggering, but imho it should make shit all difference, because RI has a role and a part to play, too.

I can't speak for anyone else, but for me RI is the hardest to play, because you have no control over anything. You basically either get lynched for some retarded reason, or you get nk'd for playing too clean. It gets to you. I'm pissed that I was nk'd because I think I was doing great as RI for once. I was gonna up the game too, day 2. Just simple unlucky.

It's difficult, true, because you have no extra information whatsoever and if you are a threat, yes you will get killed, but better you than a roled player, no?

In return you also have only 1 thing to worry about: spotting the oddities and making lists of them, then at some point, start building cases. Whether you do the building early on or later in the game should be part of your plan, and of course plans can go entirely wrong.

The spotting part is not so different from a guard or finder or healer, at the least until the reveals start, imho.

[Tapper]

I think Dkt means Eurovision Song Festival with Sexpo....

Tapper, not jealous at Dkt at all.

This post has been edited by Tapper: 14 May 2009 - 12:33 PM

[Path-Shaper]

More from the killer:

Quote

Quote

Quote

I just noticed on the game specific rules that the vigilante gets a vig to use once. So unless there's another vigilante in the game, that's it. So, with only one vig at their disposal, WHY NIGHT ONE and WHY HP? Is that on of the reasons why there are people whining to be mod-killed? Not that I care that much in the context of my current role, obviously it helps me, but I don't get that move.

The only thing occurs to me has to do with something I've been meaning to ask you PS. What is the order in which night actions take place? (sorry, I still have that new noob smell)

Also, just for curiousities sake. What happens if my soul moves into a vigilante who hasn't used their vig yet? Since BB gains the person's power that he shifts into, does he then get a double kill night? That would be pretty sweet.

Just noticed your other question.

Night orders happen simultaneously.

The logical interpretation of this is quite clear, i.e. it "results" that we analyze then in the following order:

1) guard, which blocks all the next actions
2) finds
3) Heal/BulletProof (protect from following kill)
4) kill/vig (at the same time, i.e. two players can kill each other)


That takes care of most problems, i.e.
if a find is made on a player that gets killed, he still gets the result.
If a healer gets killed, he can still protect his target from a different kill
if a guard 1 blocks guard 2 who is blocking a killer, the killer's kill goes through
etc.

The only one we haven't solved is if two guards guard each other, but the answer is moot

That, and what happens if a one-shot BulletProof gets targeted by 2 kills in the same night, does he die? The answer to that is still debated.

Thanks. So obviously, if Gem was the vig, she would have been able to get it off despite being killed by me. I assume the provisional "if NK'd, vig HP" doesn't work, right?

My speculation is Gem was roled in some way, only from her gameplay itself. She seemed more up in people's faces when she was roleless. On the other hand, people claim though that she is a difficult alt guess which suggests she could really vary from game to game.