[Tellan]

Anomandaris, on Apr 26 2009, 05:32 PM, said:

@tellan - why the fatalism yesterday?

bad mood. Finishing Undergrad ain't all it's cracked up to be.

[Fener]

Shadow, on Apr 26 2009, 10:14 PM, said:

This won't end until one of Fener or Mockra is gone, it seems.

I agree that my playstyle is distracting many people, and could be harmful, so i'll tell you what. I'll do a deal.

Lynch Mockra. From his reaction to my case I think it's highly likely that he's guilty. If he comes up innocent, i'll accept that i'm more of a distraction than a help, and you can get rid of me tomorrow.

Sound fair?

[Meanas]

Serc, D'riss, my case doesn't really rest on the assumption that there was any actual coding, more on the fact that Shadow thought there was - enough to build a case, and from that perspective I find it interesting that he didn't consider the fact that the coding could be inno.

Hey I'm willing to vote for Fener though, since people don't seem to agree with me.

[Ampelas]

Fener, on Apr 26 2009, 05:37 PM, said:

Shadow, on Apr 26 2009, 10:14 PM, said:

This won't end until one of Fener or Mockra is gone, it seems.

I agree that my playstyle is distracting many people, and could be harmful, so i'll tell you what. I'll do a deal.

Lynch Mockra. From his reaction to my case I think it's highly likely that he's guilty. If he comes up innocent, i'll accept that i'm more of a distraction than a help, and you can get rid of me tomorrow.

Sound fair?

Or we do it the other way around, speedlynch Mockra tomorrow so the scum don't have time to act and get a free night.

[Ampelas]

Mmm, Meanas, I read the "code" post, and whether its legit or not, enough people just passed it off as RP that it could have worked.

[D'riss]

@Meanas ~ I don't disagree with you on that point. I'm still considering all the options. I think Mockra and Fener are probably innocent, but given the accusations that have flown my way anything I say is likely to be tainted by association added to which Shadow was the one that first raised the case against me, so any vote by me will be shouted down as OMGUS. Not that it will stop me if I feel the case is strong enough, but I need to think on it a bit more.

@Amp ~ HTG I give up.

[Kessobahn]

Ruse, on Apr 26 2009, 01:25 PM, said:

Barghast, on Apr 26 2009, 05:17 AM, said:

So about a hour and a half to go, not sure if we're going to make the lynch.

I think D'riss has stated my thoughts about the Tellan lynch as well, I prefer Fener myself however Tellan with 4 is starting to look like our remaining option. Ruse who you looking at voting?

That's a good question. I'm almost of a mind to take a shot in the dark, that's how little I feel towards the current cases. So I looked over the list of the player's remaining and my gut stopped me on Kessobahn. He came in late yesterday, made a quick huge-ish case on Omtose first post, defended it second post, as he felt he need to make a contribution, then left.

yeah i realize how much of a drive by vote that was. my bad

weekend starts can be brutal and i basically wanted to contribute something after coming in to the thread so late, but of course, i was gone again for a day so it makes the whole thing look fishy... im back for good so shouldn't have any more situations like that

also, omtose hasn't cleared my scumdar but his more recent posts make me feel a lot better

Ruse, on Apr 26 2009, 05:58 PM, said:

Shadow, on Apr 26 2009, 09:45 AM, said:

Omtose, I think you'll find quite a few people have been questioning Fener's motives. Personally, I don't know whether to agree with that case or not myself. There is something about Mockra's posting (and D'riss') that gets me looking in their direction, but at the same time, I am almost unconsciously now linking the two together every time one of them posts.

Of all the bigger posters though, those two are the ones most on my radar.

But, in an effort to look at a bigger picture, I took a look at Tennes. And this is what I've found. He posted LOADS whilst everyone was RPing drunk, and then as soon as it stopped, he stopped posting. There is not a single post from Tennes since we began playing seriously. Anything in that, do people reckon?

Hard to say with the weekend. It's sort of the opposite of what I saw in Kessobahn. No drunken RP, a decent sized case first post and an "oh by the way I didn't want to be caught not contributing" second post. Then nothing. Which seems like something a killer late to the party might try and do to blend in.

sorry, just a busy weekend... suffice to say, sorry I missed with two lynches, but i'm back, fully read up, and ready to play

[D'riss]

I have to sleep now, but will definately be back on before day times out.

There is one more thought, if Mockra does get lynched at all I hope he is scum. I know that will be bad for me personally , I doubt I'll escape a lynch then (not fatalism, realism in the face of all the spurious accusations ~ mud sticks and all) but hitting any scum will be good for us innos, and one for one will be a good trade. It's not like I will escape attention if he is lynched and comes up inno, and in that case we lose two for nothing. And no I am not going for sympathy (get real this is MAFIA! ) merely stating the facts.

[Kessobahn]

ok i have to admit i'm completely baffled by the train of hate on fener... the guy has pushed for several votes. if he's a symp, the only person i could imagine him symping is his target, mockra, to ensure that when one dies the other gets away scott free

the whole case reeks...

Serc, on Apr 26 2009, 08:44 PM, said:

All caught up, Fener seems to be on the top of everyone's lists. I can see where the case is coming from and he has been incredibly aggressive and not completely consistent. I dunno why, but I dont really see him as killer, although I am often wrong bout stuff like that. That said, if he's a symp he's doing an incredibly good job. I'm willing to put down a vote for him, mainly because he's going to be one of those people that the game revolves around as long as he's alive.

@ Meanas - I've never seen paired innos be that obvious on thread. Interaction like that couldnt be used as proof of pairing in a reveal (way to coincedental) and paired players are normally careful not to let their pairing show, especially since they have the luxury of communicating off thread. I dont know why you're getting so pissy about Shadow drawing attention to it. I'm not sold on it being a symp signalling his master either, but Shadow has a point in that paired players can code pretty elaborate stuff into their posts early in the game for use later, whereas symps need to try alert their masters as to who they are.

i'm pretty much on serc's page here in terms of viewing how the argument is playing out, but i would take it a step further and go with my previous thought that the SHEER NUMBER of people flocking to Mockra's defense is the most suspicious thing here (more so than seekrit Shadow 'pair' clues)

Vote Mockra

[Meanas]

I'm off, so I'm voting Fener now as I said I would, since the Shadow case isn't going anywhere.

remove vote
vote Fener

[Omtose]

Yes well I think most of us are hoping at least one of the two of them (Mockra/Fener) are scum. It's not going to be very good for team inno it we lose two more of our members. If it does happen that they are both inno I will be irritated by their behaviour/style of play Fener especially because it has caused a huge distraction and will have allowed the scum to operate freely. If Fener ends up being scum I will definitely be looking at Shadow, more closely because the suggestion put forth by Meanas that he's a symp or possibly scum with Fener as a symp has quite a bit of merrit to it.

[Telas]

All right! Good to see a little more action starting. I'm all caught up.

Man, Fener is a pushy SOB. Its getting on my nerves, and may be worth a vote...

The case on Mockra is not without merit as well, but I'm not ready to toss a vote there.

My schedule over the next few hours is spotty, so I'll be back on again and off again, but I'll certainly be here pre-deadline.

[Omtose]

Kessobahn, on Apr 26 2009, 04:22 PM, said:

ok i have to admit i'm completely baffled by the train of hate on fener... the guy has pushed for several votes. if he's a symp, the only person i could imagine him symping is his target, mockra, to ensure that when one dies the other gets away scott free

the whole case reeks...

Serc, on Apr 26 2009, 08:44 PM, said:

All caught up, Fener seems to be on the top of everyone's lists. I can see where the case is coming from and he has been incredibly aggressive and not completely consistent. I dunno why, but I dont really see him as killer, although I am often wrong bout stuff like that. That said, if he's a symp he's doing an incredibly good job. I'm willing to put down a vote for him, mainly because he's going to be one of those people that the game revolves around as long as he's alive.

@ Meanas - I've never seen paired innos be that obvious on thread. Interaction like that couldnt be used as proof of pairing in a reveal (way to coincedental) and paired players are normally careful not to let their pairing show, especially since they have the luxury of communicating off thread. I dont know why you're getting so pissy about Shadow drawing attention to it. I'm not sold on it being a symp signalling his master either, but Shadow has a point in that paired players can code pretty elaborate stuff into their posts early in the game for use later, whereas symps need to try alert their masters as to who they are.

i'm pretty much on serc's page here in terms of viewing how the argument is playing out, but i would take it a step further and go with my previous thought that the SHEER NUMBER of people flocking to Mockra's defense is the most suspicious thing here (more so than seekrit Shadow 'pair' clues)

Vote Mockra

I still don't think people are flocking to defend Mockra so much as they are reacting to Fener's behaviour. I think at this point it could have been anybody Fener had accused and the reaction would be the same. The case wasn't that strong and he didn't react well to questions that were put forth about it. Even if he is simply trying to get things going he has bullied and pushed to the point where we are all suspicious of him now, so he has lost a bit of credibility. Had he toned it down a little when people first started mentioning it this could all have been avoided.

I don't think there is anything to the code theory by Meanas, but I do think there is merit to Shadow being a possible symp. So I'm going to keep my eye on that situation.

[Kessobahn]

Omtose, on Apr 26 2009, 11:30 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Apr 26 2009, 04:22 PM, said:

ok i have to admit i'm completely baffled by the train of hate on fener... the guy has pushed for several votes. if he's a symp, the only person i could imagine him symping is his target, mockra, to ensure that when one dies the other gets away scott free

the whole case reeks...

Serc, on Apr 26 2009, 08:44 PM, said:

All caught up, Fener seems to be on the top of everyone's lists. I can see where the case is coming from and he has been incredibly aggressive and not completely consistent. I dunno why, but I dont really see him as killer, although I am often wrong bout stuff like that. That said, if he's a symp he's doing an incredibly good job. I'm willing to put down a vote for him, mainly because he's going to be one of those people that the game revolves around as long as he's alive.

@ Meanas - I've never seen paired innos be that obvious on thread. Interaction like that couldnt be used as proof of pairing in a reveal (way to coincedental) and paired players are normally careful not to let their pairing show, especially since they have the luxury of communicating off thread. I dont know why you're getting so pissy about Shadow drawing attention to it. I'm not sold on it being a symp signalling his master either, but Shadow has a point in that paired players can code pretty elaborate stuff into their posts early in the game for use later, whereas symps need to try alert their masters as to who they are.

i'm pretty much on serc's page here in terms of viewing how the argument is playing out, but i would take it a step further and go with my previous thought that the SHEER NUMBER of people flocking to Mockra's defense is the most suspicious thing here (more so than seekrit Shadow 'pair' clues)

Vote Mockra

I still don't think people are flocking to defend Mockra so much as they are reacting to Fener's behaviour. I think at this point it could have been anybody Fener had accused and the reaction would be the same. The case wasn't that strong and he didn't react well to questions that were put forth about it. Even if he is simply trying to get things going he has bullied and pushed to the point where we are all suspicious of him now, so he has lost a bit of credibility. Had he toned it down a little when people first started mentioning it this could all have been avoided.

I don't think there is anything to the code theory by Meanas, but I do think there is merit to Shadow being a possible symp. So I'm going to keep my eye on that situation.

i totally 'get' the reaction to fener's behavior, but i think it far more likely he's a pushy inno than a ragin symp/killer

i'm annoyed i couldn't help land a lynch yesterday but the fener case is as weak as straw today

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 15 hours and 7 minutes remaining

20 Players still alive: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Gamelon, Kessobahn, Korlat, Meanas, Mockra, Omtose, Rashan, Ruse, Serc, Shadow, Telas, Tellan, Tennes

11 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night

3 votes for Mockra: ( Kessobahn, Meanas, Fener)
4 votes for Fener: ( Mockra, Omtose, Anomandaris, Ampelas)

Players not voted: Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn, Galain, Gamelon, Korlat, Rashan, Ruse, Serc, Shadow, Telas, Tellan, Tennes

[Fener]

Omtose, on Apr 26 2009, 11:30 PM, said:

Even if he is simply trying to get things going he has bullied and pushed to the point where we are all suspicious of him now, so he has lost a bit of credibility. Had he toned it down a little when people first started mentioning it this could all have been avoided.

If I was scum, I would have toned it down, not up. But I suspect you're going to WIFOM that.

[Shadow]

Omtose, on Apr 26 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

Yes well I think most of us are hoping at least one of the two of them (Mockra/Fener) are scum. It's not going to be very good for team inno it we lose two more of our members. If it does happen that they are both inno I will be irritated by their behaviour/style of play Fener especially because it has caused a huge distraction and will have allowed the scum to operate freely. If Fener ends up being scum I will definitely be looking at Shadow, more closely because the suggestion put forth by Meanas that he's a symp or possibly scum with Fener as a symp has quite a bit of merrit to it.

I would like to know how I have symped Fener - both you and Meanas have said this but not outlined any reason - apart from saying it has 'merit.'

[Fener]

Path-Shaper, on Apr 26 2009, 11:39 PM, said:

3 votes for Mockra: ( Kessobahn, Meanas, Fener)
4 votes for Fener: ( Mockra, Omtose, Anomandaris, Ampelas)

Pretty sure Meanas is voting for me.

[Tellan]

Shadow, on Apr 26 2009, 06:42 PM, said:

Omtose, on Apr 26 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

Yes well I think most of us are hoping at least one of the two of them (Mockra/Fener) are scum. It's not going to be very good for team inno it we lose two more of our members. If it does happen that they are both inno I will be irritated by their behaviour/style of play Fener especially because it has caused a huge distraction and will have allowed the scum to operate freely. If Fener ends up being scum I will definitely be looking at Shadow, more closely because the suggestion put forth by Meanas that he's a symp or possibly scum with Fener as a symp has quite a bit of merrit to it.

I would like to know how I have symped Fener - both you and Meanas have said this but not outlined any reason - apart from saying it has 'merit.'

I pointed out your possible relationship to Fener back on day 1--and if he comes up scum, you bet i'll be looking at you
doing a re-read in a different tab, i'm getting odd vibe from Gamelon....

[Omtose]

Fener, on Apr 26 2009, 04:40 PM, said:

Omtose, on Apr 26 2009, 11:30 PM, said:

Even if he is simply trying to get things going he has bullied and pushed to the point where we are all suspicious of him now, so he has lost a bit of credibility. Had he toned it down a little when people first started mentioning it this could all have been avoided.

If I was scum, I would have toned it down, not up. But I suspect you're going to WIFOM that.

That is possible but when a whole group of people are saying your behaviour is distracting and telling you you're overly aggressive it may have been a good idea to tone it down just slightly. I'm not saying you should have shut up completely but you could have gone about it in a different way. If you are inno your behaviour has been so over the top that it's allowed the scum to act freely because you've drawn all of the focus to yourself and made it nearly impossible to focus on anything else. There is such a thing as too much you know.