[Fisher Kel Tath]

Title pretty much says it all. Any ideas? Personally I think he'll be killing the crippled god, but that's a tad obvious for SE.

[Lisheo]

Its the Tyrant of Darujhistan. Karsa's storyline will be dealt with by ICE, suggesting he may not have a huge part to play in DoD or tCG.

[Urb]

It has something to do with a vow he made once.
Someone make a list of all the vows he's made! We can figure this out!

[Lisheo]

He vowed to kill children... Children... child God... who was Ditch... because of the blind guy... working for... Draconus...
He's going to kill Draconus. There we go. Another discussion saved by crazy theories.

Laster Lycaon Lisheo just plain crazy.

[Fisher Kel Tath]

Ah yes, I'd forgotten about that story arc. Though I would be surprised if tCG is done with Karsa Orlong just yet.

The Tyrant is a powerful Jaghut, but wouldn't its rising call down a butload of Imass? Or are they all busy on Assail?

I guess really the question is, is Karsa Orlong necessary for taking down the Tyrant?

[Lisheo]

No, Raest was a Tyrant, not the Tyrant.

This post has been edited by Lisheo: 01 October 2008 - 02:39 PM

[Fisher Kel Tath]

But Daru is built on a bunch of Barrows that the Imass buried Jaghut under, so it stands to reason that the Tyrant might be a Jaghut.

Quick Edit: Logic for great justice.

Picker told Karsa that he was needed to kill a god. Does the Tyrant qualify as a god?

This post has been edited by Fisher Kel Tath: 01 October 2008 - 02:42 PM

[Lisheo]

The Tyrant is someone related to the T'orrud Cabal. Besides, Raest is trapped in the Azath, bereft of his Finnest. He aint a God, either. Methinks the real Tyrant is Kallor or Draconus(seriously).

[Fisher Kel Tath]

Now there is an interesting theory. If Draconus pops out of Dragnipur in Daru that could be plausible. But for what reason would he be the Tyrant? One would think he has larger issues on his mind than a city.

[Lisheo]

Draconus was once reviled by even the Eleint as the cruellest of them all... The only word we have to go on that his cruelty has been tempered is Nightchill, and she's hardly reliable, eh... But he was the King of Night, Suzerain of Darkness, Consort to Mother Dark, stands to reason he once ruled somewhere with titles like that, who's to say he might not like to rule Wu?

[Fisher Kel Tath]

Lisheo, on Oct 1 2008, 09:46 AM, said:

Draconus was once reviled by even the Eleint as the cruellest of them all... The only word we have to go on that his cruelty has been tempered is Nightchill, and she's hardly reliable, eh... But he was the King of Night, Suzerain of Darkness, Consort to Mother Dark, stands to reason he once ruled somewhere with titles like that, who's to say he might not like to rule Wu?

You raise an interesting point, but I think his time spent in Dragnipur has altered his character significantly, if his words to Anomander are any indication.

But the more I think about it, the more Kallor being the Tyrant makes sense. And how awesome would Kallor v Karsa be?

[Blend]

Lisheo, on Oct 1 2008, 03:42 PM, said:

The Tyrant is someone related to the T'orrud Cabal. Besides, Raest is trapped in the Azath, bereft of his Finnest. He aint a God, either. Methinks the real Tyrant is Kallor or Draconus(seriously).

Actually, the Azath was created by his Finnest. So his power isn't too far, eh? Personally, I think that his request for Tufty was for much deeper reasons than just 'companionship'. I figure the cat's gonna end up helping him to figure out how to escape the Azath, or will become his new Finnest or something... I don't think we're quite done with Raest yet. So Karsa could very well be there to kill HIM. But that's just MY opinion.


EDIT: I just randomly thought of the idea of Raest soul-shifting himself into Tufty's body and then getting out and soul-shifting again into some other body.... Seems like something a millenia-old Jaghut Tyrant might do, don't you think? Yeah, yeah, I know, but I can't help myself, I LOVE crazy theories!

This post has been edited by Blend: 01 October 2008 - 04:14 PM

[Lisheo]

I like the idea that Tufty is gonna become Raest's method of escape... But if Raest does escape, surely Paran would know and come and hunt him down? Tyrant or not, Paran has a lot of power behind him...

I'd be thinking Kallor. He was a Tyrant before, and it was a Cabal that tried to take him down originally.

But Draconus, now that would be amazing... Watching Karsa hurl himself against the Big Daddy of Darkness...

This post has been edited by Lisheo: 01 October 2008 - 03:58 PM

[eekwibble]

I reckon a more likely Tyrant would be the Seguleh 1st. They're supposed to be his army and what better way to guarantee their involvement in his take-over bid?

I hope it's someone far less obvious though. Someone like the Jaghut wife from the Wreckers Coast that the husband buried, or the Bole Brothers' dad!

[Grief]

The coin with the tyrant on it has a human face.

[Quick~]

Lisheo, on Oct 1 2008, 03:42 PM, said:

The Tyrant is someone related to the T'orrud Cabal. Besides, Raest is trapped in the Azath, bereft of his Finnest. He aint a God, either. Methinks the real Tyrant is Kallor or Draconus(seriously).

I kinda thought the whole Kallor thing got introduced to lead us on for the duration of the book with a misguided opinion on just why Kallor was headed there and that by the end it was pretty clear he wasn't. Unless it's a double bluff >_>

==

I remain sceptical that Karsas god killing will be the Tyrant as well, though a few choice revelations as to just who the Tyrant was and what he did (particularly if it somehow related to the Teblors decline) might make that link viable.

[HoosierDaddy]

In House of Chains Karsa vows to "break his chains", and we know from the Forkrul Assail that whips the 3 of them that Karsa will have a world-defining choice in his future, and since that FA hasn't showed back up yet, the decision is still in the future. I am going to vote for the C.G. on this topic. My reasons:

1. The C.G. has needed various "re-chainings." His ability to affect the world therefore waxes and wanes in a most likely cyclical fashion.
2. Kruppe reads a book about the chainings in GotM or MoI in Darujhistan, the only mention about chainings not by gods.
3. K'rul is based out of Darujhistan.
4. Karsa is in Darujhistan.
5. The Tyrant is coming.
6. Karsa has to kill a god.
7. Picker has gone to get all the War Gods, and she still needs vengeance, so she'll be back to Darujhistan, perhaps with Gods a plenty in tow.
8. Karsa is going to either kill or release the C.G. from his chains, him being a "chain-breaker" and all that jazz. That is his "big world-shattering" decision.

So, there's the logic. Fairly flawed, but could also possibly flow together. The one big flaw is that the C.G.'s arc seems to be the "main" arc of the story, and evidently the "Tyrant" and "Karsa" arcs are transferring over to ICE. Oh well, that's my 2 cents.

[Blend]

Grief, on Oct 1 2008, 06:33 PM, said:

The coin with the tyrant on it has a human face.

That's right, and there's a link with the coins that Kallor has with his head on them... So there's another link to Kallor being the Tyrant everyone is afraid of.... Who knows?

[...]

I though Kallor's curse prevented him from ascending? Wouldn't that rule him out as becoming a god? Or did I just miss something about the nature of ascendancy? I always saw Kallor as something akin to story of Cain always wandering the earth.

[Blend]

..., on Oct 1 2008, 09:51 PM, said:

I though Kallor's curse prevented him from ascending? Wouldn't that rule him out as becoming a god? Or did I just miss something about the nature of ascendancy? I always saw Kallor as something akin to story of Cain always wandering the earth.

Nothing to say that he wasn't the Tyrant of Darujhistan before the curses is there?