[Traveller]

he's an experienced swordsman, but there still seemed quite a lot of emphasis on his regret at having to fight.. like he was fighting the curse. It added a lot more depth to his character, whatever. I 'spose the sword could be CG blessed, he is the Reaver after all.

[Urizen]

Fisher Kel Tath, on Oct 3 2008, 01:39 AM, said:

Pg 911
Picker says "Toblakai, you will be needed."
Karsa: "To do what?"
Picker: "Why, to kill a god"
Karsa: "Which god?"

Yes that's the quote and just before that we read that Karsa made many vows but my question was When did Karsa make a vow to kill a god? the quote above and the passages before was not Karsa vowing to kill a god, merely acknowleding that he made such a vow earlier in his life.

[Urb]

He didn't vow to kill a god (well, maybe he did at one point, but it wasn't phrased that way by Picker). She said he would have to stay in Darujistan so he could kill a god. Because it was the only oppertunity he would get to fullfil an old vow he made.

[Jude]

This isn't really giving my theory on which God Karsa will kill but I feel like I have to ask this anyway. Is no one a little hesitant to believe that this is it for Karsa in the Erikson arc? First of all, Karsa was one of SE's top of the top characters imo. He was a kind of character that I had never seen anything like before. While going through RG, i liked to read him as though I hadn't read any of the previous malazan books. If I had no idea who Karsa Orlong was when he was introduced to Letheras, I would have just thought of him as this arrogant tough guy who thought he could handle Rhulad but was in way over his head. Afterall, they had Iccy there to handle the emperor of a thousand deaths, right? Ofcourse, knowing who Karsa was, I knew that this was not the case and that he indeed could and probably would take Rhulad down. The way Karsa acts makes it seem like he's just one of those retarded muscles that thinks he's way awesomer than he is. What makes him so different from characters like that is that he actually IS that awesome. Anyway, I just think that Karsa's character was something kind of revolutionary; pure, earned confidence. And for SE to give something like that up before he's done his story seems weird. He also seemed to be one of the most relevant characters in the books. Afterall, it has been only him and Dev showing up for every single one of the last four installments, and he seems to be the character that has the most badass potential future (all the vows he has made and things that have been said or thought about him)

That said, I find it really unlikely that SE will completely stop with him and just hand him over to ICE, nothing against the latter. What I could see happening is that the Tyrant arc will happen before the events of tCG and Karsa will do his thing in Darujhistan and then head back into the Erikson world for the last book. Does this seem unreasonable? I hope not. haha.

[Blend]

Jude, on Oct 11 2008, 12:42 AM, said:

This isn't really giving my theory on which God Karsa will kill but I feel like I have to ask this anyway. Is no one a little hesitant to believe that this is it for Karsa in the Erikson arc? First of all, Karsa was one of SE's top of the top characters imo. He was a kind of character that I had never seen anything like before. While going through RG, i liked to read him as though I hadn't read any of the previous malazan books. If I had no idea who Karsa Orlong was when he was introduced to Letheras, I would have just thought of him as this arrogant tough guy who thought he could handle Rhulad but was in way over his head. Afterall, they had Iccy there to handle the emperor of a thousand deaths, right? Ofcourse, knowing who Karsa was, I knew that this was not the case and that he indeed could and probably would take Rhulad down. The way Karsa acts makes it seem like he's just one of those retarded muscles that thinks he's way awesomer than he is. What makes him so different from characters like that is that he actually IS that awesome. Anyway, I just think that Karsa's character was something kind of revolutionary; pure, earned confidence. And for SE to give something like that up before he's done his story seems weird. He also seemed to be one of the most relevant characters in the books. Afterall, it has been only him and Dev showing up for every single one of the last four installments, and he seems to be the character that has the most badass potential future (all the vows he has made and things that have been said or thought about him)

That said, I find it really unlikely that SE will completely stop with him and just hand him over to ICE, nothing against the latter. What I could see happening is that the Tyrant arc will happen before the events of tCG and Karsa will do his thing in Darujhistan and then head back into the Erikson world for the last book. Does this seem unreasonable? I hope not. haha.

I'm still not convinced that Karsa will have anything to do with the Tyrant arc... That's just misdirection. The Tyrant arc will almost surely be left to ICE, but you're right in that Karsa will most likely show up in the next couple of books... I figure we'll get hints of the Tyrant storyline throughout DoD and TCG and then ICE will pick up the threads that SE has left!

[Lisheo]

I personally would like to see Raest and Karsa team up to kill the Tyrant

[Cazriel]

what about shadowthrone?
karsa is the only oine who wont wait hear what shadowthrone says first before he acts,
shadowthrone manipulates and karsa wont be manipulated

[Lisheo]

If Shadowthrone was the Tyrant, he would have taken more of an interest in Darujhistan in GotM, methinks. Also, he's said before that he thinks big, bigger than a mortal empire.

[Shryval]

My crazy theory re The Tyrant:

It's Chaur. Or at least, it will be, once his brain reassembles itself (something about sparks of intellect exploring dark places)

We've seen he can go postal, and he's more than he seems. Would be very SE to take an innocent simpleton and transform them utterly.

[Jude]

Aw, I was hoping that Chaur's brain seemingly healing into a normal brain was a wonnnderful ending to the chaur/barathol experience. Too bad he has to go and be the tyrant now.

[Lisheo]

Why would the Tyrant be a retarded guy from 7C, what link could he possibly have with Darujhistan lol?

[Osric]

I don't really see this either. Chaur is just really strong, bit of a stereotype for mentally ill people, but explainable by the fact that well, if youre really too dumb to do much then they probably made him do all the heavy work all his life so that made him fairly strong. He got healed but does that mean he's darujistans tyrant? I don't really see anything supporting this, maybe he is more than he seems but maybe he's just a normal man that's always been mentally handicapped.

[Jude]

Hahaha yeah I highly doubt he's the tyrant. I was just being sassy.

[polishgenius]

Grief, on Oct 2 2008, 06:05 PM, said:

Karsa wouldnt stand a chance against K'rul, imo.
Unless you think a magic resistant, skilled with the sword, huge fighter, could take on the chaos born, warren creating, soletaken eleint that is K'rul.

Karsas resistant to magic, but not that resistant. A mage traps him. He would get magic-pwned by the likes of Rake, K'rul, Draconus etc.

When he was trapped by the mage it was a lot earlier in his development, though.

[K'Chain Bull'shite]

Karsa has become a God, it's stated outright in Reaper's Gale. Also, SE has said that an Ascendant with worshippers is, in effect, a God, whether s/he likes it or not, ie. Anomander Rake and Dessembrae. Deniers, they're called. Now, imagine the impact Karsa's going to have on the Teblor and the Tarthenal, let alone the other people he'll encounter. He'll have worshippers whether he wants them or not. I think Samar already worships him in a way, she can't help herself. He's just THAT COOL

supporting quotes, because I so love them:

Quote

Tehol:So tell me, Bugg, why was Ublala so eager to talk to this true blood Tarthenal?”
Bugg: “He wishes to discover, I imagine, if the warrior is a god.”
Tehol: “A what?”
Bugg: “A new god, I mean. Or an ascendant, to be more precise. I doubt there are woshippers involved. Yet.”

Bugg/Mael basically admits that Karsa is an Ascendant.

Quote

Bugg: "Take care of yourself, Ublala Pung, and 'ware your new god – he is much more than he seems."

So Karsa is an Ascendant with at least one worshipper at this point.

Quote

The ghosts gathered, pure-blooded and mixed-bloods, spanning centuries upon centuries and awake after so long.
And Old Hunch Arbat showed them their new god. And then showed them, with the power of his blood, the way through.

And then the Toblakai spirits rush to do Karsa's bidding in dealing with Rhulad. Pretty conclusive, imo.

Add Karsa's indomitable will to his nascent godhood and I'm personally sure he has a good chance to take out any entity that happens across his path.

This post has been edited by Bre'nigan: 17 October 2008 - 12:58 AM

[Jude]

Yeah Karsa is forsure a God by now, if a very very young one. I definitely agree with you, Bre. And I'm also wondering if there is any force left in the world that could take him down. I mean that seriously. You could argue that there are alot more powerful people than him, but I get the sense that Karsa is unstoppable

[Trull's son]

i disagree. karsa cannot beat any entity that stands before him. he is awestruck by dassem's skill alone. say dassem and well, i dont know maybe skinner say, both face off against karsa. that is how hamburger is made at McD's my friend. He is badass, but not that good..yet.

[muco]

Regarding Karsa and Magic...tough one. The first part of HOC he sure does get captured by a mage but towards the end he could shrug off magic that trapped a Jaghut!

In TTH, Shadowthrone observes Karsa resisting sorcery. If it was a partial one or if Karsa's resistance to magic is not so uncommon attribute, the observation by Shadowthrone is a bit over the top.

Karsa is not the best swordsman around but I doubt it would make a difference. Like people noted, its his attitude. Come on...this guy walked into a group of Hounds of Shadow itching for a fight.

[HoundofDreams]

Ok, this is all very simple. Karsa vowed to free the Crippled God, and then kill him. I'm not certain which book, but I remember the vow. I think, possibly, it might have been in Shaik's camp when he killed the priest of the Crippled God that was mutilating young women. But again, I'm not sure. In any case, I sincerely doubt it'd be anyone other than the CG. Of the suggestions I've found on here, the only one I found remotely plausible was K'rul, which no one stopped to discuss. Possibility: K'rul, in danger of being usurped, or possessed, by the CG, must be killed to eliminate this possibility? Who knows. Erikson pretty much bitchslapped me with this last book, although I can proudly say I saw what he planned every once in a while (after mulling it over for a few hours before bed, conspiracy theories flying free) but for the most part I was stunned and pleased and confused and blown away.

So, the truth is, I don't care what God Karsa goes after. I want to see how he interracts with his daughters. What happens with Samar Dev and the god she imprisoned in her knife. How Karsa handles waiting to return to the Teblor (which I feel like I've been waiting for for forever), and a thousand other things involving him, Hood, the Seguleh, Red Mask, Udinaas and his son, the Bonehunters and their transformed personages and all the rest. Damn Erikson, damn him, damn him for the drug he sells. Reader's addiction's a real pain.

[Jude]

HoundofDreams, on Oct 17 2008, 12:39 AM, said:

Ok, this is all very simple. Karsa vowed to free the Crippled God, and then kill him. I'm not certain which book, but I remember the vow. I think, possibly, it might have been in Shaik's camp when he killed the priest of the Crippled God that was mutilating young women. But again, I'm not sure. In any case, I sincerely doubt it'd be anyone other than the CG. Of the suggestions I've found on here, the only one I found remotely plausible was K'rul, which no one stopped to discuss. Possibility: K'rul, in danger of being usurped, or possessed, by the CG, must be killed to eliminate this possibility? Who knows. Erikson pretty much bitchslapped me with this last book, although I can proudly say I saw what he planned every once in a while (after mulling it over for a few hours before bed, conspiracy theories flying free) but for the most part I was stunned and pleased and confused and blown away.

So, the truth is, I don't care what God Karsa goes after. I want to see how he interracts with his daughters. What happens with Samar Dev and the god she imprisoned in her knife. How Karsa handles waiting to return to the Teblor (which I feel like I've been waiting for for forever), and a thousand other things involving him, Hood, the Seguleh, Red Mask, Udinaas and his son, the Bonehunters and their transformed personages and all the rest. Damn Erikson, damn him, damn him for the drug he sells. Reader's addiction's a real pain.

That's true actually. SE really threw us for a loop with Karsa. Up until that ONE line "To kill a god" or whatever, everyone was 100% on that Karsa's part in the series was to raise the Toblakai army and do his thing with them there guys. Now, with just one line, we seem to have completely forgotten about the Tob army and it's all about Karsa's role in Darujhistan. This, I think, goes to further that Karsa will definitely be around in the last two Erikson books, even if it means that they just take place after the Tyrant plot line that ICE is handling. He's come too far as a character with a future to just be dropped like that by his author. If Orlong isn't playing a major role in the climax of the CG arc, then his huge story line and character development in the preceeding books is almost moot, in my opinion.