Malazan Empire: Mafia 27: The Escape of the Benses (Game Thread) - Malazan Empire

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Mafia 27: The Escape of the Benses (Game Thread)

#321 Guest_Tennes_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:42 PM

Shadow;374801 said:

OK, just got confirmation, no evil paired people, that sucks, I knew Omtose was evil, oh well, just goes to show, first impessions arent always right. So Omtose, are you and Tennes gonna get the lynch, or are you gonna let time expire, while you continue to push for m lynch, there is plenty of time for that tomorrow, you know.


no rush - want to hear from ruse, he may reveal or something. people need to calm down, we have like two hours.
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#322 Guest_Path-Shaper_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:46 PM

2:15 to be exact, which is a good time to remind all those concerned about the beauty of provisionals
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#323 Guest_Mockra_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:46 PM

Shadow;374811 said:

I just wanted confirmaion, I got it, end of story.


You should understand my motivation for questioning you.

Since it should be team scum who are going to try and discredit our validity at every turn...no?
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#324 Guest_Shadow_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:49 PM

Mockra;374815 said:

You should understand my motivation for questioning you.

Since it should be team scum who are going to try and discredit our validity at every turn...no?


But surely you understand why i asked the question, if not here is why, no one else asked.
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#325 Guest_Barghast_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:51 PM

I am here and around till Night, if we need me to switch. But to be honest I'm not sure I'd switch to Shadow. I'd like to hear some explanations but I'm not completely convinced by him scummy behaviour so not sure if i'd switch to Shadow or not at this point. I'd prefer Ruse.
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#326 Guest_Liosan_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 12:54 PM

I'm not convinced about the Fener case. Although I don't really understand his explanation, I don't think there's enough evidence of him being scum for the time being.

Ruse outing the lovers could maybe be a rookie mistake - either as a new innocent player or someone that hasn't been a killer before.

Shadow is making noises on my scum radar. I can't help but wonder if Shadow is UB and noticed the message Mockra left, and that's why he's been going after Omtose. But on the other hand, he's been going after Omtose since the beginning, so maybe that's not a good argument.

Back to Ruse then. I want to give him a chance to reveal, but I am definitely willing to vote for him.
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#327 Guest_Shadow_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:19 PM

Omtose;374399 said:

Got a few minutes, time to answer some of the things thrown my way since I left.

First underlined bit: I haven't pushed any case on Ruse. I voted and gave a reason. Never have I called for others to vote Ruse and I haven't been hounding everything he says as I would be doing if I was trying to push his lynch.

Second underlined bit: Instead of looking for scummy play? My vote for Ruse was based on scummy play. Weakly scummy, I know (I have never said otherwise), but scummy non-the-less.

Third underlined bit: Lynching for the sake of getting a lynch is something I have never suggested or advocated at any point. Ever.

Fourth underlined bit: I never said for more information on day 2. I said for information (and maybe that was misinterpreted), but I meant now, in the form of discussion, reactions and responses - as mentioned above.



1. You started the case on Ruse, at that time, it seemed as if you were jumping on him for asking a WIFOM question. I myself might have asked this question, and could see you attacking me, therefore, it appeared to me that you were singling him out for the lynch.

2. A WIFOM statement is scumm play? Since when. Unproductive and a waste of time, absolutely, but scummy? That is a new one for me. Granted since then he has done other things, but again, this was then and I am presenting a defense.

3. You said you loved trains and that you realized that (ocasionally), that day 1 weak case sticks, thus telling me(since yours was the first serious case of the day) that you wanted an easy lynch on Ruse.

All of these things weren't straw manninig or whatever, they were things that I saw as scum like behavior and I wanted to lynch you. It may in turn get me lynched, but I stand by it, it was as solid as a case can get on day 1.
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#328 Guest_Path-Shaper_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:20 PM

It is day 1, 1 hours and 40 minutes left

15 players alive, 8 to lynch and to go to night

2 votes Shadow (Omtose, Tennes)
1 vote Omtose (Ruse)
2 votes Fener (Gamelon, Kaschan)
6 votes Ruse (Mockra, Barghast, D'riss, Hoods Path, Fener, Shadow)

4 have not voted (Galain, Liosan, Serc, Telas)
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#329 Guest_Serc_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:22 PM

Ok I am here, I have skimmed the thread since we have just a couple hours left. I have some stuff I need to get done at work... will be back soon to have a discussion on the reveals and any 'cases'.
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#330 Guest_Liosan_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:30 PM

Okay, if Ruse isn't back when it's 1 hour left, I'll vote.

Edit: actually, make that 30 minutes, just to give him some time.
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#331 Guest_Tennes_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:41 PM

i will be here until night, so i am holding off, i dislike the thought of voting off a player who doesnt get to respond.
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#332 Guest_Omtose_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:42 PM

Shadow;374824 said:

1. You started the case on Ruse, at that time, it seemed as if you were jumping on him for asking a WIFOM question. I myself might have asked this question, and could see you attacking me, therefore, it appeared to me that you were singling him out for the lynch.

2. A WIFOM statement is scumm play? Since when. Unproductive and a waste of time, absolutely, but scummy? That is a new one for me. Granted since then he has done other things, but again, this was then and I am presenting a defense.

3. You said you loved trains and that you realized that (ocasionally), that day 1 weak case sticks, thus telling me(since yours was the first serious case of the day) that you wanted an easy lynch on Ruse.

All of these things weren't straw manninig or whatever, they were things that I saw as scum like behavior and I wanted to lynch you. It may in turn get me lynched, but I stand by it, it was as solid as a case can get on day 1.


So no quotes to substantiate you claims about me. Just more rhetoric. I'm so suprised.

I will respond to it anyway.

1. I was jumping on him for asking a wifom question. This point was about you claiming I was pushing for his lynch, which I did not do. You have not answered this point.

2. Wifom is scummy. Always has been, always will be. This is because there is no logical resolution to it, so it distracts the town, which benefits no one but the killers.

3. Once again, you have not addressed the point. You accused me of wanting a lynch just for the sake of a lynch - which has naver been true. Just for the record: I did not want a quick or easy lynch, I just wanted people to know that I take all my bandwagons seriously.

4. ... o right, you left out the fourth bit.

It is strawmanning because you accused me of:

Pushing a weak lynch
Not looking at scummy play
Wanting a lynch just for the sake of a lynch
and of justifying a lynch with, "But we'll get information from it tomorrow."

None of which is true.
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#333 Guest_Gamelon_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:44 PM

Ok I am here and getting caught up.
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#334 Guest_Galain_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:44 PM

Telas;374770 said:

For the record, I still don't see why Ruse, if he were UB, would knowingly risk it all like this. I don't buy for one second that it was a sacrifice reveal of another player's pairing. My suspects remain Galain and to an extent, Fener. Can someone remind me please, what is the suspicion of Shadow? Is this that whole strawwhatsit thing?


How about giving me something to defend against, unless this is just a gut thing:D
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#335 Guest_Telas_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:49 PM

Galain;374836 said:

How about giving me something to defend against, unless this is just a gut thing:D


Sorry, Galain, at the moment it is just a gut thing :Rodeo: If you like, I can make a case on you later? :admin: At the moment, it's just some reactions at the beginning of the game to Kaschan, but I'll look over all your posts and come to a more intellectually-based conclusion when I do. Sound fair?

The best argument I've seen for voting for Ruse is from Tennes, when they say that we should just get rid of them in order to sort out that business. I.e. he's not evil, but he's taking too much attention away from the evils with what happened. As it is, it looks like enough people are willing to vote for him at the end anyway, so I won't be party to it, and will not vote.
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#336 Guest_Mockra_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:55 PM

Telas;374837 said:

The best argument I've seen for voting for Ruse is from Tennes, when they say that we should just get rid of them in order to sort out that business. I.e. he's not evil, but he's taking too much attention away from the evils with what happened. As it is, it looks like enough people are willing to vote for him at the end anyway, so I won't be party to it, and will not vote.


Keeping your nose as clean as possible i see, duly noted.
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#337 Guest_Omtose_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:55 PM

Right, I have to go now and probably won't be back before the day ends. Therefore, as promised:

Unvote, Vote Ruse
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#338 Guest_Shadow_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:56 PM

Omtose;374833 said:

So no quotes to substantiate you claims about me. Just more rhetoric. I'm so suprised.

I will respond to it anyway.

1. I was jumping on him for asking a wifom question. This point was about you claiming I was pushing for his lynch, which I did not do. You have not answered this point.

2. Wifom is scummy. Always has been, always will be. This is because there is no logical resolution to it, so it distracts the town, which benefits no one but the killers.

3. Once again, you have not addressed the point. You accused me of wanting a lynch just for the sake of a lynch - which has naver been true. Just for the record: I did not want a quick or easy lynch, I just wanted people to know that I take all my bandwagons seriously.

4. ... o right, you left out the fourth bit.

It is strawmanning because you accused me of:

Pushing a weak lynch
Not looking at scummy play
Wanting a lynch just for the sake of a lynch
and of justifying a lynch with, "But we'll get information from it tomorrow."

None of which is true.



I left out the fourth bit, because you said it was probably a misunderstanding, I was content to leave it at that. You want quotes, ok, but I already quoted you in several posts to back my suspicions. Anyway, here is what I think, if I had quoted all of your posts this would have been constued as a case against you, not a defense. i believe you are paired, so I have no need to build a case. I am defending myself against your accusations. You think I was straw-manning if you want I can show you why I came to the assumption you were scummy, but I feel that I already established this. I was wrong. SO if you still want me to show you my case, I will, however it will not get us anywhere, because it is the same case as before, which you will then say is straw manning, in short, I don't know how to defend against the accusation of straw-manning. But I will try.
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#339 Guest_Tennes_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:57 PM

thats not eight is it? I said i would be on until night begins.
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#340 Guest_Gamelon_*

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Posted 26 August 2008 - 01:58 PM

Mockra;374779 said:

Scum coding is just daft.


But not unheard of. However I am willing to believe your reveals for now. Since I don't want this day to end with out a lynch I will drop my vote on Ruse right before the end of day.
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