what do you think of shadowthrone ?

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what do you think of shadowthrone ?

#1 haroos

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Posted 08 June 2008 - 01:02 PM

is he the real hero of the books or is he a villain of sorts ?
as of book 5, I have yet to decide whether he is good or bad.
there are also hints that he has planned things in advance, could he be that smart as to have done such planning that would keep on after his ascention ?

#2 Nequam

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Posted 08 June 2008 - 02:08 PM

I'm sure you should start to be noticing that there are not many people in these books that are "good" or "bad". Try searching for some threads that already exist about things like this first.
...but yeah I'm sure he has incredibly detailed plans in advance. He is that type of character.

#3 Battalion

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Posted 10 July 2008 - 08:31 AM

haroos;325255 said:

He's neither good nor bad, I think, but he's a major player in things to come. Shadowthrone is one of my most liked people in the series. I like the way seems to be a little bit more insane every time we see him.

#4 Dolorous Menhir

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Posted 10 July 2008 - 05:40 PM

Shadowthrone is my hero.

#5 Raymond Luxury Yacht

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Posted 10 July 2008 - 10:34 PM

ST has it all planned out, except when he doesn't. In that case, he adapts well and makes it seem it was all part of the plan.

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#6 HoosierDaddy

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Posted 11 July 2008 - 08:37 PM

haroos;325255 said:

I believe the true heroes are the Bridgeburners. Besides them, I think everybody has a little light and dark in them.

Trouble arrives when the opponents to such a system institute its extreme opposite, where individualism becomes godlike and sacrosanct, and no greater service to any other ideal (including community) is possible. In such a system rapacious greed thrives behind the guise of freedom, and the worst aspects of human nature come to the fore....

#7 Salt-Man Z

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Posted 11 July 2008 - 08:46 PM

Plenty of dark in the Bridgeburners, still. :cool:

"Here is light. You will say that it is not a living entity, but you miss the point that it is more, not less. Without occupying space, it fills the universe. It nourishes everything, yet itself feeds upon destruction. We claim to control it, but does it not perhaps cultivate us as a source of food? May it not be that all wood grows so that it can be set ablaze, and that men and women are born to kindle fires?"
―Gene Wolfe, The Citadel of the Autarch

#8 HoosierDaddy

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Posted 11 July 2008 - 10:00 PM

Salt-Man Z;349843 said:

Plenty of dark in the Bridgeburners, still. :cool:

Yes, but good dark Serve good purposes dark.

#9 Hokonoso

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Posted 03 August 2008 - 06:16 PM

cept High King Kallor, now he's a badass that is pure evil with not even a hint of good. which is why he is one of my fav characters, everyone else is a shade of grey but not good ol kallor, he's pure evil and perfect!

#10 Ammanas

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Posted 21 August 2008 - 07:20 PM

He's my fav character. Such a brilliant schemer but so emotionally unstable.
I just reread HoC and came across a conversation between Lostara and Dancer revealing the origins of the ST/QB hatred. It seems QB let Bidithal escape instead of killing him.

I wouldn't be surprised if Dancer kills him in the end. There is also a passage where Dancer makes it pretty clear that he has his own agenda and "serves" ST because it suits his agenda.

#11 prq

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Posted 22 August 2008 - 01:39 PM

Not sure if Cotillion would kill ST... or vice versa. I definitely agree their alliance won't last forever - and ST might use his Magus or his hounds to sort it out.

#12 Scarecrow

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Posted 18 December 2008 - 10:29 AM

ST is just very ambitious, and lots of people don't like that, so they fight against him, because they don't want to be ruled by anyone. But even Rake says at some point that living under the rule of the Malazans, hence ST, wouldn't be such a bad thing

#13 The Drum

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Posted 18 December 2008 - 11:06 PM

ST reminds me of a hyperactive excentric uncle, you like him cos he's fun but don't understand what he's on about half the time!!!

Dem bones, Dem Bones, Dem Dry Bones.

#14 D'rek

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 04:38 AM

From my personal list of insignificant things that make you ponder:

Why does Shadowthrone go by 'Shadowthrone' and not Ammanas? The only person who ever seems to call him Ammanas/Ameanas with anything close to regularity is Cotillion. Meanwhile, every other ascendant goes by their 'ascendant name' (like Anomander Rake) rather then their title (like Knight/Son of Darkness). Seriously, he's the only god we ever see addressed who goes by his title in regular conversation! It's baffling! Though I suppose that does fit his persona...

worrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.

#15 Rainman

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 09:51 PM

D'rek, on Dec 19 2008, 11:38 PM, said:

The same could be said of the Queen of Dreams. The only one we have seen call her by name (T'riss) was L'oric. Everyone else so far uses her title.

#16 D'rek

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 10:22 PM

Rainman, on Feb 9 2009, 04:51 PM, said:

D'rek, on Dec 19 2008, 11:38 PM, said:

The same could be said of the Queen of Dreams. The only one we have seen call her by name (T'riss) was L'oric. Everyone else so far uses her title.

Nope. Queen of Dreams is her ascendant name. Her house title would be Queen of Light, and she has occassional references as The Enchantress. T'riss was her name as a mortal, akin to Shadowthrone's name as a mortal being Kellanved

worrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.

#17 Aptorian

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 10:52 PM

Hmm. I think Shadowthrone isn't actually his name but his tittle. His ascendant name is ammanas. Like Cotillions tittle is The Rope.

Logically that could mean that Queen of Dreams is also a tittle and her ascendant name is still Triss.

#18 D'rek

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Posted 09 February 2009 - 11:12 PM

It could but it doesn't. T'riss comes from when someone is yarning about "back in the good ol' days, Rake, Brood and a mortal named T'riss who would one day become the Queen of Dreams..." yadayadayada, though Cot. uses it again, once, for no particular reason in tBH when she's not around. Still, Shadowthrone is Ammanas' position in High House Shadow, just like the Queen of Dreams' is Queen of Light and Cotillion's is The Rope. It's just weird that ST always goes by the latter and everyone else goes by the former.

worrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.

#19 Urizen

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Posted 10 February 2009 - 09:41 AM

D'rek, on Feb 10 2009, 12:12 AM, said:

a small correction; T'riss/Queen of Dreams is not Queen of High House Light but rather Queen of High House Life. The Queen of HHL is unknown.

" Ah, I despair, or I would if I cared enough. No, instead, I will make some ashcakes. Which I will not share."

#20 Skywalker

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Posted 10 February 2009 - 10:04 AM

Quote

Start Pedantic Bear Mode ***

Format: Mortal Name - Ascendant Name - Title - (Other Names)

Kellanved - Ammanas - King of HH Shadow - (Shadowthrone)
Dancer - Cotillion - Assassin of HH Shadow - (The Rope)

You could argue that A/C can be flipped with ST/ Rope or whatever, but their "titles" are King and Assassin of HH Shadow, and their mortal names are what they are.

*** End Pedantic Bear Mode

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