&quot;I am not yet done&quot;

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"I am not yet done"

#41 MTS

Fourth Investiture

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 04:08 AM

No, it was DG. Duiker doesn't appear again after DG until TtH.

The moments in MoI are definitely more poignant, like Whiskeyjack and Itkovian's deaths, Toc the Younger and the siege of Capustan, but I think DG is still a very sad book, as you have many things that are inherently evocative. Baudin's mission and death (and the fact that Felisin was unaware and hated him is tragic in itself), Kulp's death, what you see of Icarium's storyline and plight (and Mappo's dilemma) and the whole Chain of Dogs are very powerful and they're what make the book so awesome.

Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem.

Si hoc adfixum in obice legere potes, et liberaliter educatus et nimis propinquus ades.

#42 WhiskeyJackDaniels

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 09:59 PM

I think another reason MOI is a little but sadder or more emotional than DG is that after everything happens the prologue is basically people moving on and then all of a sudden Duiker speaks up and starts to tell the story of the Chain of Dogs, so you kind of hafta relive that a little bit once its said.

So, you're the historian who survived the Chain of Dogs.
Actually, I didn't.

It seems you stand alone.
It was ever thus.

#43 Seras

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Posted 03 June 2009 - 10:27 PM

it might have been the mood of the story in MoI, it feels like you just get to know the characters really well and it seems like they know they're doomed. the mortal sword's death was pretty cool and sad at the same time, Itkovian's death was really heart-breaking for me

Lives and loves, the gamut of existence was marked by such things. A breaking of paths, the ragged, uneven ever-forward stumble. Blood dried, eventually. Turned to dust. The corpses of kings were laid down and sealed in darkness and set away, to be forgotten. Graves were dug for fallen soldiers, vast pits like mouths in the earth, opened in hunger, and all the bodies were tumbled down, each exhaling a last gasp of lime dust. Survivors grieved, for a time, and looked upon empty rooms and empty beds, the scattering of possessions no-one possessed any longer, and wondered what was to come, what would be written anew on the wiped-clean slate. Wondering, how can I go on?

#44 caladanbrood

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Posted 04 June 2009 - 02:06 PM

I tend to agree, MoI was just pitched in a way that made it a bit more tragic. Both had overwhelming odds, but maybe MoI had the advantage of characters we had already seen before then being flung into that situation, as opposed to brand new ones like in DhG. That said, the Grey Swords stole the show in that book, and they were brand new, so maybe that has nothing to do with it.

Thing is with the Chain of Dogs, you've got Duiker, Coltaine, Nil/Nether, Bult, a few of the regular soldiers who you can really connect to. In MoI, virtually every character is like that. From the top with WJ, Itkovian, Rake, all the BBs, Dujek, Brukalian, Silverfox, Toc etc. Also it doesn't have a distraction on the scale of the whole Felisin story, which could be to it's advantage...

O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde; keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi.

#45 Salt-Man Z

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Posted 05 June 2009 - 04:17 PM

caladanbrood, on Jun 4 2009, 09:06 AM, said:

Also it doesn't have a distraction on the scale of the whole Felisin story, which could be to it's advantage...

No, instead it has the Mhybe.

"Here is light. You will say that it is not a living entity, but you miss the point that it is more, not less. Without occupying space, it fills the universe. It nourishes everything, yet itself feeds upon destruction. We claim to control it, but does it not perhaps cultivate us as a source of food? May it not be that all wood grows so that it can be set ablaze, and that men and women are born to kindle fires?"
―Gene Wolfe, The Citadel of the Autarch

#46 caladanbrood

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Posted 05 June 2009 - 06:16 PM

Personally I didn't have a problem with the Mhybe.

But regardless, she was just another part of the same story, not a completely seperate story arc in the same book... so the possible annoyance can be forgiven

O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde; keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi.

#47 Salt-Man Z

My pen halts, though I do not

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Posted 05 June 2009 - 08:44 PM

Cal, we must be the only two on the boards that didn't mind the Mhybe.

#48 caladanbrood

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Posted 05 June 2009 - 11:42 PM

It's nice to know I'm not completely alone!

Solidarity, bruvver.

O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde; keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi.

#49 Geoffray

Rory "The bloody last Centurion" Williams

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Posted 06 June 2009 - 02:51 PM

Third one

. The Mhybe doesn't disturb me (and it's ending was interresting IMO).

Sorry for my english ;), I'm french :P

Quote

I've came with a message and a question. A message from The Doctor and a question from me. Where Is My Wife?!

Rory "God himself" Williams

#50 MTS

Fourth Investiture

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Posted 06 June 2009 - 04:01 PM

Fourth. I didn't love her, but I didn't want to knife her in her sleep either.

Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem.

Si hoc adfixum in obice legere potes, et liberaliter educatus et nimis propinquus ades.

#51 caladanbrood

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Posted 06 June 2009 - 07:02 PM

Wow. The seedy underbelly of people who don't really mind the mhybe all that much is showing itself.

This is excellent news

O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde; keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi.

#52 Slow Ben

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Posted 06 June 2009 - 07:39 PM

Meh, I didnt despise her, she was just one of those characters that was just there. Not good or bad.

I've always been crazy but its kept me from going insane.

#53 Seras

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Posted 08 June 2009 - 03:54 AM

one thing that confused me was at the end where the Mhybe meets Togg & Fanderay, does she own that dream-scape or is it shared between T&F and her?

This post has been edited by Erayle: 08 June 2009 - 03:54 AM

#54 MTS

Fourth Investiture

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Posted 08 June 2009 - 04:05 AM

Well, like someone said, "there's power in dreaming". The Mhybe's dreaming created the landscape, and she lives there as well, but she also shares it with the Beast Hold, as a way for the Beast Hold to come back into use with the return of T&F. So it's a bit of both.

Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem.

Si hoc adfixum in obice legere potes, et liberaliter educatus et nimis propinquus ades.

#55 coltainereborn

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 04:58 PM

Why do people hate the Mhybe? Thought her story went well with the tragic theme in MOI- do people forget she wasn't always a crabby old woman, but a young one?

#56 beru

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 05:35 PM

and it was BOOOOOOOORING

"im standing at the ege of the abyss help me please!!"
"im standing at the ege of the abyss help me please!!"
"im standing at the ege of the abyss help me please!!"
"im standing at the ege of the abyss help me please!!"

i want to see this world where T'lan imass kneels

#57 MTS

Fourth Investiture

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Posted 11 June 2009 - 05:41 PM

beru's got it. It was tragic, and fit with the whole theme of MoI, but it dragged ON AND ON AND ON AND ON. There's only so much whining we can take before it becomes not tragic but incredibly annoying. That's why people hate the Mhybe.

Plus it was boring.

This post has been edited by Mappo's Travelling Sack: 11 June 2009 - 05:41 PM

Antiquis temporibus, nati tibi similes in rupibus ventosissimis exponebantur ad necem.

Si hoc adfixum in obice legere potes, et liberaliter educatus et nimis propinquus ades.

#58 Beliar

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Posted 15 June 2009 - 03:39 PM

you hit the nail on the head, i am proud to say i hated her after the 3rd moan about how shes the victim and everybody is patronising. god shut up woman!

#59 Mirthmonkey

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 06:18 PM

"I am not yet done." -- me on passing page 800 in MoI

It is a really good book, but man these are long ones.

Quote

He tells his 2nd in command that without their deaths there would be no betrayal

How noble? They know the Mask has betrayed them and they're going to get ambushed, but they have to go get themselves slaughtered to make it really a betrayal? I thought that logic was just stupid.

#60 beru

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Posted 18 June 2009 - 07:58 PM

it would have ended up word vs word and since they are mercenaryes (or swordhakers) they dont get that much credit they needed a warm corpse to be evidence

i want to see this world where T'lan imass kneels