[SiriusL]

Aptorian;297448 said:

@Sirius
Your assumption is faulty. The first empire existed for a looong time, perhaps as long as 30.000 years seeing as there is talk of the first empire existing 100.000 years ago and 130.000 years ago, these could of course be two very different civilizations, but the important thing is that it was old. (I think I'm mixing up colony dates with FE dates, but what ever)

@kmmontandon
The deal that upset the Namless ones could very well be the creation of the Hounds of Shadow,

I'm not sure how my assumption is faulty, unless you're saying that the T'lan Imass First Empire does not predate the human First Empire. Onrack clearly says they encountered the Hounds of Shadow during the time of the Imass FE. I guess the Imass First Empire could have existed after the fall of the human First Empire, but I don't think that's the case.

Don't get me wrong--I like your theory that Dessi created the Hounds of Shadow from the Deragoth, but it doesn't make sense with the quote. Here's where you say, "The timeline doesn't matter."

[Aptorian]

Hmm, after rechecking I see I mistoke the Human empire for the Imass... Well, that's peculiar indeed.

[SiriusL]

Just to confuse matters more:

BH UK Tpb, on p8, said:

'T'rolbarahl, demonic creations by the hand of Dessimbelackis himself, long before the Dark Hounds took shape in the Emperor's mind'...... 'He (dejim nebrahl) fed on some of them (Soletaken and D'ivers) as well, for he was smarter than they and quicker, and had not the Deragoth stumbled onto his trail....the Dark Hounds had a master in those days, a clever master, who excelled in ensnaring sorceries and, once decided upon a task, he would not relent.'

Dejim sort of implies that Dessimbelackis created the Hounds of Darkness.

Other times we hear it's a pact. Other times it's an alliance.

Again those seven Deragoth must be special, and somehow different from your standard issue Deragoth?

[Sinisdar Toste]

perhaps dessimbelackis created the hounds of darkness, from the deragoth somehow? the deragoth are already there, and using some kind of ritual he infuses them with a "darkness" his own soul maybe? and they become some kind of magical symbiote? kind of far-fetched, true, like why would dessi want to merge with seven ancient beasts? unless he could slave them to his will but that would be hellishly hard to accomlish, i think.

[Lisheo]

Toste, I like the way you are thinking, man.

[Sexy Beast]

i always thought that the hounds of shadow were the shadows of the deragoth or there souls so to speak. thats maybe why the hounds of shadow that went through the gate in dragnipur were returned to their bodies inside the statues, and why the remaining deragoth were chasing after the hounds. to absorb them. got no clue why kurald galain would return them to their bodies really. maybe they were negated (as apsalara talks about the cold) and reconstituted into their bodies? dont know if that makes sense to anyone.

maybe dessimbellackis couldnt enslave the deragoth themselves but he could seal them in those statues and strip them of their shadows or souls, creating the hounds of shadow which he could control?

then again couldnt dessimbellackis transform into seven hounds himself or something like that? I dont really know. we dont know enough as has been said before. thats what ive thought about it anyway. feel free to rip apart

[Blub]

My theory on the hounds is as follows.
By the time of Dessimbelackis only 7 Deragoth are left and even they are being outclassed by the ascendants.
Dessy makes a deal with them and splits his soul and sticks the pieces into the Hounds.
After he dies, or because he dies, the Hounds' souls lose their bodies and are eventually 'caught' by a people in the warren(-piece) that later becomes the Nascent.
By worshipping this people manages to imprison them in huge statues. But because the Nascent is a piece of Emurlahn the shadows of the
statues become alive and the souls flee into them. These shadows become the Hounds of Shadow and are bound to Shadow.