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Stormy, Gesler, Sinn...A crazy theory

#41 User is offline   D'rek 

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Posted 02 January 2008 - 05:29 PM

Ezikeil;235774 said:

No where in the books, that I am aware of, is there any reference to a "human" elient soletaken. It seems to only effect those of the elder races. That may be why L'oric can not change into a dragon, his mom might be a human Ascendant.


Seems to me that the soletaken-eleint trait tends to be passed on only through the mother. Anyone think of any examples to refute this?
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#42 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 02 January 2008 - 05:38 PM

Lisheo;238557 said:

Theres a hold, or Elder God, according to Feather Witch's reading of the Holds, tho.


Fire and Dolmen were at the start of everything, and they are Fulcra, or the Holds' version of Unaligned. elemental forces, personifications, whatever, but nothing saying about a God or Hold of their own.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly. So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.
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#43 User is offline   Mataglap 

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Posted 02 January 2008 - 10:56 PM

skir;238565 said:

Seems to me that the soletaken-eleint trait tends to be passed on only through the mother. Anyone think of any examples to refute this?


Rake. Silchas Ruin. Although Tiam does seem to have been rather fertile.

"Midnight Tides, on Chapter Five", said:

Silchas Ruin. Tiste Andii, who fed in the wake of his brother — fed on Tiam’s blood, and drank deep. Deeper than Anomander Rake by far.


Lack of a specific ancestry rarely matters when it comes to gaining power. Sure, it's one way, but not the only one. Blood is what matters. It was Ganoes touching the Hound's blood in GotM that bound him to the Hounds, so much so that he thinks of them as kin in The Bonehunters.

"The Bonehunters, on Chapter Ten", said:

This carriage was destroyed by two Hounds of Shadow.'

'You are certain?'

I am. I can smell them. My... kin.

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#44 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 02 January 2008 - 11:42 PM

yes but Ganoes is apparently not a true soletaken - much more to be revealed later I'm sure.
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#45 User is offline   Zanth13 

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Posted 03 January 2008 - 05:15 AM

Aptorian;238662 said:

yes but Ganoes is apparently not a true soletaken - much more to be revealed later I'm sure.


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#46 User is offline   Lisheo 

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Posted 03 January 2008 - 11:16 AM

*Veers into spicy chicken meal of some kind*
Rud Ellale is a human soletaken Eleint. And the reason there arent any others is because humanity appeared after the sealing of SD, meaning no delicious red Tiam-juice for them.
*sembles into Lisheo*
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#47 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 03 January 2008 - 12:16 PM

Rud Ellale is half human half Tiste/Eleint ;-)
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly. So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.
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#48 User is offline   Lisheo 

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 10:48 AM

Ah, darn your right... He's a human Liosan Eleint aint he! My bad lol
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#49 User is offline   Sinisdar Toste 

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 01:58 AM

ah i believe he is a human edur soletaken eleint

toste, the things we do know in this series must be definitively and accurately known! else we are doomed!
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#50 User is offline   Lisheo 

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 10:58 AM

But Menandore wasnt edur, I thought?
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#51 User is offline   Sinisdar Toste 

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 12:06 AM

wasnt she the edur goddess sister dawn? all the sisters are edur arent they?
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#52 User is offline   Gothos 

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 02:45 AM

that she's recognized as a goddess by the edur does not imply she's an edur herself.
also, her physique strongly suggests Liosan heritage.
It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly. So that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.
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#53 User is offline   Optimus Prime 

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Posted 06 January 2008 - 02:51 AM

The Tiste Family is still confusing...how all of them are connected and everything....but I agree with Gothos
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#54 User is offline   Lisheo 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 09:30 AM

We should work out the Tiste Family Tree properly... Ill try to get on it tonight :D
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#55 User is offline   Zendog13 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 10:57 AM

Don't, you might get stabbed in the back.
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#56 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:00 AM

There you go:

[ATTACH]3453[/ATTACH]

It would seem that Sukuhl Ankhadu and Menandore are half Liosan. Sheltatha Lore is half Edur and surprisingly Envy and Spite are one quarter Edur.
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#57 User is offline   Sinisdar Toste 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:22 PM

just noticed something about that family tree, osserc has no mother. so either FL can asexually reproduce, Osserc is FL, or some other kind of squirmy thing that we haven't yet heard of happened.
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#58 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:25 PM

If MD can, why can't FL.

More likely Udinaas theory is correct and the three firstborn of MD are also Father Lights and Osserc is probably MDs aswell as FLs. Rakes brother. Rakes Father? Oh the mysteries.
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#59 User is offline   Sinisdar Toste 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:27 PM

weird weird goings on in the shadows of history
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#60 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 09 January 2008 - 11:27 PM

OR FL just created him. You know, being a god and all.

BUT, we can take it from RG that MD and FL created all the Tiste races between them. Even Rake, Ruin, Darist and Osserc. The whole 'light on the outside, dark on the inside' bit Udinaas was talking about.

Makes sense even on a racial scale - TA are light on the inside, and they're emotionally crippled whenever anything happens. TL are dark on the inside, and they're dicks. TE though, they're a mix. They're probably the most balanced Tiste race, as they can be both.
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