[Aptorian]

The killing of all those claws, upwards of 600, wasn't seen as so much of a loss. Someone in BH comments that the claw needed weeding out. There was too many young bloods or semi-talented Claws.

[Dancer+]

Unfortunately some of the better claw would have perished in that attack, unless Laseen had brought a weaker contingent on purpose.

weren't the armoured claw who fought Kalam the best of the best? and because Kalam beat them Pearl panicked and knew he had to end it cowardly.

[Mentalist]

They were Pearl's best--meaning he preferred to use them, and they were some of the strongest physically.
This says nothing about the best mages + i'm sure that the very best Laseen would keep as her bodyguards and make sure even her clawmaster's unaware of how good they were
It's also possible (though I doubt it) that the majority of the Claw at Malaz belonged to the Phantom Glove, and Laseen saw it as a chance to get rid of traitors...

[tharinock]

And remember, Laseen tried to offer Kalam position of clawmaster. He already proved her loyalty to her by not going through with his previous assassination plot, and admitting that when he saw that she was ruling for the good of the empire and not herself than she was fine. Laseen seems to sympathise with Kalam. she also knew, I think, that he would refuse clawmaster. She probably just used him to kill off phantom glove suspects and bad members. it is even possible that Pearl's best were actually phantom glove leaders that laseen used her influence to put against kalam.

[Raraku]

lets not forget that baudin both juniour and senior kicked ass and the Talon mage who was on Drift Avali(spelling) also rocked. the claw must have atleast some people equal to that. or maybe that they had greater numbers and that was sufficiant but i doubt it

[tharinock]

although there is no proof that the talon is actually dead. after all, Baudin junior was a talon member and he was certainly still alive. and he was sent to the mines by tavore to protect felisin, that had nothing to do with the claw. Maybe the talon is not dead, and they are just hiding?

[Aptorian]

Nitpicking but it was Tavore, it was Felisins sister that sent the Talon, the creator of the claw would not be sending Talons anywhere but to Hood.

[Kalahinen]

tharinock;234459 said:

Baudin junior was a talon member and he was certainly still alive. and he was sent to the mines by laseen to protect felisin

Correction, he was sent by Tavore.

[tharinock]

fixed it. sorry, meant to say tavore, but im kind of tired right now.

[Dolorous Menhir]

Baudin's comments on the Talon suggest that few remain, and like him they are second generation Talon born into the organisation. He certainly did not give the impression there was still a functioning leadership, which the appearance of Hawl in HoC did.

Baudin wasn't a legitimate Talon at all really - he had the training from his father, and the signs, but he doesn't seem to have been a member in Dancer's time and he doesn't seem to have been involved in any Talon-Claw intrigues beyond what he had to do to survive.

[tharinock]

then there is always the possibility that all of that was just a cover up to make the claw seem like it truly was dissolved. Most likely I am totally wrong, but you never know (unless you're SE).

[Dancer+]

Unless Laseen is undertaking the greatest trick of all time I doubt it, but it has been proposed in the RotCG synopsis. Is Laseen really as weak as she seems? she could be sacrificing the possibility of the empire to eliminate certain key figures. Rel, Dom (who may both work for the CG), Traveller (who may take out one of the key figures in the battle against the CG), Ereko (potentially). Many other sharks may come to the forefront.

Tayschrenn might have advised Laseen to draw them in, he's interested in the malazan empire as a tool of summoning rather than in its survival, it would certainly add more spice to the story. A bit of Kalloresque action, using the empire as bait.

[Zanth13]

In BH I believe an average claw did pretty well against that guy from the bar who was trying to sneak up on him...

as stated Kalam is deadly as hell he was/is/ a claw.

Kalam was pretty much killed by a claw... twice...

Just because near ascendants/ ascendants kick a bunch of their asses doesn’t mean they suck, they have obviously been useful because they are still around... I haven’t finished NOK but the one chic was afraid of the claw and that’s the most useful weapon there is.


Was the apocalypse goddess imass lady killed by claw??

[Skywalker]

Dancer;234772 said:

Unless Laseen is undertaking the greatest trick of all time I doubt it (snip)

I doubt it too... (potential RG spoiler):

Spoiler

wasn't one of the timeline notes in some POV "Year of Burns Sleep 115X; Last Year of Empress Lasseen's Rule"

This was either in TBH or in RG... anyone remember it, or should I go easy on the coffee again?

[Dolorous Menhir]

No need for spoiler tags, I think it was a chapter-opening passage in BH. It described some events from a future viewpoints, and then said they took place in the last year of Laseen's rule. The description was vague, and the immediate assumption was that the Malaz City riots were the subject, as that's what's happening when the passage appears. But it's not clear that that's the case.

And it's petty, but the series is taking place in the 1160's, not the 1150's.

[Dancer+]

Dolorous Menhir;234819 said:

And it's petty, but the series is taking place in the 1160's, not the 1150's.

A general reminder, or a specific one in reference to something someone said?

[Dolorous Menhir]

Dancer;234823 said:

A general reminder, or a specific one in reference to something someone said?

It's a response to Skywalker. The post immediately before my one.

[Dancer+]

Ah yes, another timeline question. Do we know what year NoK is set?

[thesalus]

The prologue starts in 1154th Year of Burn's Sleep. (Last year of Emperor Kellanved's Reign)

[Mentalist]

yEah, it's same year as the GotM prologue... just several months later, once they clered up the ruins of the Mous riots a bit....