[The Tyrant Lizard]

I take this term to mean to mistakes that pop up in GotM that are not quite in line with the rest of the series. Most authors will have similar problems as these when writing their first novel.

My problem is this; as I understand matters, SE and ICE both formulated the MBofF and most of the characters and ideas before he started writing the books. Did he change his mind after writing GotM having seen it, or did he evolve the world slightly, introducing new ideas?

This wouldn't bother me with any other author, but SE seems like such a genius, with so much foresight in his novels as to - for example - write a tiny sentance in one book and then to refer to it five massive books later, that I wouldn't expect him to overlook anything.

I guess my question is, if they are just natural mistakes that all humans make, why did GotMisms die out with GotM?

[Aptorian]

I think SE has said that there was only few things in GotM he wanted to change for the US editions. Eye colours and Andii gender, etc.

The rest of it is like SE wants it. SE has said that there are intentional discrepancies(sp?) in the books...

[cerveza_fiesta]

more like intentional dis-shut the heck up you overanalyzing dorks-pancies.

or at least that's what he meant to say...

he told me I swear

seriously, I think probly half the stuff we call GotMisms are really just vague and could be tidied up given another 500 pages or so per book. As for the intentional discrepancy part, SE likely just means that he got writing RG, realized some little detail from the first book conflicted slightly and said "aww fuckit" rather than change his entire line of thinking and story line to suit the aforementioned detail.

[Mentalist]

ummm.. yeah, the word "hell" is also supposed to be removed...

[cerveza_fiesta]

or he could write one of those dumbass "guidebooks" like they have for LOTR that explain away every little detail and are written by people who overanalyze other peoples' books for a job.

[Aptorian]

I could totally do that... *steals everything clever ever posted on this forum*

[Crow Clan Baby]

GotM was written many years before the rest of the books, and it was published in pretty much the same form as originally written (there's an ICE quote somewhere that confirms this). It's reasonable to assume that there was some further evolution of the world and characters done in the interim.

[Mentalist]

Cerveza:
he already said that there will be an "Encyclopedia Malazaica", once the series are complete...

[cerveza_fiesta]

kud13;223371 said:

ummm.. yeah, the word "hell" is also supposed to be removed...

done

[GardenGnome]

A far worse GotMism is the magic-deadening aura of the T'lan Imass. Now that was never properly explained...

[cerveza_fiesta]

kud13;223389 said:

Cerveza:
he already said that there will be an "Encyclopedia Malazaica", once the series are complete...

other than the online one?

I doubt I'll read it, I really didn't like the guidebooks for the LOTR series, they kind of took away a lot of the imagin-ey stuff I liked to think about while reading that series.

[Dancer+]

Aptorian;223385 said:

I could totally do that... *steals everything clever ever posted on this forum*

You'd need a pretty good filter to find that stuff

[Mentalist]

"Done"...


LOL, I meant that at one instance in GotM, the word "hell" is used as opposed to "Hood's blank"... and SE admitted that was a mistake, lol

[cerveza_fiesta]

kud13;223398 said:

"Done"...


LOL, I meant that at one instance in GotM, the word "hell" is used as opposed to "Hood's blank"... and SE admitted that was a mistake, lol

lol....thought you were criticizing my choice of fucking words, ya fucking dragon.

I didnt' know the hell thing was in there. The F-word was brought up a couple times in RG and it kind of surprised me. At least SE didn't bust out the frackin' this and frackin' that like on Battlestar Galactica...LAME.

[Mentalist]

loool... that was one thing i rather liked about "Shadowrun", how they replaced all swears with "Drek".....

Back to topic tho, GotMisms aree nice to have around, b/c we can blame sooo many little discrepancies on htem...

[Dolorous Menhir]

Real GotMisms:

- Tattersail's book of Thyr
- Assassins & Thieves Guilds in Darujhistan
- Ages of several characters, in particular Crone (1000 years)
- Closely related, everything seems to have happened one or two thousand years in the past in GotM. By the time we get to MoI SE has jumped to the hundred of thousands of years scale.
- Already mentioned, Tool's insane ability to stop all magic over a 100 mile radius (seriously, just imagine if the Imass had that power in the later books)
- Tayschrenn's character
- The description of the Sorcery Enfilade at Pale
- The prominence of Chaos as a warren (when has it ever been so important or prevalent again?)
- The repeated use of "T'lan" to refer to pre-Ritual Imass
- Baruk's casual use of magic to open doors, close windows, etc. Has any other character done this since?

I can't think of any others just now, but most of the above can be written off to two factors. The initial entry of the series containing a higher amount of fantasy staples (spell books, assassins guilds) than the later works, and, relatedly, those later works being more developed and written a clear interval of time later.

[Dancer+]

I can offer one or two contentions to your points. Firstly, I think Baruk's ability might derive from his unusual power and the fact he abides in one main place in general, he would have a vested interest in learning/manipulating spells to do this. Many of the other people who could attempt this do not belong in surroundings such as these. Even those who had or have at one point, use other such methods e.g. Perhaps Shadowthrone with his invisibility, random appearing...but this I get the feeling is one of his more recent abilities.

Can't we link the prominence of Chaos in the book to the beginning of the onslaught by the CG and the vulnerability of the seperate threads between warrens. But I largely agree on that point.

There may be explanations for Tay's character and the referring of pre-ritual Imass as T'lan too - Tay's character discrepancy has been discussed loads though and i'm wondering about the context of the other.

Otherwise the list is very good

[Aptorian]

If they weren't such an integral part of the history of the moranth and the way their ammunition was used, I'd also say that the Quorls are a GotM'ism.

Unless they are summoning those things from out of a warren, the existence of such things boggles the mind. Besides the fact that no other "giant" species are left/exist on Wu, how do they multply and eat?

How do you stop Super Dragonflies from just swarming all over the world when they don't have any natural enemies and can probably lay eggs in any lake on Genebackis.

Has that KCCM communication device been used since GotM? in MoI I mean.

[Mentalist]

- The prominence of Chaos as a warren (when has it ever been so important or prevalent again?)

In MoI they mention it... also, might be somthing bout in in DG, regarding the Trygalle taking it.....

[Dolorous Menhir]

The Cult of Dessembrae;223439 said:

I can offer one or two contentions to your points. Firstly, I think Baruk's ability might derive from his unusual power and the fact he abides in one main place in general, he would have a vested interest in learning/manipulating spells to do this. Many of the other people who could attempt this do not belong in surroundings such as these. Even those who had or have at one point, use other such methods e.g. Perhaps Shadowthrone with his invisibility, random appearing...but this I get the feeling is one of his more recent abilities.

Baruk's unusual power? What's unusual? He's a powerful mage, and I don't think there is any special significance to the fact that he owned the windows he would open and close with magic.

I can accept that casually manipulating objects is something that Baruk liked to do and other mages don't, it's just something that is never done by other mages. It's not as if there is a shortage of situations where mages have to manipulate things that are out of their reach.

Quote

Can't we link the prominence of Chaos in the book to the beginning of the onslaught by the CG and the vulnerability of the seperate threads between warrens. But I largely agree on that point.

The Crippled God had nothing to do with it. Puppet Hairlock used Chaos, Quick Ben travelled through Chaos, and in general mages seemed familiar with it as another warren. That's never been the case in the later books, even with Quick Ben.

Even the chaotic magic the Edur used is distinct from the Chaos of GotM.

Quote

There may be explanations for Tay's character and the referring of pre-ritual Imass as T'lan too - Tay's character discrepancy has been discussed loads though and i'm wondering about the context of the other.

The usage of "T'lan" came in the passage in Kruppe's dream, when Silverfox was born. Several different characters refer to the pre-Ritual Imass as the "T'lan", while a pre-Ritual Pran Chole is present. This simply doesn't make any sense, and it just reflects the fact that in GotM it's not clear that "Imass" was the original name of the species and "T'lan" a later addition after the Ritual, so both are used interchangeably to refer to the race.

Aptorian;223441 said:

Has that KCCM communication device been used since GotM? in MoI I mean.

That's a good one. I can't remember if it was ever mentioned in MoI. Whiskeyjack and Dujek were together for almost that whole book, so they didn't have to use it for long distance communication, I suppose.

kud13;223445 said:

- The prominence of Chaos as a warren (when has it ever been so important or prevalent again?)

In MoI they mention it... also, might be somthing bout in in DG, regarding the Trygalle taking it.....

You're probably right, I've more than likely forgotten that.