[Bluerose Rider]

Yes.. it's been a while since i read MoI, "leave him alive, he has earned Dragnipur" I somehow equated with Draconus telling Paran in GoTM that Rake wasn't killing enough with it, and that if Kallor had Dragnipur he would kill more indiscriminately, and thus the gate in KG would be safer. Knowing that Rake meant for him to be inside it and not holding it is much better. Thanks.

[Where is Dassem Ultor?]

Really, the need to start indiscriminately killing is just one of the many reasons that Rake might find it beneficial to go and engage the Edur. Rake seems resigned towards the possibility that Draconus might try to escape Dragnipur, but I doubt in truth that he wants to lose KG to chaos. A few (thousand) Edur souls might go a long way towards sating the needs of the wagon.

[Shadow_God]

Or he could just return to Seguleh Isle, where the entire nation would gladly "volunteer" to enter the sword, after a fashion.
The problem with Rake coming in is that we would then have Rake, Icarium, and Karsa on the same continent, and (if they all challenge Rhulad) IN THE SAME ROOM. Seems like at least one wouldn't walk out, and none of those three characters seem likely to me to get bumped off, they're too interesting.

[sundaymonkey]

Shadow_God;153919 said:

Or he could just return to Seguleh Isle, where the entire nation would gladly "volunteer" to enter the sword, after a fashion.

That they would, but it's not really in Rake's character to commit genocide on a race too stubborn to know when they're (mostly) out of their league. He appears to see Dragnipur as a prison for real Big Bads where they can be put to a good use, and he targets only those who've really pissed him off (personally or through their actions) and/or who are powerful enough to give the Wagon inside the Sword extra impetus.

Shadow_God;153919 said:

The problem with Rake coming in is that we would then have Rake, Icarium, and Karsa on the same continent, and (if they all challenge Rhulad) IN THE SAME ROOM. Seems like at least one wouldn't walk out, and none of those three characters seem likely to me to get bumped off, they're too interesting.

Not necessarily. Karsa and Icarium will be arriving on Lether at the same time, but the Edur are hardly likely to 'take them to their leader' en masse. There must be some kind of system in place for new champions to take on the Emperor, complete with waiting-rooms and hot showers. 8-)

And Rake (should he go after Rhulad, which I think he will) won't exactly be playing by Edur rules. He's not going to wait in line polishing his big, black sword, he's just going to kick the bloody door in and get down to business.

"I am Anomander Rake. You killed (in an anthropomorphic sense whereby 'You' = The Tiste Edur and 'My' = Lots and lots of Tiste Andii") my people. Prepare to die."

And aren't these convergences of multiple powers pretty much par for the course on Wu?

[Thelomen Toblerone]

I'm hoping that Rake arrives and at the same time Scabby is revived, and the two have a massive showdown with Rake kicking arse....

[Xaspian]

I'm sorry. This isn't going to be particularly relevant, or likely to happen at all. But while reading this thread I got a sudden image of Karsa wielding both Dragnipur and Rhulad's sword similtaneously. That was cool, and slightly scary.

But as I said, it's almost definiately not going to happen...

[sundaymonkey]

Thelomen Toblerone;153945 said:

I'm hoping that Rake arrives and at the same time Scabby is revived, and the two have a massive showdown with Rake kicking arse....

Can you imagine the look on Scabby's face if he regains corporeal form only to see Rake advancing towards him with a bloody big sword?

Though it might be more of a moment if Scabby gets to take on Rhulad first. Now wouldn't that put the rest of the Edur in an awfully difficult position?

Civil-War. Whose side are YOU on?:eek:

[sundaymonkey]

Xaspian;153947 said:

I'm sorry. This isn't going to be particularly relevant, or likely to happen at all. But while reading this thread I got a sudden image of Karsa wielding both Dragnipur and Rhulad's sword similtaneously. That was cool, and slightly scary.

But as I said, it's almost definiately not going to happen...

I'm waiting for the scene where Karsa takes on Rhulad, kills him, sees him get up, kills him, sees him get up, kills him, sees him get up....

For 963 pages.

"Ahem. Mr Orlong, your session finished nine hours ago. There are other champions waiting..."

"I am Karsa Orlong of the Teblor, Greyskin. I will stop killing your Emperor when he remembers he is dead and not before. Now, bring in the women, I wish to multitask." :heyhey:

[Onos]

I imagine Karsa would kill him at MOST 3 times. After that he would be smart enough to look for plan B. (i vote for diced Rhulad gulash)

[Battalion]

Forget that, what about raw Rhulad?

I'd like to see the brother come back after being chewed up and digested. And seeing as Karsa's a bit of a boy, I'd like to read the aftermath when he's clinging to the branch of a tree passing Lether gold ... "Witness!"

[Bl1nder]

I'd say Spite kills rhuald, no apperent reason, just wanna be different

[Gimli's love child]

Would Rake go and challenge Rhulad? Rake always struck me as a fairly placid character, he does knock about the place offering tiste andii help where he can and trying to defend the weak but never really makes a direct attack on the opperssor. Otherwise dude could have veered into dragon form with four or five of his buddies and demolished laseen at anytime.

I think me old mucker Rake may try to help rhulad and the remaints of the tiste edur, lets not forget that the tiste edur of the present age are not as they once were and are under the influence of the CG. If Rhulad cant be killed (personally i dont think dragnipur would do the trick, just seems to obvious) then the stopping the CG is the only way to bring and end to Rhulad.

Also if Scabby get released he'll be heading straight for the CG as he abducted his people. All in all you could be looking at all of Mummy darks wee fellas setting aside their differnces to beat up some old codger in a tent.

[Aptorian]

Gimli said:

Would Rake go and challenge Rhulad? Rake always struck me as a fairly placid character, he does knock about the place offering tiste andii help where he can and trying to defend the weak but never really makes a direct attack on the opperssor. Otherwise dude could have veered into dragon form with four or five of his buddies and demolished laseen at anytime.

Actually this is, in my opinion, the biggest flaw in the entire Malazan story. With the exeception of the CG himself there hasnt been a single problem in the story that couldnt have been settled in a blink of a second if one or two ascendants put their heads together... roughly.

Caladan brood could have stepped out of a warren 2 miles from Malaz city and smacked his hammer in the ground and the empress along with the empire would be gone.

ST, The Rope or The seven hounds could have ripped the apocalypse into red mist, if not when it was controlled by dryjhna, then why not now when the CG is influencing them.

Rake, along with a squad of say two dozen Andii warrior mages, could have popped out of KG in the middle of the Panion Domin and made a full unveiling. Pretty much creating the effect of a 200 megaton bomb.

Mael could have hick-upped and there would be no edur left (he admits to the same).

The only thing that seems to limit SE's powerfull personaes, are the ellaborate restrictions hinted at here or there. One second they are described as ancient monsters of terrible power and the next they are fusing over the loss of a single life.

Dont get me wrong I love the story and the entire universe but... tsk tsk, Silly demi-gods.

[Bl1nder]

Gimli said:

Would Rake go and challenge Rhulad? Rake always struck me as a fairly placid character, he does knock about the place offering tiste andii help where he can and trying to defend the weak but never really makes a direct attack on the opperssor. Otherwise dude could have veered into dragon form with four or five of his buddies and demolished laseen at anytime.

I think me old mucker Rake may try to help rhulad and the remaints of the tiste edur, lets not forget that the tiste edur of the present age are not as they once were and are under the influence of the CG. If Rhulad cant be killed (personally i dont think dragnipur would do the trick, just seems to obvious) then the stopping the CG is the only way to bring and end to Rhulad.

Also if Scabby get released he'll be heading straight for the CG as he abducted his people. All in all you could be looking at all of Mummy darks wee fellas setting aside their differnces to beat up some old codger in a tent.

I agree, however, Rake might try to help the edur, but the question is will the EDUR want that help? Remember they think that the Andii have betrayed them, and they hate them with passion. They would prolly think this is gonna turn out to be another betrayal.

And apt, think about this, power draws power, whats to say that when Brood pops out near the malazan capitol, and is about to use his hammer, say oponn appear behaind him, they both giggle,he slips and the hammer hits him on the head ?

And Rake not appearing in the middle of domin, the Seer has his counter magic, he is very powerfull, and a full unvealing requires time, least I think so

[Shadow_God]

Aptorian, I think that one of the reasons Rake and Brood are still alive is that they DON'T do things like that. One of the themes running through the series seems to be that unleashing massive power will draw other powers to you, leading to convergence and absolute devastation. Rake is cautious, Brood also (when he isn't pissed as all hell at Kruppe).
That's actually what differentiates the sucessful ascendants from the ones who get taken down, isn't it? Raest, the Trohlbarahl, the two hounds who face Karsa, Karsa himself (at the beginning), all the other powers which we see taken down by the Deadhouse or other forces...they are all confident in their strength, sure than no one can match them, willing to act like the gods which they are convinced they are. And so they fall. And Rake and Brood smile and go back to playing subtler games.