[Sparkimus]

We're just keeping the thread alive since NO ONE TALKED ABOUT FOOTBALL IN SO LONG. Fantasy is great tho, gets you involved with much more football. Without it all I would care about are my Bucs and the rest of their division...Now I watch as many games as humanly possible every week.

[amphibian]

Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Dec 12 2008, 09:01 PM, said:

Fantasy football is ruining the sport. I hate it.

I think it is/was an element in the oh-so-necessary liberation of fans from the faux-tribalism pushed upon us by advertisers and fat cats. Now a significant amount of people do not care which team wins, only that a good game is played and that interesting things happen.

[Slum]

Amphibian, you said it better than I could have. Truer words were never spoken.


Cheers to Amphibian!

[Sparkimus]

I'm still looking for that rep button amphibian, but when I find it...

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

amphibian, on Dec 13 2008, 05:57 PM, said:

Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Dec 12 2008, 09:01 PM, said:

Fantasy football is ruining the sport. I hate it.

I think it is/was an element in the oh-so-necessary liberation of fans from the faux-tribalism pushed upon us by advertisers and fat cats. Now a significant amount of people do not care which team wins, only that a good game is played and that interesting things happen.

But that's not a good thing! Who wants a sport where no one actually roots for anyone? Instead of people supporting a team, they are only obsessed with stats of individuals. If I wanted to obsess over stats, I'd watch baseball. You hear people crying all thee time about players who don't treat it like a team game and create a me-first culture in the NFL. Fantasy does nothing but perpetuate this problem, and make FANS think the same way! "Oh, a team I've rooted against my whole life beat the shit out of my favorite team, but I had their RB who got me 50 points, so I'm happy!" Bah.

The "faux-tribalism" wasn't pushed on the public by advertisers and fat cats, it organically arose from people rooting for their hometeams, and from being introduced to the sport watching games with your dad. Granted, rivalry games are hyped up by the media, but they are taking advantage of people having strong feelings for teams, not creating those feelings.

FF is changing the way people watch football for the worse. A perfect example is this girl I know who loves football. As is proper, she hates everything about the Pats. Problem is, in the fantasy draft, she got New England's QB, RB, main receiver, TE, and kicker. Now she's rooting for the Pats to do well, even though she professes to still hate them. She says she would love to see them put up 50 points and give up 51 every week. I call bullshit, she's turned into a pats fan because of fantasy.

Which is better, to put up a stellar individual performance in a losing effort, or have an average game in a winning outing? According to old-school, traditional, good football values, getting the win as a team at the cost of one person's individual glory is better. This new football culture (perpetuated both by the worst kind of player and fantasy players) shuns team values and glorifies nothing but a big individual game, with more concern for a big individual game than teamwork leading to a solid. It sucks.

It has been said in this thread that this new style of fandom is better, as it makes people only care about seeing a good game. Once again, I call bullshit. I've watched a lot of fooball with fantasy players, and in general they don't care about a game at all, no matter how good it is, if they or their weekly opponent doesn't have any players in the game. If they do have a player in the game, no matter how good the game is they are typically incapable of realizing that or enjoying the game if their player isn't putting up gaudy stats.

So, that's the brief rundown on why I'm not a fan of fantasy ball.

[Sparkimus]

A lot of that is valid RLY. But aside from people rooting for individual players, I find myself watching more games in general, regardless of if I have a player on my team or not.

The way I get around the "fan for a teams that's not your own" is I NEVER draft anyone on the Bucs, nor will I play anyone that might be playing them if I can avoid it. For me, fantasy always comes second to my team.

But I can see where you're coming from.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Fair enough.

[Thelomen Toblerone]

I dont agree, I think FF is the same as it is for the Premier League int he UK (soccer). Now Im a mad Arsenal fan, been to hundreds of matches, never miss them if they're on TV unless I can humanly help it. Every day I check the team news and talk about them in 60% of my conversations. And I love football (soccer) too. But there are still plenty of god awful games I would not watch in a month of sundays. Something like Bolton vs Middlesborough, ouch.

Thanks to FF though, I often find I have a player in action, which notches up my interest just enough to make me watch the game, and often Im glad I did, as something great could happen.

For me it's the same for NFL. Im not hugely familiar with all the players, and I find FF ensures I pay more attention to every game and learn more and more each week. I've always been a fan of the Broncos, with a soft spot for the Falcons, but without FF I'd never really have bothered watching things like Seattle vs Detroit if they came on. Now I understand the game (more orless), know plenty of players and benefit from having any real attatchment to a specific team, as I'll watch all the games with equal interest. Even PATs games, so I can cheer for whoever they're playing.

Any who - PRO BOWL.

What do you guys think of all the choices?

Im surprised Favre made it, I wouldnt say he's been spectacular this season, I'd say Pennington and Rivers have had better seasons, Rivers is overlooked because he plays for the Chargers, who have been a bit crap.

Im amazed Trent Cole didnt make it though, I figured he was a shoe in, I thinks he's a really good player and the stats back up my opinion - top defensive lineman for tackles, and 8 sacks too. Most times I've seen the Eagles play he's stood out, so for him not to make the pro bowl is big.

This post has been edited by Thelomen Toblerone: 17 December 2008 - 09:34 PM

[HoosierDaddy]

Dallas Clark deserved to go to the Pro Bowl... but that doesn't matter, it is a shill for players who have been in the league and our past their prime for all too many of the selections.

On another note... GO COLTS!

[Sparkimus]

I would agree with you about Clark had he been as good as he is now throughout the entire season. IMHO a slow start means no Pro Bowl.

And no, Favre shouldn't be in it at all. With LT not doing shit all year, Rivers carried the entire team.

[HoosierDaddy]

Statistically Rivers is having an outstanding year. The Charger's struggles probably hurt him, as well as Favre's "legend" helping him. About Clark, he dissappears in some games, but... I mean, look at the receiver's around him. The Chargers and Chiefs TE's are their primary receiving threat, unlike Clark.

This post has been edited by HoosierDaddy: 20 December 2008 - 01:45 AM

[Daser]

I think most of the pick are good or can atleast be defended well.


Only the QB picks are wierd. Seems more like popularity contest than judged on performances.

I wouldnt have picked either Favre or Eli Manning if i was to decide.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

I will be at the Jets game tomorrow! Go Bert Fever and the New York Packers!

[Grumble]

Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Dec 21 2008, 04:32 AM, said:

I will be at the Jets game tomorrow! Go Bert Fever and the New York Packers!

Bert who ???? ........ owned by 5' 9'' CB Josh Wilson 2 INT's & a sack !!!

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

It was a sad game. The Jets, I think, just aren't a great team. They almost gave up many more sacks. Still a faint hope for the playoffs though.

[Slum]

Raymond Luxury Yacht, on Dec 22 2008, 06:57 PM, said:

It was a sad game. The Jets, I think, just aren't a great team. They almost gave up many more sacks. Still a faint hope for the playoffs though.

How do you feel about the "Fire Mangini" rhetoric from Bayliss and A. Smith on 1st and 10 today? Bayliss is such a Favre-lover it's ridiculous.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

It was a poorly called game. I don't know if it requires Mangini getting fired though.

[Tremolo]

DEFENCE DEFENCE - Go Ravens!

[Thelomen Toblerone]

Wow, that Packers Bears game was tense, what a ST performance!

But Orton is shit. Yes, he may have nice facial hair, but he's just piss poor. That Bears defence deserves a semi-competent offence to complement it. If they dont pick up a WR or QB as their first round pick, they're mental.

[Slum]

Holy Shit! Broncos fired Shanahan! Didn't see that one coming...

Welcome to the ranks of the unemployed, Mike. Though I doubt he'll be out of a job for long....

This post has been edited by Slumgullion Spitteler: 30 December 2008 - 11:09 PM