[Dolorous Menhir]

I think the extremely young age of Fiddler given in GotM prologue is not consistent with the rest of the series.

If he was in his early 20's then, that puts him in his thirties in the main series. That just doesn't seem to agree with the fame and respect he is accorded, and his long long military experience. If you just read HoC you would think him a much older man, at least in his 50's.

He is a contemporary of Gesler, Whiskeyjack (they grew up together), Braven Tooth (who he named!). None of these are young men.

Paran is 20-something. He was a boy perhaps almost in his teens in or just into them in the GotM prologue, which makes him 22-25 in the main series. There's no reason to doubt this, it's clearly stated he advanced in rank fast because of his noble station, not due to experience or hard work.

[Onos]

Ok, so my point that Fiddler is old and soon to be 'useless' stands. Cant see him having much more 'purpose/drive' in life other than being put out to pasture either in Malaz, back in Daru or under X feet of dirt.

(note: saying this not because i dont like him but i cant see him continuing to run around in other series having this grand purpose)

P.S At least SE cant kill everyone all at once.

[philospher77]

Onos;108829 said:

I agree that Fiddler feels far older than he is, but Fiddler is pretty 'old guard'. He is buddies with Braven Tooth, Gesler, Stormy etc... not a young fellow in my opinion. GoM? Could be an GoMism. Do you have the quote or do i need to dig it up at home?

How old is Paran?

From the Prologue: Another Bridgeburner, this one with a broken, scorched fiddle strapped to his back, came up to the commander. He was wiry and if anything younger - only a few years older than Ganoes himself, who was twelve.

And in the next few paragraphs, he sounds a lot older than the 15 or so he seems to be, talking about the people down in the Mouse being "untested" and that some of them are "following other people's orders".

Oh heck... let me just type out the rest:
Strange pockmarks covered his face and the backs of his hands, and his armor was a mixture of foreign accoutrements over a threadbare, stained uniform. A shortsword hung in a cracked wooden scabbard at his hip. He leaned against the merlon beside the other man with the ease of long familiarity.

.... skipping the paragraphs about the mage cadre losing control...

The soldier grunted. "They are all new, untested. This could scar some of them forever. Besides," he added, "more than a few down there are following someone else's orders."

"A suspicion, no more."

"The proof's right there" the other man said. "In the Mouse."

"Perhaps."

"You're too protective," the man said. "Surly says it's your greatest weakness."

"Surly's the Emperor's concern, not mine."

A second grunt answered that. "Maybe all of us before too long."

The commander was silent, slowly turning to study his companion.

==============

Now, keep in mind that Fiddler was just described as "a few years older than Ganoes", who is twelve. And yet he is talking at this stage like someone much older than that. And apparently already is respected enough to be on rather friendly personal terms with Whiskeyjack. So I'm not entirely convinced that it's a GotMism.

[Aptorian]

Let's just point out one of the biggest inconsistencies in MBotF - Time!

The date's are all screwed up and the same seems to be the case with the BB's. Fiddler and WJ were supposed to have saved Dunsparrow from becoming an acolyte of Hood when they were younger, supposedly before they joined the army and WJ was a mason. But in MoI WJ says that when Dunsparrow was just about 12 (or something) she ran away from home (to marry a king)and he never saw her again Next thing you now she's a military commander in Y'Ghatan - how did that happen? And she doesn't seem to be much more than in her 20's.

Mean while WJ seemed to have joined with the last generation of the old guard, Dassem and Tay, so that means he's been doing that stuff for a long time. Also remember when WJ was under Dassem he was just a captain or something likewise. That's still a while off from becoming a High Fist of the empire and then being bumped back down again to sergeant.

It's implied that even though they seem all unfamiliar in the company of others that Fiddler and WJ know each other well, but if you want to believe WJ's own memories, he didn't learn to know Fiddler before they went on the hunting trip through Raraku to catch Quick Ben.

I don't think even when a encyclopedia with a timeline comes out that it will all fit together.

My personal opinion is - who cares?

[Onos]

Good work on typing that out.

For me the key word is 'appeared'. Does fiddler have good genetics, or he slight stature or something else? I tend skim over the desciptions (probably more than i should) so that i put a lot more weight on perceived age than actual. SE tends to leave his 'age' definers to OTHER people's descriptions which can cut him lots of slack.

Fiddler strikes me as a veteran who has been around a long time. At a minimum he is in his 30s, though he is probably older, and that was the argument/point i was making at the time. (although fairly irrelevant to me he could be using some alchemy or starting to ascend for all we know) Age means a fair amount less in the Malaz world as it does in other places.

[Folken]

WJ wasn't a captain. He was a commander of the Bridgeburners, they were an entire company, their own army so to speak.

[phart]

Onos;108863 said:

Ok, so my point that Fiddler is old and soon to be 'useless' stands. Cant see him having much more 'purpose/drive' in life other than being put out to pasture either in Malaz, back in Daru or under X feet of dirt.

(note: saying this not because i dont like him but i cant see him continuing to run around in other series having this grand purpose)

P.S At least SE cant kill everyone all at once.

IN DG when talking to Kimlock, Fiddler says he has been fighting imperial wars for 15 years, and he hasn't tfought them with his eyes closed.

[Coldnight]

I'd say that characters who were already dead/almost dead/reborn are safe (or just much more safer). This would include characters like Paran, Quick Ben, Toc/Anaster, Tehol and more...

...on the other hand, someone might say that this didn't work for all Minala's children... well, poor children :Erm:.

[Blind]

I think that Paran might die at the end of the series. He did die once already, but that was back in book one. It doesn't make him safer from death, since he played his part as Master of the Deck in between.

Now, I would hate it if Toc or Tehol died. I invested a lot of emotion into their death/near death, and I very well hope that they are safe now!

I suspect that Karsa will die, perhaps when Calm comes back to fulfill her promise. I'm afraid that Rake will go as well.

Who will not die : Burn, Kruppe and Pust (probably)

[Onos]

Burn dying could be amusing. At some point in the future have SE write a trilogy and on page 50 of book 2 burns dies... the rest of book is just random filler.

Blind: Why would Kruppe and Pust be safe?

[Blind]

I guess there is no real reason why Kruppe or Pust should not die. They are comic characters, though, and I can't picture them dying tragically.

[tiam]

Apt;109005 said:

Let's just point out one of the biggest inconsistencies in MBotF - Time!

The date's are all screwed up and the same seems to be the case with the BB's. Fiddler and WJ were supposed to have saved Dunsparrow from becoming an acolyte of Hood when they were younger, supposedly before they joined the army and WJ was a mason. But in MoI WJ says that when Dunsparrow was just about 12 (or something) she ran away from home (to marry a king)and he never saw her again Next thing you now she's a military commander in Y'Ghatan - how did that happen? And she doesn't seem to be much more than in her 20's.

Mean while WJ seemed to have joined with the last generation of the old guard, Dassem and Tay, so that means he's been doing that stuff for a long time. Also remember when WJ was under Dassem he was just a captain or something likewise. That's still a while off from becoming a High Fist of the empire and then being bumped back down again to sergeant.

It's implied that even though they seem all unfamiliar in the company of others that Fiddler and WJ know each other well, but if you want to believe WJ's own memories, he didn't learn to know Fiddler before they went on the hunting trip through Raraku to catch Quick Ben.

I don't think even when a encyclopedia with a timeline comes out that it will all fit together.

My personal opinion is - who cares?

Though is it actually Dunsparrow who he means? Tha little banshee in MOI. I assumed it was Dunsparrow but is that who he meant. I find it unlikely as he says i was 15 and she was 6 or something relative to that so say WJ 60 now shed be like 50 and wouldnt be doing Leoman. Just a thoguht.

Also in DG Fiddler says hes been campaigning for 15 years so i always assumed late 30s. Remembe old in these days is 50 for the bog standard man or woman. Also Fiddler isnt past his prime so to speak. He doesnt feel old because he went through an azath/member of the BB. Also Kalam notes how young he looks in BH meaning Kalams older than him.

[Dolorous Menhir]

Tiam, the WJ/Dunsparrow/Fiddler timelines are totally screwed up. It's best to just not think about them, I don't think SE will even attempt to address such concerns in later novels.

[The Rope]

I say trull cuz he should be dead by now, but Isn't... And Paran can't die neither, or I will seriouslty injure... someone... or something...

[Yasnian]

I agree. If Paran dies SE is going to receive a really nasty letter.